Dylan McIlrath

[KaseMeOutside]

the ignorant posts about fowler are laughable, you have to consider the ducks are a totally inept offensive team and you have to also consider fowler has to play with one of the worst defensemen in the entire league.

i have been a fowler critic in the past but he has been extremely good this year, you have to watch him handle forechecking pressure, and how he reads plays. this is not going to show up in any stat.

it's really easy to see who the people are that have no clue.

 

[Brewins]

No they don't, but almost no D get thrown into their first NHL games when they are turning 24 and then end up being top pairing D...

Boychuck, Johnny didn't play in the show for a while. Colorado even tried him as a winger for a few games.

 

[nbwingsfan]

Boychuck, Johnny didn't play in the show for a while. Colorado even tried him as a winger for a few games.

So one example? Boychuck was also the AHL D of the year the season before making the NHL top.. McIlrath was never close to that.

 

[Ola]

Uhh?

If McIlrath is becoming a "special player" does that make Adam Larsson and Damon Severson legendary?

I think maybe you mean that he is becoming a useful player in this league

Come on.

I have no clue what fair and objective meaning the word "special player" have. You get what I mean, don't you?

Maybe if I add "for the New York Rangers" you cannot misinterpret it.

Chris Neil have been a very special player for Ottawa. He has played like 15 years for them. Every time you face Ottawa, at least up until very lately, they have often been harder to play against because Neil have been dressed by them.

5 years after the year Neil was drafted, he wasn't anything special. Lets say people around that time were comparing Chris Neil to say for example Milan Kraft, who was scoring at a decent rate for a young offensive kid at the time and looked OK, very few would have thought that Neil was more valuable than Kraft.

McIlrath has not done -- anything -- in his career so far. That does not mean that he have to have had a useless career when everything is said and done 15-20 years from now.

I am old enough to remember Brooks Orpik when he was a young player in this league. He was definitely not anything special when he was 22-23 y/o. He mostly started to be widely recognized when Pittsburgh went deep in the POs around 07-09 when he was closing in on his 30s. Just after Orpik was picked in the 1st round, a young kid named Alexander Frolov was picked by LAK. Frolov played 1 year in Russia and then went to LA and instantly did pretty well. Peaked at 70 pts in 80 games a few years later. NOBODY, would even remotely have claimed that Orpik was a better pick than Frolov looooooooonng after that draft. Then Frolov went downhill really fast. Now, anyone would argue that Orpik had a better career than Frolov.

If McIlrath can become a top 4-5 D for NYR the coming 10-15 years, being one of the top 3 most intimidating players in the league, keep being a great character on and off the ice, doing a fairly good job on the ice, it would be very valuable for the NYR organization.

And he definitely have that potential.

 

[Ola]

So one example? Boychuck was also the AHL D of the year the season before making the NHL top.. McIlrath was never close to that.

If you have a hard time coming up with examples of defenders in the NHL who wasn't something special when they were 23-24 y/o's and then became good NHLers, you shouldn't spend time in a thread like this.

I would say that the above is true for MOST better defenders in this league the last 20-30 years lol. IE as in more than half.

 

[haveandare]

the ignorant posts about fowler are laughable, you have to consider the ducks are a totally inept offensive team and you have to also consider fowler has to play with one of the worst defensemen in the entire league.

i have been a fowler critic in the past but he has been extremely good this year, you have to watch him handle forechecking pressure, and how he reads plays. this is not going to show up in any stat.

it's really easy to see who the people are that have no clue.

Much of the same stuff can be said for McI except that his partner is good. But notice that the people who are saying he's been solid are NYR fans and fans of teams who have recently played against NYR. It's easy to see who isn't watching him or hasn't watched him. He's been very solid. I'm sure he'll dip a bit at some point like everyone does, the question is what he'll look like when he's down and how long it'll last.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Come on.

I have no clue what fair and objective meaning the word "special player" have. You get what I mean, don't you?

Maybe if I add "for the New York Rangers" you cannot misinterpret it.

Chris Neil have been a very special player for Ottawa. He has played like 15 years for them. Every time you face Ottawa, at least up until very lately, they have often been harder to play against because Neil have been dressed by them.

5 years after the year Neil was drafted, he wasn't anything special. Lets say people around that time were comparing Chris Neil to say for example Milan Kraft, who was scoring at a decent rate for a young offensive kid at the time and looked OK, very few would have thought that Neil was more valuable than Kraft.

McIlrath has not done -- anything -- in his career so far. That does not mean that he have to have had a useless career when everything is said and done 15-20 years from now.

I am old enough to remember Brooks Orpik when he was a young player in this league. He was definitely not anything special when he was 22-23 y/o. He mostly started to be widely recognized when Pittsburgh went deep in the POs around 07-09 when he was closing in on his 30s. Just after Orpik was picked in the 1st round, a young kid named Alexander Frolov was picked by LAK. Frolov played 1 year in Russia and then went to LA and instantly did pretty well. Peaked at 70 pts in 80 games a few years later. NOBODY, would even remotely have claimed that Orpik was a better pick than Frolov looooooooonng after that draft. Then Frolov went downhill really fast. Now, anyone would argue that Orpik had a better career than Frolov.

If McIlrath can become a top 4-5 D for NYR the coming 10-15 years, being one of the top 3 most intimidating players in the league, keep being a great character on and off the ice, doing a fairly good job on the ice, it would be very valuable for the NYR organization.

And he definitely have that potential.

Why do you think in 10-15 years he'd be either a top 4 defenseman or one of the top 3 most intimidating players?

 

[Spazkat]

I think whoever is doing some of these McIlrath > Fowler comparisons might be the same person who convinced the Pens that the Lovejoy/Despres trade was a good plan.

This must be what its like to go to one of those flat earth society meetings. Like I've entered a twilight zone of some sort

 

[nbducksfan19]

If im NY Rangers GM and am offered Fowler for McIlrath, I immediately accept and then watch as Ducks GM immediately gets fired. Then I call the new Ducks GM and offer to trade Fowler back to the Ducks for McIlrath + 1st or top Prospect.

 

[nbwingsfan]

If you have a hard time coming up with examples of defenders in the NHL who wasn't something special when they were 23-24 y/o's and then became good NHLers, you shouldn't spend time in a thread like this.

I would say that the above is true for MOST better defenders in this league the last 20-30 years lol. IE as in more than half.

Still waiting for you to give me these countless examples of Dmen who played their rookie season when they were turning 24 and ended up being top pairing D like many Rangers fans think he becomes. If there are so many then please list them.

 

[Rangers ftw]

Still waiting for you to give me these countless examples of Dmen who played their rookie season when they were turning 24 and ended up being top pairing D like many Rangers fans think he becomes. If there are so many then please list them.

Not many thinks he's gonna be a top pairing D. Second pairing guy would be great.

 

[nbwingsfan]

Not many thinks he's gonna be a top paring D. Second pairing guy would be great.

You may not think so, but there are plenty of posters in here calling him a future #2/3D.

 

[Ola]

Still waiting for you to give me these countless examples of Dmen who played their rookie season when they were turning 24 and ended up being top pairing D like many Rangers fans think he becomes. If there are so many then please list them.

Lol, there are quit many examples of this. If we go back 20 years, i wonder if I couldn't top 50 names.

At some point, I remember how a large majority of the top scoring Ds were nothing at the age of 23-24. It takes time for Ds to develop. The current generation of Doughty, Hedman, Karlsson and co are kind of an exception. It was more common a while back.

 

[nbducksfan19]

Lol, there are quit many examples of this. If we go back 20 years, i wonder if I couldn't top 50 names.

At some point, I remember how a large majority of the top scoring Ds were nothing at the age of 23-24. It takes time for Ds to develop. The current generation of Doughty, Hedman, Karlsson and co are kind of an exception. It was more common a while back.

and wouldn't logic tell you that there is a reason it in no longer "common".

 

[aufheben]

You may not think so, but there are plenty of posters in here calling him a future #2/3D.

And the only argument I've seen against that is that he's 23. No one has said anything about his actual play. What are the actual reasons Dylan McIlrath can't develop into a top-4 defenseman?

 

[nbwingsfan]

Lol, there are quit many examples of this. If we go back 20 years, i wonder if I couldn't top 50 names.

At some point, I remember how a large majority of the top scoring Ds were nothing at the age of 23-24. It takes time for Ds to develop. The current generation of Doughty, Hedman, Karlsson and co are kind of an exception. It was more common a while back.

So who are they then? Let's see if the 4th time I ask will be when you answer.

And the only argument I've seen against that is that he's 23. No one has said anything about his actual play. What are the actual reasons Dylan McIlrath can't develop into a top-4 defenseman?

He's turning 24 this season and it's his rookie year. He has never been the top D at any league below then NHL and has a career high of 24 points, and that was in Junior. He has no offensive game to speak of and there are no current examples I can think of in the NHL who were not outstanding in the AHL finally making it to the NHL at 23/24 and turning into top pairing/2nd pairing anchor D's. Maybe sometime he can develop into a number 4/5 that can fill in the second pairing if absolutely needed, but don't see anymore than that.

Sorry I don't see McIlrath being the exception and becoming a top pairing D.

 

[BroadwayJay*]

And the only argument I've seen against that is that he's 23. No one has said anything about his actual play. What are the actual reasons Dylan McIlrath can't develop into a top-4 defenseman?

There is a difference between can't and isn't likely to, don't you think?

I mean, some folks were saying he's going to score 30 points in the NHL when he was unable to produce at that level even in junior.

There is a lot of hyperbole that is distracting from the issues. He doesn't have a track record of scoring points, top pairing guys generally score points. To me, that's the biggest detraction.

That doesn't mean he won't have a successful NHL career by any stretch. It also doesn't mean he won't be the exception. But to be saying he's going to be regularly scoring 30 points in the NHL (as someone said several pages back) when he's never scored 25 even in junior is just pretty unlikely.

Someone else said (this is paraphrase) that if he can turn into a second-pairing partner for Yandle and not be a possession black hole that they'd be happy. To me, that's a much more reasonable position.

I can't think of anyone who scored so few points in junior and then went on to score more points in the NHL. I understand pie in the sky hopes and dreams and I understand high-end and low-end projections, but certain unprecedented productivity projections are just so unlikely as to be unreasonable. This is especially true when spoken in terms of obvious fact, as some have done.

FINALLY, this is a thread about a guy who has played 12 NHL games, and 164 EV minutes, nearly all of which paired with an elite defenseman. This thread is so premature as to be inviable.

 

[aufheben]

There is a difference between can't and isn't likely to, don't you think?

I mean, some folks were saying he's going to score 30 points in the NHL when he was unable to produce at that level even in junior.

There is a lot of hyperbole that is distracting from the issues. He doesn't have a track record of scoring points, top pairing guys generally score points. To me, that's the biggest detraction.

That doesn't mean he won't have a successful NHL career by any stretch. It also doesn't mean he won't be the exception. But to be saying he's going to be regularly scoring 30 points in the NHL (as someone said several pages back) when he's never scored 25 even in junior is just pretty unlikely.

Someone else said (this is paraphrase) that if he can turn into a second-pairing partner for Yandle and not be a possession black hole that they'd be happy. To me, that's a much more reasonable position.

I can't think of anyone who scored so few points in junior and then went on to score more points in the NHL. I understand pie in the sky hopes and dreams and I understand high-end and low-end projections, but certain unprecedented productivity projections are just so unlikely as to be unreasonable. This is especially true when spoken in terms of obvious fact, as some have done.

FINALLY, this is a thread about a guy who has played 12 NHL games, and 164 EV minutes, nearly all of which paired with an elite defenseman. This thread is so premature as to be inviable.

His lack of production is a fine argument, although I don't think you need it to be a top-4 defenseman.

Using his age against him is silly IMO. He's 23 and had injury issues.

Most of us would be fine with him becoming a 2nd pairing defensemen with his skillset, I don't know who said he'll be a #1/#2 defenseman but I probably just missed it.

 

[BroadwayJay*]

His lack of production is a fine argument, although I don't think you need it to be a top-4 defenseman.

Yes, that's true. You don't need that production to be a second-pairing defenseman of value. Or at least you shouldn't.

To be a top-pairing defenseman, other than a very select group of super elite defensive players, you do need those points.

Primarily, my issue is with someone projecting him to be a 30 point player (or possibly MORE!!!) when he's never achieved that an any level. That's just not very likely. That, and the small sample size.

Although he's getting a shot with someone else tonight (Staal, I think), so this should be an interesting test for the oversized, underscoring, overcorsid young man.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Much of the same stuff can be said for McI except that his partner is good. But notice that the people who are saying he's been solid are NYR fans and fans of teams who have recently played against NYR. It's easy to see who isn't watching him or hasn't watched him. He's been very solid. I'm sure he'll dip a bit at some point like everyone does, the question is what he'll look like when he's down and how long it'll last.

i like mcilrath and have been wanting him to succeed he got an unfair wrap based on where he was chosen but there's alot of stupid posts about fowler here

 

[Machinehead]

I think whoever is doing some of these McIlrath > Fowler comparisons might be the same person who convinced the Pens that the Lovejoy/Despres trade was a good plan.

This must be what its like to go to one of those flat earth society meetings. Like I've entered a twilight zone of some sort

Actually Despres has significantly better advanced stats so no, that's the opposite.

 

[Classicnamesup]

I assume I'm not the only one who feels like they are taking crazy pills when they read NYR fans comparing this guy to Fowler.

 

[Machinehead]

I assume I'm not the only one who feels like they are taking crazy pills when they read NYR fans comparing this guy to Fowler.

I can see why everyone would take Fowler at this point but I don't see what makes Fowler so special that it's unattainable for McIlrath. He's no Norris winner.

 

[nbwingsfan]

I can see why everyone would take Fowler at this point but I don't see what makes Fowler so special that it's unattainable for McIlrath. He's no Norris winner.

And McIlrath has only played 14 games as an NHL player. It's not even remotely close at this point.

 

[FLYLine27*]

BOOM. First goal of his career. BULLET