Does Murray's trade to Ottawa set the goalie market

[34]

Double post. Deleted

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Not sure how this unfolds, but one of the options of moving Andersen with no cash coming back got removed yesterday. I guess we could still move him for 2021 picks as a means of not taking cap back.

 

[GordieHoweHatTrick]

Not sure how this unfolds, but one of the options of moving Andersen with no cash coming back got removed yesterday. I guess we could still move him for 2021 picks as a means of not taking cap back.

And another opened up with New Jersey buying out Corey Schneider.

Me thinks some of the dominoes may fall after Braden Holtby/Jakob Markstrom sign and at what price. Because after those two, the remaining FA goalies are either question marks or have really short shelf lives.

 

[Leafsfan74]

To me, it looks more and more like we keep Andersen. That kind of return is meh, especially when you add in the risk factor with a replacement, I suspect we go with the “devil we know”. I get not having confidence Andersen can get us there, he probably walks, but man Dubas puts his ass on the line if he gets the crease wrong. There has to be enormous trepidation here.

It depends on what the end game is.

If it's to open up cap space to help them seal the deal on the team they want, all options have to be considered.

Look, I like Freddy. The reality is, he is a free agent after this year, and, as a team they simply haven't made the necessary growth steps that eventual Cup teams make. Something has to give and it has to be more than Kappy IMO. It should have been done at last years All-Star game if we are objective.

I'd say Andersen and Nylander should be the top two options. Simply because of the value they have. A trade, for instance, of a draft pick alone, can't be looked at as the draft pick, but also who Leafs acquire with that free cap space. THAT would be the return (be it a Gudas or whomever + say a Second Rounder).

 

[HoweHullOrr]

And another opened up with New Jersey buying out Corey Schneider.

Me thinks some of the dominoes may fall after Braden Holtby/Jakob Markstrom sign and at what price. Because after those two, the remaining FA goalies are either question marks or have really short shelf lives.

There's still a decent batch of free agent tenders after Holtby & Markstrom.

Crawford, Smith, Khudobin, Greiss, Georgiev, Dell, Lundqvist, Talbot. Arizona & Columbus wants to move one of their tenders. That's 12, so seems like the supply side could be bigger than demand - idk? I'm thinking some will end up with short duration contracts as well given flat cap & market conditions, so there could be some competition for Freddie in the short, stop gap solution area as well.

 

[Leafsfan74]

There's still a decent batch of free agent tenders after Holtby & Markstrom.

Crawford, Smith, Khudobin, Greiss, Georgiev, Dell, Lundqvist, Talbot. Arizona & Columbus wants to move one of their tenders. That's 12, so seems like the supply side could be bigger than demand - idk? I'm thinking some will end up with short duration contracts as well given flat cap & market conditions, so there could be some competition for Freddie in the short, stop gap solution area as well.

One big difference. Andersen is only owed $1M for this year ($5M cap hit). That's a big deal for those looking to increase cap while keeping costs down (on say, a team needing to hit the basement value).

A one year rental at that price for a goalie that good, has to be ideal for any stop-gap situation. 1 year removed from an All-Star appearance.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

One big difference. Andersen is only owed $1M for this year ($5M cap hit). That's a big deal for those looking to increase cap while keeping costs down (on say, a team needing to hit the basement value).

A one year rental at that price for a goalie that good, has to be ideal for any stop-gap situation. 1 year removed from an All-Star appearance.

Oh, that's definitely a feature or advantage for looking at Freddie.

On the other hand, with this amount of decent goalies available, teams needing to address a requirement for a tender for more than a year can probably find a deal among the multiple tenders that are available. Not sure how many GMs just think about just the current year and neglect everything beyond that. I don't know how much of an omen the last 2 days were, but we didn't find a solution that moved Freddie for 2020 draft picks.

 

[Tak7]

My three thoughts after seeing the Murray trade:

• If Murray, without a contract, is worth a 2nd + prospect, then Freddie, with 1 more year at just $1million of actual salary, is worth much more than that
• If Murray, a 26 year old 2-time cup winner, can only get you a 2nd + mid-tier prospect, the goalie market isn't really as hot as we all think it is.
• The reason Andersen will be in net for the Leafs to start the 2020/2021 season (whenever that may be), is because Dubas tried to trade him and couldn't find anyone willing to meet the Leafs' asking price.

 

[Stephen]

Just partially joking here but doesn’t Matt Murray look like one of the oldest 20 somethings out there?

 

[moon111]

Personally I think Toronto's goaltending is set. The biggest problem is Andersen's style doesn't really seem to create too many dramatic acrobat stylish saves. He'll stop a couple of almost sure goals and nobody is thinking anything of it but when one sneaks through, it's considered the end of the world. He played 5 games, let in 10 goals, with a .936 save percentage and a 1.84 goals-against average. Andersen isn't the problem. When the third smallest guy on your team, 5' 10", 185lb Kerfoot out-hit 15 teammates all who were bigger then him, that's a problem. The Leafs don't need to explore the goalie market at all. Grabbing someone like Wayne Simmonds isn't going to solve the problem. It's every player taking that step up and getting nasty to play against.

 

[mapleleaf979]

To me, it looks more and more like we keep Andersen. That kind of return is meh, especially when you add in the risk factor with a replacement, I suspect we go with the “devil we know”. I get not having confidence Andersen can get us there, he probably walks, but man Dubas puts his ass on the line if he gets the crease wrong. There has to be enormous trepidation here.

Keeping Anderson falls into that category, keeping Anderson is wrong. Anderson falters during pressure and has proven that too many times, then look at his body language, head down, slumped over, looks rattled and upset. Campbell taking over #1 over Anderson at the very least must happen. The 3.5 million dollar gap between Campbell and Anderson isnt that noticeable from my stance vs spending that on defense.

 

[DarkKnight]

Keeping Anderson falls into that category, keeping Anderson is wrong. Anderson falters during pressure and has proven that too many times, then look at his body language, head down, slumped over, looks rattled and upset. Campbell taking over #1 over Anderson at the very least must happen. The 3.5 million dollar gap between Campbell and Anderson isnt that noticeable from my stance vs spending that on defense.

That’s insane to think you can hand the reigns to Campbell. I like Campbell, but good lord what a gamble.

 

[Cleetus]

Just partially joking here but doesn’t Matt Murray look like one of the oldest 20 somethings out there?

haha he grew up in Thunder Bay, thats normal!

 

[BigBlu]

Ian Scott is the real deal.

 

[Antropovsky]

Ian Scott is the real deal.

...... when is the last time he played hockey?

 

[Dekes For Days]

So a 4th liner, (2) thirds for a back up goalie and a fringe NHLer.

A 2nd rounder /prospect for a 1A goalie

Who got the better deal?

You call Moore a 4th liner, but Clifford a "fringe NHLer"? Clifford has played more than 10 times the NHL games that Moore has.

Murray was coming off a horrible year, is not a 1A goalie, and was an RFA with arbitration rights that was scaring off everybody. Campbell wasn't really that much lower in quality, and was signed for 2 and a half years at a great price.

Dubas got the better deal.

 

[kb]

You call Moore a 4th liner, but Clifford a "fringe NHLer"? Clifford has played more than 10 times the NHL games that Moore has.

Murray was coming off a horrible year, and was an RFA with arbitration rights that was scaring off everybody. Campbell wasn't really that much lower in quality, and was signed for 2 and a half years at a great price.

Dubas got the better deal.

It's not even up for debate that Dubas got a much better deal.

Unless someone has an agenda that they are perfectly willing to make a fool of themselves yet again in a losing effort.

 

[Leafmealone11]

Same with Murray then. So cap dumps get a 2nd and a prospect.

To be fair it was the sens 6th pick of the draft and they still drafted another player in the second round after that so they were drunk with a pocket full of candy at that point

 

[cgc83]

6.2 m for Murray . Ottawa is ridiculous not wanting to pay players and then over pay others.
Murray should of came in at least a million less

 

[kliq]

I dont think anyone gives the Leafs a 2nd and a prospect for Anderson. Murray had a bad year last year, but he does have 2 cups. The reputation on Anderson around the league is that he chokes in big games, and hes never even won a playoff round.

I'm a Wings fan, but I do like the Leafs as I grew up watching both. From my Wings perspective, I wouldnt be happy with the Wings giving up anything for Anderson, I'd only take him if it was a cap dump and we acquired assets to take him off your hands.

 

[cj19]

Leafs should do blockbuster trade like old Cliff Fletcher Gilmour Trade..

To Ducks To Leafs
Nylander Manson
Andersen Gibson
Rodion, S. Steel
Dermott T Terry
Johnsson M. Jones

 

[kb]

I dont think anyone gives the Leafs a 2nd and a prospect for Anderson. Murray had a bad year last year, but he does have 2 cups. The reputation on Anderson around the league is that he chokes in big games, and hes never even won a playoff round.

I'm a Wings fan, but I do like the Leafs as I grew up watching both. From my Wings perspective, I wouldnt be happy with the Wings giving up anything for Anderson, I'd only take him if it was a cap dump and we acquired assets to take him off your hands.

He's not someone who has value to a Detroit. He's someone who has value to a budget team who doesn't care about cap hits, and wants a starting goalie for $1 million.

 

[kliq]

He's not someone who has value to a Detroit. He's someone who has value to a budget team who doesn't care about cap hits, and wants a starting goalie for $1 million.

What team team do you believe would give up a 2nd round pick for a 5mil caphit & 5 mil expense (what is salary is) for a goalie who is is being criticized by his own fan base for choking in the playoffs and is a 31 year old upcoming UFA. Maybe I'm wrong, but I dont think there is a chance in hell the Leafs get a 2nd for him unless a team is desperate once the season starts due to an injury.

Look at Chicago for example, Vegas has already said they would trade MAF with a 2nd AND retain half his cap (ie. making him about 3.5mil), so if a team like Chicago wanted a goalie, why would they give up a second to Toronto, when they could have a better goalie and gain assets?

 

[kb]

What team team do you believe would give up a 2nd round pick for a 5mil caphit & 5 mil expense (what is salary is) for a goalie who is is being criticized by his own fan base for choking in the playoffs and is a 31 year old upcoming UFA. Maybe I'm wrong, but I dont think there is a chance in hell the Leafs get a 2nd for him unless a team is desperate once the season starts due to an injury.

Look at Chicago for example, Vegas has already said they would trade MAF with a 2nd AND retain half his cap (ie. making him about 3.5mil), so if a team like Chicago wanted a goalie, why would they give up a second to Toronto, when they could have a better goalie and gain assets?

His salary is $1 million for this season. Not $5 million. Please do your research.

I said he would have value. I didn't speculate at all as to what that value might be, because that's between the Leafs and whatever club they are dealing with.

Was your only point to come here and bash Andersen? Or were you coming here armed with knowledge to have a real conversation? Because if you think you have, you swung and missed badly.

 

[Dekes For Days]

What team team do you believe would give up a 2nd round pick for a 5mil caphit & 5 mil expense (what is salary is) for a goalie who is is being criticized by his own fan base for choking in the playoffs and is a 31 year old upcoming UFA. Maybe I'm wrong, but I dont think there is a chance in hell the Leafs get a 2nd for him unless a team is desperate once the season starts due to an injury.

Look at Chicago for example, Vegas has already said they would trade MAF with a 2nd AND retain half his cap (ie. making him about 3.5mil), so if a team like Chicago wanted a goalie, why would they give up a second to Toronto, when they could have a better goalie and gain assets?

Andersen makes 1 mil in salary this year, and is a much better goalie than Fleury.