Do you think the Rangers should re-sign Marc Staal long term?

[Zil]

If the organization's plan is not to extend him they should trade him. Letting him walk for nothing would just be bad asset management. That said, I believe they extend him as long as he isn't looking for more than 6M or so for 6 years.

Bad asset management would be giving in to Staal's contract demands and creating a cap crunch. If they want to keep him this year and try and make a run that's fine. If they want to flip him for a young forward like Kadri that's also fine.

Paying Staal $6 million per year or more for what he gives us is nuts. Stepan's going to need a raise. Hagelin's going to need a raise. Most will probably want to keep paying St. Louis his $5 million+. After 2014-15 it'll be time to slot in Skjei and Allen so we can upgrade down the middle.

 

[Radek27]

Has everyone forgotten how ineffective Nash was on LW while with the Rangers? Cause he was.

No way I put Nash on LW just to fit Yak. Would rather do that to Zucc.

Really doubt EDM trades him too. His value is at rock bottom.

You lack foresight. Free your mind and think more like Bernmeister.

Trade Staal to EDM for Yak

THEN Trade Nash to replace Staal on D.

 

[Machinehead]

Bad asset management would be giving in to Staal's contract demands and creating a cap crunch. If they want to keep him this year and try and make a run that's fine. If they want to flip him for a young forward like Kadri that's also fine.

Paying Staal $6 million per year or more for what he gives us is nuts. Stepan's going to need a raise. Hagelin's going to need a raise. Most will probably want to keep paying St. Louis his $5 million+. After 2014-15 it'll be time to slot in Skjei and Allen so we can upgrade down the middle.

I agree. People have such a fear of letting a guy walk, but if it was the end of the world, free agency wouldn't exist.

 

[TurgePurge*]

Staal - 3:47
MDZ - 3:23
Girardi - 2:42
Stralman - 0:50
McD - 0:14
Moore 0:05

Who knows what these times represent?

 

[slipknottin]

Staal - 3:47
MDZ - 3:23
Girardi - 2:42
Stralman - 0:50
McD - 0:14
Moore 0:05

Who knows what these times represent?

Something that hasent been relevant in awhile

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Bad asset management would be giving in to Staal's contract demands and creating a cap crunch. If they want to keep him this year and try and make a run that's fine. If they want to flip him for a young forward like Kadri that's also fine.

Paying Staal $6 million per year or more for what he gives us is nuts. Stepan's going to need a raise. Hagelin's going to need a raise. Most will probably want to keep paying St. Louis his $5 million+. After 2014-15 it'll be time to slot in Skjei and Allen so we can upgrade down the middle.

The cap crunch exists whether we sign him or not. I agree handing him $6M right now for next season is dangerous.

 

[Fletch]

Bad asset management would be giving in to Staal's contract demands and creating a cap crunch. If they want to keep him this year and try and make a run that's fine. If they want to flip him for a young forward like Kadri that's also fine.

Paying Staal $6 million per year or more for what he gives us is nuts. Stepan's going to need a raise. Hagelin's going to need a raise. Most will probably want to keep paying St. Louis his $5 million+. After 2014-15 it'll be time to slot in Skjei and Allen so we can upgrade down the middle.

This is where the business gets tricky. Do you extend him now, wait, or trade. If you wait, his ante can go up, or his trade value could go down. This is a tough call.

 

[Zil]

This is where the business gets tricky. Do you extend him now, wait, or trade. If you wait, his ante can go up, or his trade value could go down. This is a tough call.

I don't extend him under any realistic circumstances. It doesn't make sense in our situation with Skjei coming. I'm perfectly happy to either play out the year and let him walk if we contend this season. I'd prefer to deal him for a young center right now though.

 

[Fletch]

I don't extend him under any realistic circumstances. It doesn't make sense in our situation with Skjei coming. I'm perfectly happy to either play out the year and let him walk if we contend this season. I'd prefer to deal him for a young center right now though.

you deal him for a centerman now and then have zero bodies left, of the two bodies who went out against Crosby every series in the playoffs. Just seems like a lot of defensive turnover for a team that thrived on the play of their defensemen. I can't argue about the need for a centerman, Further, I believe there aren't a heck of a lot of assets that have much value to get that centerman. For me, it's a tough call. I'm one of the few who seemed to have liked Staal.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

I don't extend him under any realistic circumstances. It doesn't make sense in our situation with Skjei coming. I'm perfectly happy to either play out the year and let him walk if we contend this season. I'd prefer to deal him for a young center right now though.

What doesn't make sense is assuming Skjei will pan out and be able to be an adequate replacement on the blue line.

 

[slipknottin]

What doesn't make sense is assuming Skjei will pan out and be able to be an adequate replacement on the blue line.

What makes absolutely perfect sense however is not locking down the LD positions for the next 5+ years when they have good prospects at the position.

Ideally they could retain staal for another year or two, then trade him after that.

I wouldn't mind resigning staal, but he needs to not have a NMC after the first year or two of the deal

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

What makes absolutely perfect sense however is not locking down the LD positions for the next 5+ years when they have good prospects at the position.

Ideally they could retain staal for another year or two, then trade him after that.

I wouldn't mind resigning staal, but he needs to not have a NMC after the first year or two of the deal

Theres far worse positions to be in than having McDonagh and Staal anchoring the left side for years to come.

I understand Staal is going to come with a hefty price tag. Its something that the organization is going to have to weigh heavily. But not signing Staal because they think Brady Skjei is the answer is a huge and, quite frankly, dangerous leap.

 

[we want cup]

Theres far worse positions to be in than having McDonagh and Staal anchoring the left side for years to come.

I understand Staal is going to come with a hefty price tag. Its something that the organization is going to have to weigh heavily. But not signing Staal because they think Brady Skjei is the answer is a huge and, quite frankly, dangerous leap.

Trading Staal basically means sacrificing this season, IMO. Staal can elevate a lesser player like Boyle or Klein and make for a formidable 2nd pair. Without him that pair is going to be a mess. Mcd-Girardi would be stuck playing close to 30 minutes a night, and they'd either get injured or burn out by the time the playoffs roll around.

I wouldn't be totally opposed to sacrificing this season if we had any guarantee that it would lead to better things in the following years, but we have no idea if we'd be able to keep MSL, no idea if Skjei will be able to play important minutes right away, no idea what's happening with the backup goalie situation, no idea what kind of shape Nash will be in, etc.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Trading Staal basically means sacrificing this season, IMO. Staal can elevate a lesser player like Boyle or Klein and make for a formidable 2nd pair. Without him that pair is going to be a mess. Mcd-Girardi would be stuck playing close to 30 minutes a night, and they'd either get injured or burn out by the time the playoffs roll around.

I wouldn't be totally opposed to sacrificing this season if we had any guarantee that it would lead to better things in the following years, but we have no idea if we'd be able to keep MSL, no idea if Skjei will be able to play important minutes right away, no idea what's happening with the backup goalie situation, no idea what kind of shape Nash will be in, etc.

I agree. You know, its funny, if Pittsburgh knocked off the Rangers when they had that 3-1 series lead, I'd have a different outlook going forward.

But, coming off a finals appearance, and given the MSL trade and Hank's age, theres really no reason to sacrifice for a season or two when, in fact, that might be all thats left for this team to compete.

 

[Zil]

Theres far worse positions to be in than having McDonagh and Staal anchoring the left side for years to come.

I understand Staal is going to come with a hefty price tag. Its something that the organization is going to have to weigh heavily. But not signing Staal because they think Brady Skjei is the answer is a huge and, quite frankly, dangerous leap.

Locking into a deteriorating Staal at $6 million+ and pretending he's what he was before the injuries is what's dangerous. McDonagh and Sauer played second pairing minutes in their rookie seasons. The Rangers think Skjei is pro ready. There's no point in having kids if you're going to block them. You have to take a risk at some point to improve the roster. We have talent in the system on defense and on the wings. We've got very, very little in the center pipeline. We need to free up some space to pursue someone to pair with Stepan in the top six.

 

[Fletch]

Locking into a deteriorating Staal at $6 million+ and pretending he's what he was before the injuries is what's dangerous. McDonagh and Sauer played second pairing minutes in their rookie seasons. The Rangers think Skjei is pro ready. There's no point in having kids if you're going to block them. You have to take a risk at some point to improve the roster. We have talent in the system on defense and on the wings. We've got very, very little in the center pipeline. We need to free up some space to pursue someone to pair with Stepan in the top six.

Not sure they're really being blocked, though. In two seasons Boyle will be gone. There's 20+ minutes that open up then. Also, Klein should be movable. If Staal is signed and plays to his contract, he too is movable, although you've made the determination that won't happen (which I'm not going to argue), so that's not a possibility. But aside from that, there are a couple possibilities to break in and get meaningful minutes in the short term, and near-short term.

 

[Zil]

Not sure they're really being blocked, though. In two seasons Boyle will be gone. There's 20+ minutes that open up then. Also, Klein should be movable. If Staal is signed and plays to his contract, he too is movable, although you've made the determination that won't happen (which I'm not going to argue), so that's not a possibility. But aside from that, there are a couple possibilities to break in and get meaningful minutes in the short term, and near-short term.

If we just keep giving everyone pay raises then we'll never be able to make significant upgrades. Staal would just combine with Stepan, Hagelin, and St. Louis to eat whatever increase we see in the cap. Plus Staal won't sign a deal without a NMC because Girardi got one.

I don't see how we contend this year replacing Stralman, B. Boyle, and Pouliot with D. Boyle, Glass, and some kids. We lost Richards and Dorsett too. This roster is long on holes and short on cap space. I'd rather make the right moves to set us up for 15-16 by dealing Staal for a young center and freeing up space to pursue someone like Krejci in the offseason.

 

[RangerBoy]

Girardi has a no movement for the first 3 years and a limited no trade in the last 3 years. The media reported Girardi is moving his family out of Manhattan and into Westchester County. He isn't moving. Staal will get a restriction clause because all of these players get it. The Rangers will not be able to trade Staal for the foreseeable future if they sign him. Kesler would go to 2 teams which severely limited the Canucks options. Staal gets the same structure as Girardi and they agree to extend it into this season. That's 4 years of no movement. The CBA allows the player and team to extend the clause into the final year of the current contract as long as the player is eligible. Staal is 27.

 

[Fletch]

If we just keep giving everyone pay raises then we'll never be able to make significant upgrades. Staal would just combine with Stepan, Hagelin, and St. Louis to eat whatever increase we see in the cap. Plus Staal won't sign a deal without a NMC because Girardi got one.

I don't see how we contend this year replacing Stralman, B. Boyle, and Pouliot with D. Boyle, Glass, and some kids. We lost Richards and Dorsett too. This roster is long on holes and short on cap space. I'd rather make the right moves to set us up for 15-16 by dealing Staal for a young center and freeing up space to pursue someone like Krejci in the offseason.

That is the issue, and of course how many will take a step back, on paper, for a better '15 and beyond? I wouldn't mind because the situation is tight, but I don't know if that's going to happen. On pay raises - I agree with that too, which is why in a cap world you have to unload decent players.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

That is the issue, and of course how many will take a step back, on paper, for a better '15 and beyond? I wouldn't mind because the situation is tight, but I don't know if that's going to happen. On pay raises - I agree with that too, which is why in a cap world you have to unload decent players.

You also need young, controllable talent that can step in and fill holes. That's part of the reason that going three drafts without a first round pick will sting at some point.

 

[Fletch]

You also need young, controllable talent that can step in and fill holes. That's part of the reason that going three drafts without a first round pick will sting at some point.

I agree. That's three straight drafts, correct? Either you have to hit late in the draft, or hope the #1s in the drafts before and after succeed.

 

[haveandare]

Having 3 good D men signed to big deals is really not the end of the world in my opinion. When you get your hands on that much talent at such a desirable and important position, you hold it and make that the strength of your team. It's not like we've got a whole D corp that is immovable until the end of time. Mac isn't going anywhere, and nobody wants him to. G is going to be hard to move for a few years. Staal will be too if he gets a long deal. Then it's pretty much open season. Boyle is not in the big picture. Klein is a very useful piece but isn't going to block a key kid if they're ready. Moore has great wheels but is otherwise a 6D, and he can go too if need be.

Why are we not only expecting kids to be comfortable in the NHL right away, but to be comfortable anchoring a second pair with an aging Dan Boyle right off the bat? That's just not realistic, and it's definitely not worth building the team a certain way to allow that to happen IMO. If Allen and McI make this team this year, then Skjei next year, that's a great problem to have. Move Klein's nearly 3mill, move Moore if necessary, move Boyle who has an NMC but no NTC if I recall correctly. That's IF the "worst" scenario in terms of blockage comes to fruition, which IMO, is wildly optimistic.

That is the issue, and of course how many will take a step back, on paper, for a better '15 and beyond? I wouldn't mind because the situation is tight, but I don't know if that's going to happen. On pay raises - I agree with that too, which is why in a cap world you have to unload decent players.

To me, playing the kids at forward is taking a step back on paper this year for the future. I don't think we should compound that by effectively losing the entire second defensive pairing. Whether or not people liked the Stralman move, it's done now, and saying goodbye to Staal means saying goodbye to the entire second pair, the strength of which was a huge factor in this postseason.

It seems like a lot of posters (not you specifically Fletch, or maybe even generally) are not okay with "stepping back" on forward, where the team falters generally, but are more than comfortable stepping back on D, where the team has had it's strength for a long time. Why is this? I feel the complete opposite. Many kids are ready at forward and you have twice as many skaters at forward to spread responsibility amongst.

 

[haveandare]

If we just keep giving everyone pay raises then we'll never be able to make significant upgrades. Staal would just combine with Stepan, Hagelin, and St. Louis to eat whatever increase we see in the cap. Plus Staal won't sign a deal without a NMC because Girardi got one.

I don't see how we contend this year replacing Stralman, B. Boyle, and Pouliot with D. Boyle, Glass, and some kids. We lost Richards and Dorsett too. This roster is long on holes and short on cap space. I'd rather make the right moves to set us up for 15-16 by dealing Staal for a young center and freeing up space to pursue someone like Krejci in the offseason.

I don't see a team that needs significant upgrades. I think kids getting better and some other kids breaking through and then getting comfortable will be upgrades. Kreider will be better this year than last. Hagelin looked like he found another gear late last year. Zucc obviously went from pretty good to team leading scorer last year, though he's not a "kid" in an age sense, he is one in terms of NHL experience. Miller comes up and learns the position. Fast comes up and learns his. McDonagh keeps improving, or gives a full season of great offensive effort like we saw toward the end of last year.

Why are we dealing Staal for a center for next year when we have Miller? If he weren't already on this team, people would likely be clamoring to trade for him. He's a center, he's got some snarl, some edge, and he's gone PPG in the AHL and is ready to jump. We need cost controlled assets - there's one. Why trade for someone to take his spot? Why is it unthinkable to "block" Skjei, who isn't even a pro yet, but worth trading Staal to actually block Miller, who is done in the A and who management has explicitly stated will be on the team next year?

Also, Krejci will be UFA if Boston doesn't resign him, which they may. I don't think it's wise to trade pieces and then bank on big UFA signings to make the trades complete.

 

[Trxjw]

Still boggles my mind that setting us up for a UFA target is a common idea around here.

 

[haveandare]

Still boggles my mind that setting us up for a UFA target is a common idea around here.

Yup.

Let's trade Staal so we have space for Malkin.