Do you believe Jimmy Howard is capable of winning the Stanley Cup?

[Slick13]

Not exactly the model of consistency.

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[aar000n]

Looks like the best goalie one game looks like crap the next game.

 

[rx7dryver]

Capable? Yes.

I do not think he is capable of carrying the team on his shoulders but if the team plays gud in front of him I see no reason why he could not win a cup. Let's be honest the team if it got on a good roll could win but they are far from favorites.

There have been goalies a lot worse win the cup.

 

[Laser Rayzor]

Question needs a little context, I think Howard can win a cup with a great team in front of him i.e. swap Crawford out for Howie and I think the Hawks still take home a cup in 2013. But can Howard put this team on his back and lead them to glory? then the answer is no.

But that would be an unfair expectation of him, he's a good to great tender that is capable of providing solid performances but he's not good enough to be counted on to cover up multiple deficiencies in front of him. IOW put a great team in front of Howard and they can contend/win but put a team that has holes in front of him and they won't.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Question needs a little context, I think Howard can win a cup with a great team in front of him i.e. swap Crawford out for Howie and I think the Hawks still take home a cup in 2013. But can Howard put this team on his back and lead them to glory? then the answer is no.

But that would be an unfair expectation of him, he's a good to great tender that is capable of providing solid performances but he's not good enough to be counted on to cover up multiple deficiencies in front of him. IOW put a great team in front of Howard and they can contend/win but put a team that has holes in front of him and they won't.

I don't believe that any goalie can full on put a team on his back and win a cup. Hasek is as close as I can think and even he came up short until he got a substantially better team. By the way what Howard has been working with for a couple of playoff runs is not unbelievably different than that Sabres squad. So yes the greatest goalie ever got them almost.

This is something to keep in mind for Habs fans, at some point there has to be a heck of a lot more than Price, Subban and Patches. Galchenyuk and Plekanec are nice but it is big ask of any goalie to shoulder a massive load. Hasek was unbelievable in the late 90's better than he was when he got to Detroit and he couldn't pull off the task. Sure for an Olympic tournament he did, but the Stanley Cup playoffs are a different animal.

If anybodies expectation is Howard putting this team on his back, well in my opinion you have a ridiculous expectation. Hasek is the closest I can think of and he came up short. Lundqvist was getting ushered out of the playoffs quickly until his team got better.

Howard is certainly capable of winning a Cup in my opinion. There are better goalies but he hovers around the Top 10 in the league. That is more than enough to win if the team plays well enough.

 

[TatarTangle]

Not exactly the model of consistency.

You would be correct in saying he hasn't been consistent after the injury. But before the injury, and throughout majority of his career, he has been consistent; his regular season numbers and playoff numbers are on par with some of the best goalies in the league.

Carey Price could be the Detroit Red Wings starting goalie and Lundvquist could be the back-up and the fans around here would still find a way to complain about them. People aren't very rational or logical when it comes to discussing goaltenders.

Yes, he can. Especially if he gets "hot"

 

[Frk It]

I don't believe that any goalie can full on put a team on his back and win a cup. Hasek is as close as I can think and even he came up short until he got a substantially better team. By the way what Howard has been working with for a couple of playoff runs is not unbelievably different than that Sabres squad. So yes the greatest goalie ever got them almost.

This is something to keep in mind for Habs fans, at some point there has to be a heck of a lot more than Price, Subban and Patches. Galchenyuk and Plekanec are nice but it is big ask of any goalie to shoulder a massive load. Hasek was unbelievable in the late 90's better than he was when he got to Detroit and he couldn't pull off the task. Sure for an Olympic tournament he did, but the Stanley Cup playoffs are a different animal.

If anybodies expectation is Howard putting this team on his back, well in my opinion you have a ridiculous expectation. Hasek is the closest I can think of and he came up short. Lundqvist was getting ushered out of the playoffs quickly until his team got better.

Howard is certainly capable of winning a Cup in my opinion. There are better goalies but he hovers around the Top 10 in the league. That is more than enough to win if the team plays well enough.

What do you call what Tim Thomas did?

 

[Laser Rayzor]

Howard is certainly capable of winning a Cup in my opinion. There are better goalies but he hovers around the Top 10 in the league. That is more than enough to win if the team plays well enough.

Yeah I obviously don't expect Howie to drag the team through the playoffs à la Hasek, but I do get the feeling people around here expect him to consistently make up for the team's inconsistencies/deficiencies. IMO this team is too Jekyll and Hyde and Howard isn't good enough to make up for it (not his fault though, I agree he's probably near top 10 in my books). If this team brings their A game night in and night out you can win with Howard.
Basically what I'm saying is, if you can't win with Howard as your goalie, goaltending may not be your (only) problem.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

What do you call what Tim Thomas did?

He won a cup with a team that would go to another Stanley Cup final and win a Presidents Trophy in that near time frame.

He was deserving of the Conn Smythe, but what he did wasn't overly different than Quick. He played in front of one of the best teams in hockey, if you think that was him alone putting them on his back, sorry I disagree.

Put up his 08-09 stats next to his cup run. Another example of your team is going to play a larger role than some are account for at times around here. Howard hasn't had a team capable of winning a cup in front of him outside of 11-12 and he didn't come off the injury well, everyone got hurt and Trotz owned Babcock's soul for the duration of the series.

He played pretty well in their two exits to the Sharks, where again in my opinion Babcock got worked pretty good by his former understudy. But it is hard to say I had a lot of faith in any of the teams after the Finals lost other than the 11-12 addition that had basically everything go wrong starting with Howard's injury on a slash in February and going into outright disaster with nearly everyone getting hurt in March through the duration of the season.

I think Howard can provide us with enough goaltending to win the Cup. I don't think he has to be Tim Thomas or Jonathan Quick, it would be nice, but that doesn't need to be a prerequisite for what it means to be a good goalie or the standard in my opinion of which this question was driving at.

 

[icKx]

Disagree about Thomas, he was far, far more impressive than Quick in his Cup run.

Absolutely, yes to the OP.

Howard has been good/great in the playoffs outside of the Smashville beating and his SV% backs it up.

If we are relying on the goalie to win us games the team isn't Cup worthy.

 

[Realgud]

Thomas completely stole 10+ games in his cup run (not an exact number ). Quick on the other hand was good but hardly had to steal any games (maybe 1 or 2). Thomas' run is one for the ages, he was insane.

That said, worse goalies have won the cup so Howard can certainly do it. Is he the goalie that can imitate Thomas in a run? He most certainly can't but that's another question.

So, yes.

 

[Zetterbergs Beard]

I don't like how this question implies a goalie has to win a cup by himself, as if it's an individual achievement. Others have already said goalies usually need to complemen, if not rely on the skaters to succeed anyway.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Thomas completely stole 10+ games in his cup run (not an exact number ). Quick on the other hand was good but hardly had to steal any games (maybe 1 or 2). Thomas' run is one for the ages, he was insane.

That said, worse goalies have won the cup so Howard can certainly do it. Is he the goalie that can imitate Thomas in a run? He most certainly can't but that's another question.

So, yes.

Jonathan Quick's record in elimination games has to be absolutely staggering at this point.

I would take Thomas run over that one. A part of the point was though Tim Thomas did the same thing in the post-season in 08-09 and went home. That Bruins team was very good, it wasn't all Tim Thomas in my opinion who was outstanding.

I stick with the point I don't think any goalie is carrying a team to the promise land alone. I have yet to see it in my opinion. Closest I can think of is JSG, he like Hasek wound up short ultimately of making it happen.

 

[Hunting Bow*]

Here's the thing with Howard. His gaa is good but what's always ignored is his gaa consists of one game of 1 goal against and then a 6 goal game. And then a 1 goal game and then a 4 goal game. I'd love to have a goalie whose gaa was a consist stat night to night. An average is just that an average.

So there's no chance of a cup with Howard in net, he's way to inconsistent to win a cup. Sorry!

 

[Hunting Bow*]

Disagree about Thomas, he was far, far more impressive than Quick in his Cup run.

Absolutely, yes to the OP.

Howard has been good/great in the playoffs outside of the Smashville beating and his SV% backs it up.

If we are relying on a goalie to win us games the team isn't Cup worthy.

Cam Ward would like to say hi!

 

[PullHard]

The Bruins were stacked during that time. Thomas was awesome, but are people actually trying to discredit those late 2000s/ early 2010s Bruins teams? They were some of the stingiest and most balanced teams in recent memory, not to mention the overall depth. They went to game 6 of the finals with Rask just a little bit ago, it wasn't like Thomas was carrying that team.

 

[FissionFire]

Marc-Andre Fleury won a Stanley Cup. Just think about that. So yeah, Howard definitely can.

 

[Todd1a]

If osgood can win a cup then so can Howard

 

[Hunting Bow*]

If osgood can win a cup then so can Howard

Check out Osgood's playoff stats.

 

[TatarTangle]

Here's the thing with Howard. His gaa is good but what's always ignored is his gaa consists of one game of 1 goal against and then a 6 goal game. And then a 1 goal game and then a 4 goal game. I'd love to have a goalie whose gaa was a consist stat night to night. An average is just that an average.

So there's no chance of a cup with Howard in net, he's way to inconsistent to win a cup. Sorry!

It's been pointed out (to you) on several occassions that GAA is a useless stat to judge a goalie on. Save percentage is, without a doubt, the stat you want to look at. As it stands, he's in the middle of the pack and ahead of notable goalies like Quick and Bishop. Him being in the middle of the pack lines up with how much he's getting paid. It'd be nice to see him get back to .920 though, he's currently at .917

 

[Hunting Bow*]

It's been pointed out (to you) on several occassions that GAA is a useless stat to judge a goalie on. Save percentage is, without a doubt, the stat you want to look at. As it stands, he's in the middle of the pack and ahead of notable goalies like Quick and Bishop. Him being in the middle of the pack lines up with how much he's getting paid. It'd be nice to see him get back to .920 though, he's currently at .917

So his .841 last night sucked then right?

 

[TatarTangle]

So his .841 last night sucked then right?

Yep. And Howard has a better playoff save percentage than Osgood. So Osgood sucked then, right?

 

[The Zermanator]

Can Daniel Alfredsson/Mats Sundin/Marcel Dionne, etc. win a Cup? Obviously they didn't but it certainly wasn't because of a lack of ability.

Point is, it's a team sport. People who pin our playoff success, and especially failure, on Howard are just being juvenile. Can Howard win a Cup? Absolutely. Worse goalies than him have done it, that should be the end of the debate right there. Will he? Depends on the team in front of him. The better a goalie is, the more he can compensate for team deficiencies. The less skilled a goaltender, the fewer deficiencies the team needs in order to compete.

I think the more useful debate would be, what changes need to be made to the team in order to challenge for a cup with a goalie of Howard's caliber in net?

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Check out Osgood's playoff stats.

Howard has a better save percentage than Osgood in the playoffs, playing behind much worse defensive teams.

 

[Hunting Bow*]

It's been pointed out (to you) on several occassions that GAA is a useless stat to judge a goalie on. Save percentage is, without a doubt, the stat you want to look at. As it stands, he's in the middle of the pack and ahead of notable goalies like Quick and Bishop. Him being in the middle of the pack lines up with how much he's getting paid. It'd be nice to see him get back to .920 though, he's currently at .917

Ok then the same thing. A save pct is average. How about he consistently hit a save pct of .920? .800 one night and .964 the next. Just another stat that is a roller coaster for him. It's all about consistency. Howard career has been a roller coaster.