Do the Oilers really need a big center?

[McDNicks17]

I was looking at player vs. player match-ups on hockeyanalysis and it got me thinking. Are we grossly overestimating the need for a "big" center?


Here are RNH's even strength numbers while playing vs. the big centers of the Pacific.

(Name - Size - Minutes(rank among most played) - RNH's Goals For Per 20 Minutes - RNH's Goals Against Per 20 Minutes - RNH's Percentage of Goals scored)

Patrick Marleau - 6'2'' 220lbs - 31:33(3rd) - 3.17 GF20 - 0.00 GA/20 - 100 GF%
Martin Hanzal - 6'6'' 230lbs - 28:55(6th) - 3.458 GF/20 - 0.692 GA/20 - 83.3 GF%
Anze Kopitar - 6'3'' 225lbs - 24:59(12th) - 0.00 GF/20 - 0.800 GA/20 - 0.0 GF%
Ryan Kesler - 6'2'' 202lbs - 23:46(15th) - 1.683 GF/20 - 0.00 GA/20 - 100 GF%
Joe Thornton - 6'4'' 220lbs - 20:14(21st) - 1.977 GF/20 - 1.977 GA/20 - 50 GF%
Ryan Getzlaf - 6'4'' 221lbs - 17:21(38th) - 1.153 GF/20 - 1.153 GA/20 - 50 GF%


I think most of us can agree RNH struggled a little defensively this season. He went up and down. But, as you can see above, he either completely outplayed or broke even against the big dogs of the Pacific.

Kopitar was the only one to shut down RNH, but RNH held him to 0.179 GF/20 less than in his 1140ish minutes of ice time away from RNH.


The real issues came when the Oilers other centers were on the ice.

Gagner played Getzlaf/Perry more than any other forward in the league. He struggled vs. them.

Gordon played Thornton the most. Getzlaf was 6th most. He struggled mightily vs. them.

Smyth played Thornton 5th most and struggled to a degree.


Basically my point is...do the Oilers really need "big centers" or do they just need some defensively capable centers(and wingers to support them) for when teams are able to match around RNH?

Click to read more...

 

[Oiltankjob Fail]

Oilers need a productive 2nd line center who is a two way player, this also would take attention of Rnh facing all the tough match ups.

 

[Beerfish]

No, we need big forwards, it doesn't have to be a centre if you ask me. We need one or two top two line forwards who can win puck battles with their size, score and be at least semi protectors for smaller players. It would be nice if it was a centre but at this point any forward would be a big help.

 

[fysloc]

It can be the smallest player for all I care, as long as they know how to play the two way game and can hold their ground.

Size/Weight is overrated.

Hockey skills, IQ and Grit is what matters, and if you noticed, all the "big" centers you listed have all of that, physical size was just a bonus.

 

[BowDangles]

You either need one or the other, big centre men or big wingers. The most important part of centre is not that you are big or not, its how well you play a 2 way game, size often helps this aspect of the game but doesn't define it, so that is why people want that big centre man.

 

[CornKicker]

i agree we should take bennett

 

[Canovin]

No because if McDavid was on the table, no one would pass up a 1-2 punch of McDavid-RNH. As long as they are defensively sound and both are potential #1C that's all it matters.

The problem with Gagner is he's none of that

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

I agree with your thought, size down the middle wouldn't be awful, but better play and depth down the middle would be best. Heck I would say the Oilers are even in a position to potential down grade the skill at the 2nd line position, to improve overall play, because the skill level of the wingers available should be able to cover off the drop, imo.

 

[Aceboogie]

Oilers need:

6'-6'1 215 two way center able of shutting down top lines while able to score 50-60
6'1-6'5 220 winger able to win puck battles, while being able to keep up with the speed

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Oilers need:

6'-6'1 215 two way center able of shutting down top lines while able to score 50-60
6'1-6'5 220 winger able to win puck battles, while being able to keep up with the speed

So they need Legwand/Ott and Winnik/Kulemin/Moss/Bertuzzi(don't want, just a ****he)/Downie?

That would work nicely.

 

[Jumptheshark]

all centers named are 6 foot plus--I have nuge at 5-10 or 11

for me--we need a 6-2 center with a mean streak and can win face offs

 

[Lewy]

Intelligence and the ever nebulous "hockey sense" will take you much farther than size.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

all centers named are 6 foot plus--I have nuge at 5-10 or 11

for me--we need a 6-2 center with a mean streak and can win face offs

I guess that's probably good, but I don't see how you can arbitrarily decide the Nuge is shorter then he is. Plus, what does this mean for a guy like Mike Richards or David Krejchi(sp)?

 

[Oiltankjob Fail]

all centers named are 6 foot plus--I have nuge at 5-10 or 11
for me--we need a 6-2 center with a mean streak and can win face offs

I am 5'11 close to 6'foot And Rnh is 6'1 at least.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Oilers need a productive 2nd line center who is a two way player, this also would take attention of Rnh facing all the tough match ups.

This. If this thread is a prelude to a Bennett Vs. Draisaitl debate then IMO it should be pointed out that both guys have merit in terms of drafting them. A guy like Bennett plays an in your face style and has solid skating ability and his 2 way game is one of his many selling points. Meanwhile a guy like Draisaitl gives us another high end offensive player who adds a different dimension to our game in terms of being able to create offense from the cycle and playing a more static game. If we are keeping both Perron and Yakupov then they are likely our two best one shot scorers, Perron is not fleet of foot and Nail while pretty quick is no Hall in that regard either. With a guy like Draisaitl they can look to get open and catch the opposition napping/puck watching and get the puck and bury it in a split second. If Draisaitl draws a double team because of his strength and puck protection then he finds an open man and we likely get a good chance off of it. IMO you can't go wrong with either guy and either would be a dramatic improvement on Gagner as early as next season.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

all centers named are 6 foot plus--I have nuge at 5-10 or 11

for me--we need a 6-2 center with a mean streak and can win face offs

Then I guess the guys at the draft combine are bold faced liars?

 

[gqmixmaster]

we need a team of Joe Hulbig's

 

[Tarus]

all centers named are 6 foot plus--I have nuge at 5-10 or 11

for me--we need a 6-2 center with a mean streak and can win face offs

So you're saying he's lost height since he was accurately measured at 6.0.25 feet during his NHL combine?

 

[Bryanbryoil]

we need a team of Joe Hulbig's

Why is it that any time size is mentioned that people feel the need to throw out guys like Hulbig, JFJ, etc.? Getzlaf, Thornton, Kopitar, Eric Staal, Malkin, Ryan Johansen has made great strides this season, many of you drool over Couturier, Barkov, Bjugstad, then there's Hanzal. There are a lot of big high quality centermen in the league. All things considered equal I take the bigger player 10/10 times.

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

we need a team of Joe Hulbig's

and Jason Bonsignores.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

and Jason Bonsignores.

Let's have a team full of Sam Gagner's.

What is wrong with a good mix? Right now our team is a team that likes to try and create most of its offense on the rush and the PP. So if a team has a good PK and rush defense we are ****ed.

 

[5 14 6 1]

Oilers need a productive 2nd line center who is a two way player, this also would take attention of Rnh facing all the tough match ups.

Sam bennett!

 

[Tarus]

Since this is a big center type thread -

http://nhlnumbers.com/2012/6/8/does-size-matter-in-the-nhl-draft

http://sportsbystats.blogspot.ca/2013/07/height-weight-and-bmi-of-nhl-players.html

Data is a couple of years old, but it's mildly interesting.

 

[Aerchon]

I was looking at player vs. player match-ups on hockeyanalysis and it got me thinking. Are we grossly overestimating the need for a "big" center?


Here are RNH's even strength numbers while playing vs. the big centers of the Pacific.

(Name - Size - Minutes(rank among most played) - RNH's Goals For Per 20 Minutes - RNH's Goals Against Per 20 Minutes - RNH's Percentage of Goals scored)

Patrick Marleau - 6'2'' 220lbs - 31:33(3rd) - 3.17 GF20 - 0.00 GA/20 - 100 GF%
Martin Hanzal - 6'6'' 230lbs - 28:55(6th) - 3.458 GF/20 - 0.692 GA/20 - 83.3 GF%
Anze Kopitar - 6'3'' 225lbs - 24:59(12th) - 0.00 GF/20 - 0.800 GA/20 - 0.0 GF%
Ryan Kesler - 6'2'' 202lbs - 23:46(15th) - 1.683 GF/20 - 0.00 GA/20 - 100 GF%
Joe Thornton - 6'4'' 220lbs - 20:14(21st) - 1.977 GF/20 - 1.977 GA/20 - 50 GF%
Ryan Getzlaf - 6'4'' 221lbs - 17:21(38th) - 1.153 GF/20 - 1.153 GA/20 - 50 GF%


I think most of us can agree RNH struggled a little defensively this season. He went up and down. But, as you can see above, he either completely outplayed or broke even against the big dogs of the Pacific.

Kopitar was the only one to shut down RNH, but RNH held him to 0.179 GF/20 less than in his 1140ish minutes of ice time away from RNH.


The real issues came when the Oilers other centers were on the ice.

Gagner played Getzlaf/Perry more than any other forward in the league. He struggled vs. them.

Gordon played Thornton the most. Getzlaf was 6th most. He struggled mightily vs. them.

Smyth played Thornton 5th most and struggled to a degree.


Basically my point is...do the Oilers really need "big centers" or do they just need some defensively capable centers(and wingers to support them) for when teams are able to match around RNH?

While your numbers show that RNH is capable... I hope we all kinda knew that already. RNH is 6', extremely athletic and putting more weight on by the day, should only be time before we stop calling him small.

What your numbers really show is how a truly small, weak on his skates, defensively weak Gagner does against bigger opponents.

So using Gganer as the example and RNH as the exception. YES, we really do need a big #2 center, that player also needs to be better defensively as well of course.

 

[5 14 6 1]

Anyone know the size of the Bruins top 2 C's?

Krecji 6'0 188
Bergeron 6'1 195

And they do just fine. Both play a great two way game and can compete hard every night, the same thing Nuge + Bennett would offer us. One of them is flanked by two guys sub 200 pounds and they are called one of, if not the best two way line in hockey.

Marchand (5'9 183) -Bergeron (6'1 195) - Smith (6'0 185)

It's not just size, its the fight and heart the player plays with as well.

The more I see stuff like this and am not just blindly fed the "WE NEED A 6'6 CENTER HUR DURRR" the more I am leaning towards Benett, seems like the perfect 2C for us.