Proposal: Discussing the needs of the future - *Discuss standings placement here*

[Vesa Awesaka]

How many teams make the finals without top draft picks?

Ottawa has met the top draft pick quota to make the finals with Turris, Ryan and phillips.

 

[StefanW]

How many teams make the finals without top draft picks?

I can answer that, but I need a time frame. As in "Without having a top draft pick in XXX years." Unless you mean never having a top draft pick, which would be a pretty small sample of teams.

 

[aragorn]

Ottawa has quite a few 1st rd picks playing on their roster, don't they? I count 10 with another one in Puempel waiting in Bingo.

Phillips, Legwand, Ryan, Turris, Zibanejad, Karlsson, Lazar, Cowen, Ceci & Michalek.

 

[Sensinitis]

He's right lazar, ceci and zib were all rushed

Ceci wasn't rushed he was dominating the AHL and so far he's been good defensively and his offense is developing at this level.

Lazar WAYYY too early to tell. Sending him back to the WJC was a good move.

Zib still too early to tell. His production has gone up every year. If he gets 20+20 this season I consider it a success and he'll still have room to improve the year after.

Dunno how you can say the team rushed any of these players, considering all of them are under 22 and every one of them has shown good signs.

 

[StefanW]

Ottawa has quite a few 1st rd picks playing on their roster, don't they? I count 10 with another one in Puempel waiting in Bingo.

Phillips, Legwand, Ryan, Turris, Zibanejad, Karlsson, Lazar, Cowen, Ceci & Michalek.

First round picks have a much greater likelihood of making it as NHL players than those picked in later rounds. I would expect most teams to have several first round picks in their lineup.

 

[Stylizer1]

Ottawa has quite a few 1st rd picks playing on their roster, don't they? I count 10 with another one in Puempel waiting in Bingo.

Phillips, Legwand, Ryan, Turris, Zibanejad, Karlsson, Lazar, Cowen, Ceci & Michalek.

Phillips, Michalek, and Legwand are past their primes and don't make us better rather than being key contributors helping us win. Ryan is the only top level draft pick we have with the skill to match. We hit a home run with Karlsson but as for the others they are good 2nd and 3rd liners/bottom 4 D at this stage of their careers.

If we could get 2 more top 5 players in the next drafts it would give this fan base some needed optimism that we could be actually done the rebuild/retool.

That is what this team needs going forward. How we achieve this is buy positioning our selves through trades for picks and giving our rookies ice time.

IF you can get a good return on Anderson you make sure the team in front on Lehner is better.

This would be the best way to improve our team while not being able to spend. If Murnyk decide to start spending some money then you keep Anderson and you build the team up in front of him. The roster improves and so does our position in the standings.

 

[Stylizer1]

Well Dallas got 2 points last night and Arizona with 1.

 

[BankStreetParade]

This team needs to start parlaying prospects and picks in to proven NHL talent. There's way too much of a logjam on the NHL roster and there's not nearly enough room, now or in the future, for many of the players who are coming up. Especially when you have positions on the team spoken for:

G1 (Anderson)
G2 (Lehner)
RD1 (Karlsson)
RD2 (Ceci)
LD1 (Methot)
LD2 (Cowen)
LD3 (Borowiecki)
LW1 (MacArthur)
LW2 (Hoffman)
LW3 (Michalek)
RW1 (Ryan)
RW2 (Stone)
RW3 (Chiasson)
C1 (Turris)
C2 (Zibanejad)
C3 (Lazar)
C4 (Pageau/Smith/Legwand)

Prince, Puempel, Robinson and Wideman are very nearly NHL ready or potentially ready to play in the NHL (but most likely no spots for them). Paul, Claesson and Englund aren't very far off (easy to see them pushing for spots on the roster sometime late next year or during training camp the year after).

Yes, not all of these prospects will pan out. But many are well-developed, have good pedigree and are on the cusp of playing in the NHL. The question is, where in the lineup do they play? And if they can't get the opportunity to play in positions where they will succeed then what is the point in keeping them? Something has to give.

 

[FireMelnyk]

NJ, CLB and Carolina with good nights. Big games tomorrow night other than our own:

Philly v Pitts
Minny v Detroit
Arizona v Chicago
Dallas v Boston

 

[Do Make Say Think]

I just wish the tanking people on here were honest

We are not getting within the top 3, it is not happening and even then, only the top 2 picks are going to have an effect on next year (and there are rumours about Eichel wanting to stay in college)

You do realize this right?

 

[Lehner]

I just wish the tanking people on here were honest

We are not getting within the top 3, it is not happening and even then, only the top 2 picks are going to have an effect on next year (and there are rumours about Eichel wanting to stay in college)

You do realize this right?

I can see Crouse being in the NHL next year, Strome as well.

I like Marner over those 2, but NHL ready those guys could make the step.

 

[Bileur]

I just wish the tanking people on here were honest

We are not getting within the top 3, it is not happening and even then, only the top 2 picks are going to have an effect on next year (and there are rumours about Eichel wanting to stay in college)

You do realize this right?

It's not about next year.

Getting an Eichel or McDavid or whoever else is about long term success. Sure they may have some success in their first season. But you don't win in the playoffs with rookies as your top line centres.

It's the same with any draft pick, it's about laying a foundation for a team that can consistently contend.

This team needs a first line centre. It would be amazing if Zibanejad could find some consistency, refine his game and become that guy but so far he has not proven he can. If we're not tanking, we're banking on him becoming a legit 1st line centre.

 

[Sens Mile]

Re-looked at our core, we are so young and now realize we just need to win so the youth can learn.

The issue is we cannot spend on assets that we wont retain, and we need to move bodies that dont stay, I dont want another Hemsky deal in false hope. Move Methot, Legwand, and Condra to get picks and more prospects- even if we keep improving in the standings. And most importantly, spend some money on another D

 

[DrunkUncleDenis]

Re-looked at our core, we are so young and now realize we just need to win so the youth can learn.

The issue is we cannot spend on assets that we wont retain, and we need to move bodies that dont stay, I dont want another Hemsky deal in false hope. Move Methot, Legwand, and Condra to get picks and more prospects- even if we keep improving in the standings. And most importantly, spend some money on another D

Mhm... so why not just re-sign Methot instead of creating a hole you need to immediately fill?

 

[Sens Mile]

Mhm... so why not just re-sign Methot instead of creating a hole you need to immediately fill?

I'd be fine with that, nut if a deal cannot be found by the deadline than it is time to move on, we cannot lose him for nothing

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Re-looked at our core, we are so young and now realize we just need to win so the youth can learn.

The issue is we cannot spend on assets that we wont retain, and we need to move bodies that dont stay, I dont want another Hemsky deal in false hope. Move Methot, Legwand, and Condra to get picks and more prospects- even if we keep improving in the standings. And most importantly, spend some money on another D

Winning is the best way to win more

Having a bad year like Montreal did in 2011-2012 is fine

When it becomes a trend it's a problem and that's two years in a row that this team sucks

 

[Inf4mous0ne]

I just wish the tanking people on here were honest

We are not getting within the top 3, it is not happening and even then, only the top 2 picks are going to have an effect on next year (and there are rumours about Eichel wanting to stay in college)

You do realize this right?

I doubt we will make it to the top 2. But the third last spot is possible imo (not saying highly likely). With that theres the possibility of winning the lottery, you never know. At any rate, getting McDavid, Eichel, Strome, Marner, or Hanifin would go a long way to helping out this team.

 

[StefanW]

I renamed my ongoing look at the Tank over the past year "Tank-alytics" and finished off the section on teams with one top three pick over course of past 20 drafts. You can find it here if you are interested.

Teams with 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6 top-3 picks in past 20 drafts are coming soon--this is very much a work in progress. There are far fewer teams in each of those categories.

 

[ChocolateLeclaire]

Bumping this because...it's over.

Philly has won 4 straight...still 11 points out.

Carolina has gone 4 wins and one OT loss...not even close to getting out of the bottom 4.

Boston 8-1-1 in their last 10. They've woken up.

Senators haven't won back-to-back games since the end of December.

Shut it down.

 

[Sens Rule]

I had hope after the Leafs win. Then we lose. Then hope with the Arizona goalfest... Washington would lose... We beat the Devils... We beat the Caps on Thursday.... But after last night it really is over.

There are lots of positives this season though:

Hoffman and Stone are amazing.

Ryan is playing like a full on leader and is great defensively and all over the ice. We didn't see that before this year. Probably injuries held him back.

Zibanejad is playing great for quite awhile now. Best he had played so far. He might have fully broken out.

Ceci has not slumped and is even more sound and reliable then in the past. Amazing and consistent for such a young defenceman.

Pageau has fully made the NHL and the team. Doubt he sees the AHL again. He is a great 3rd/4th line center. Pest, faceoff guy, energy guy, playmaker. He is only going to improve going forward.

Cowen is at least more consistent. Seems to play well paired with Ceci.

Our young guys are coming through for us.

Karlsson has played like pre-achilles Karlsson for a decent stretch of games.

And we are basically equal in goals for and against and improved with the new coach. We are likely to improve next season. And we have a chance in the lottery in the new draft system... Even if we finish among the best non-playoff teams... And it is a deep draft anyway.

Best thing would be to keep winning... Finish strong, build confidence and get a look at Prince and Peumpel and maybe Wideman.

 

[Icelevel]

not sure i'm as convinced on pageau and zib as you are Sens Rule. The rest, yes.

 

[NilssonTheWall]

We need a #1 C, a top 6 D and more killer instinct to do whatever is damn well takes to win. Last night was a prime example of lackluster play. I didn't see heart at all last night and that can be said about a lot of our games this season.

 

[Inf4mous0ne]

not sure i'm as convinced on pageau and zib as you are Sens Rule. The rest, yes.

I'm fairly convinced on Zib, but Pageau may be a temporary stopgap. For the rest I agree as well. Lots of positives to take from this team.

 

[Bileur]

The sens need to move Legwand now.

If we get a good offer on Neil and Phillips (2nd or more) move them, their preferences be damned. I understand and respect Murray's loyalty to guys who have bled for this team but at the end of the day this is a business and when guys are no longer viable options they should be moved for the benefit of the team.

I really dislike the Patriots but Bellichick's business like attitude of always maximising value of assets and cold-bloodedly trading/cutting key lockerroom guys like Milloy and Mankins when their on-field talent diminishes are part of what makes that team great.

I've been really impressed by Methot's impact since returning. I have to eat some crow, if we can get him signed it would be a benefit for Karlsson. That being said, sign him now. If he does not sign, trade him before the deadline. We can't afford to lose him for nothing when we could get at least a 2nd in return. Particularly when we have no chance at the playoffs.

I had hope after the Leafs win. Then we lose. Then hope with the Arizona goalfest... Washington would lose... We beat the Devils... We beat the Caps on Thursday.... But after last night it really is over.

It's been over for several weeks. You don't make it back from 10 points out in January. Particularly not when there aren't any mentally weak teams like the Leafs in the top 8. This type of wishful thinking isn't helpful to the team in the long run.

From the organization it's just BS to keep selling tickets for the rest of the year.

I think Bert said it earlier in this thread or somewhere in another. I'd rather pay to see this team develop it's young players with a clear plan towards the future than keep playing over the hill players in an effort to stay in a race when we're clearly not nearly good enough to make the playoffs.

 

[benjiv1]

Sens may not necessarily need a prototypical #1 Centre.

They need a Centre that can play tough defensive match ups, while still producing offensively.

If the Sens could get O’Reilly for example, I think we could surround our centres with good wingers, and be no worse for wear.