GDT: Devils vs. Penguins - 7:00PM MSG+2

[Emperoreddy]

Who else were we going to lean on last year? Moore? Schlemko? That pairing was going to draw the tough minutes no matter what. And they were damn good at what they did, so why are we complaining about it now?

It was beyond that. He might as of well played one pairing. It is lucky they didn't break down. Again Pete/Hydra did not do this and the defense wasn't any worse for it.

I have yet to get one solid argument that Hynes makes this team better. A vague vision isn't one. Never mind this team doesn't even know who is supposed to support who, who is supposed to attack when. The rush might as well be a free for all.

The idea of the D getting more involved in the offense is nice but they shouldn't be leading the rush when the forwards don't know how or when to fall back in support.

There are systemic mistakes all over the ice and they make the same mistakes every single night from game 1. They just didn't get bit in the ass as much in the first 15 and Cory was on his game. Puck luck dries up along with Cory slumping and all the warts get exposed

Bone headed plays is execution. The same mistakes from a game plan perspective, every night, is a failure of the coach to either properly teach the system or make adjustments to cater to the players weakness.

Never mind his questionable line up choices, and how he has a tendency to throw lines into a blender (expect when the team loses 6 straight. Then he sticks with the same lines for some reason).

You could Weber and Subban on this team tomorrow and they would make the same stupid mistakes and still struggle.

All the talent in the world means crap when you don't know where your teammates are going to be, or you don't trust them to be where they need to be.

I bet anything this is why Cory is struggling. He expects his D to do certain things. They aren't and he knows it so he is trying to over compensate to make up for it. It doesn't take that much to throw a goalie completely off his game.

Once his game is off routine saves stop being routine as he tries to hard.

I don't even know how Marty would be with such a **** system because I imagiine he would of thrown a **** fit first. Henry would of thrown the entire team under every bus in NYC and parked them there.

What goalie wants to play in front of guys who regularly screen you?

 

[Triumph]

I have yet to get one solid argument that Hynes makes this team better.

That's because there isn't one. There is never going to be an indisputable argument that a coach makes a team better. At best, you can compare a coach to the person who comes before and after him and say that relative to those people he didn't make the team worse. But there's usually lots of personnel changes that happen around coach firings and so you have nothing to compare it to.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

It was beyond that. He might as of well played one pairing. It is lucky they didn't break down. Again Pete/Hydra did not do this and the defense wasn't any worse for it.

I have yet to get one solid argument that Hynes makes this team better. A vague vision isn't one. Never mind this team doesn't even know who is supposed to support who, who is supposed to attack when. The rush might as well be a free for all.

The idea of the D getting more involved in the offense is nice but they shouldn't be leading the rush when the forwards don't know how or when to fall back in support.

There are systemic mistakes all over the ice and they make the same mistakes every single night from game 1. They just didn't get bit in the ass as much in the first 15 and Cory was on his game. Puck luck dries up along with Cory slumping and all the warts get exposed

Bone headed plays is execution. The same mistakes from a game plan perspective, every night, is a failure of the coach to either properly teach the system or make adjustments to cater to the players weakness.

Never mind his questionable line up choices, and how he has a tendency to throw lines into a blender (expect when the team loses 6 straight. Then he sticks with the same lines for some reason).

You could Weber and Subban on this team tomorrow and they would make the same stupid mistakes and still struggle.

All the talent in the world means crap when you don't know where your teammates are going to be, or you don't trust them to be where they need to be.

I bet anything this is why Cory is struggling. He expects his D to do certain things. They aren't and he knows it so he is trying to over compensate to make up for it. It doesn't take that much to throw a goalie completely off his game.

Once his game is off routine saves stop being routine as he tries to hard.

I don't even know how Marty would be with such a **** system because I imagiine he would of thrown a **** fit first. Henry would of thrown the entire team under every bus in NYC and parked them there.

What goalie wants to play in front of guys who regularly screen you?

You make it sounds like a coach is the main reason for the teams success or failures. If that's the case, is Babcock a average coach since the Leafs are pretty average?

In a rebuild, you try and implement a culture, a playing style and it's not going to take 20 games for them to click on all cylinders. You can also add that acquiring a piece like Hall and losing a piece like Larsson flips everything around cause their game plan went from playing "rope a dope" to a more aggressive system. Do we have ALL the proper pieces to play such a way, of course not. However, I do think that we're trying to find the right pieces to fit into place and unfortunately for several posters around here, it comes to the detriment of trying to win games the "boring" way, the way management wants to move on from cause like you mentionnes, the Greene/Larsson pairing was the main key in making that system work.

We're trying to change several things and it'll take weeks, months and probably years for us to see the final results of what Shero is trying to build... hence the definition of the word "rebuild"

 

[RememberTheName]

You make it sounds like a coach is the main reason for the teams success or failures. If that's the case, is Babcock a average coach since the Leafs are pretty average?

Well, for your first paragraph, Mike Babcock is an above average coach making a bottom 5 team look average. In this case, Hynes is a below average coach making an average team look bottom 5

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

Well, for your first paragraph, Mike Babcock is an above average coach making a bottom 5 team look average. In this case, Hynes is a below average coach making an average team look bottom 5

The Leafs have some solid talent on their current roster. Guys like Nylander, Marner, Matthews, Kadri, JVR, Reilly, etc somsaying their a bottom 5 team isn't quite accurate IMO.

 

[Emperoreddy]

The Leafs have some solid talent on their current roster. Guys like Nylander, Marner, Matthews, Kadri, JVR, Reilly, etc somsaying their a bottom 5 team isn't quite accurate IMO.

Their D is really awful. They have some of the worst pairings in the league according to their own fans.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

Their D is really awful. They have some of the worst pairings in the league according to their own fans.

I'd say their D isn't better or worse then ours.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Babcock's teams play with structure. Can't really say the same for Hynes' team this year. Of course, Hynes is probably a lot cheaper than Babcock. I guess we got what we paid for: went for the thrift store coach to match our ragamuffin defense.

 

[Devils Dominion]

Babcock's teams play with structure. Can't really say the same for Hynes' team this year. Of course, Hynes is probably a lot cheaper than Babcock. I guess we got what we paid for: went for the thrift store coach to match our ragamuffin defense.

His Detroit teams did but not last year's TML team.
Havnt watched enough of them this season but they blew a 3-0 lead to an offensive challenged squad earlier this season.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

His Detroit teams did but not last year's TML team.
Havnt watched enough of them this season but they blew a 3-0 lead to an offensive challenged squad earlier this season.

I don't watch TML that much either, to be honest, but a general pattern of Mike Babcock teams is they tend to play with structure. He's established a track record that indicates he can get teams to play with structure. Right now, Hynes' track record in this league is spotty at best. Currently my confidence in him is quite low. Basically, with Mike Babcock, you are getting a track record of success or at least competence at the NHL level; with Hynes, you only hope that you are getting that. This season that hope doesn't look so well-placed...

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

I don't watch TML that much either, to be honest, but a general pattern of Mike Babcock teams is they tend to play with structure. He's established a track record that indicates he can get teams to play with structure. Right now, Hynes' track record in this league is spotty at best. Currently my confidence in him is quite low. Basically, with Mike Babcock, you are getting a track record of success or at least competence at the NHL level; with Hynes, you only hope that you are getting that. This season that hope doesn't look so well-placed...

Honestly, the confidence you have in our head coach is pretty irrelevant cause no matter what you'll say or think, won't change a damn thing. You can either choose to see what management is trying to implement or choose to pout and spit the same garbage day, after day, after day, after day.

It's funny cause I didn't hear a thing from you last year, or the start of our season for that matter, despite playing at the same pace we did the year before. It's when we hit a rough patch that you see the difference between level headed fans and impatient fans. I chose to be part of that first group cause changing the culture of a franchise won't happen overnight... especially when you're taking over a complete mess left by the previous regime.

I don't care if you bring in Scotty Bowman with Jacques Lemaire, the way Shero wants us to play will fit the players he's trying to bring in our organization... not to mold stop gaps like Quincey, Kalinin, Fiddler, etc

P.S. In regards to Babcock, he also had the luxury of having a stacked squad in Detroit with one of the best blueliners who ever played the game. Can't say the same about the roster Hynes had to deal with in his first 2 years behind a NHL bench but that's probably irrelevant.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Honestly, the confidence you have in our head coach is pretty irrelevant cause no matter what you'll say or think, won't change a damn thing. You can either choose to see what management is trying to implement or choose to pout and spit the same garbage day, after day, after day, after day.

It's funny cause I didn't hear a thing from you last year, or the start of our season for that matter, despite playing at the same pace we did the year before. It's when we hit a rough patch that you see the difference between level headed fans and impatient fans. I chose to be part of that first group cause changing the culture of a franchise won't happen overnight... especially when you're taking over a complete mess left by the previous regime.

I don't care if you bring in Scotty Bowman with Jacques Lemaire, the way Shero wants us to play will fit the players he's trying to bring in our organization... not to mold stop gaps like Quincey, Kalinin, Fiddler, etc

P.S. In regards to Babcock, he also had the luxury of having a stacked squad in Detroit with one of the best blueliners who ever played the game. Can't say the same about the roster Hynes had to deal with in his first 2 years behind a NHL bench but that's probably irrelevant.

None of what we say or do here will impact management or the decisions made with regard to this team. This is a discussion forum, not some sort of organization for change or for running the Devils. This is a place where we can express our thoughts and feelings and opinions about this team, so that's what I choose to do here. I'm using the forum as it was intended, so nothing could really be more relevant than that.

Not sure what you could've heard from me or not heard from me last year, since you only joined in June, but anyway, my posts are regarding this season and the job Hynes is doing now, not last year,.

A coach is responsible for getting all players to fit into his system. Developing the future of certain athletes is obviously more important than others (though I don't see much sign that Hynes is working wonders on Zacha, for instance)but getting a team to play a coherent system with the roster it has in the present, not hopefully has in the future, is part of a coach's job.

You are the one who brought up Babcock as an example to defend Hynes.I merely pointed out that Hynes is quite different than Babcock and really not a legitimate comparison. If we are in agreement about that, I think it was you who made the irrelevant statement. (Though, for the record, Babcock still had Detroit playing an effective defensive system without Lidstrom...)

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

None of what we say or do here will impact management or the decisions made with regard to this team. This is a discussion forum, not some sort of organization for change or for running the Devils. This is a place where we can express our thoughts and feelings and opinions about this team, so that's what I choose to do here. I'm using the forum as it was intended, so nothing could really be more relevant than that.

Not sure what you could've heard from me or not heard from me last year, since you only joined in June, but anyway, my posts are regarding this season and the job Hynes is doing now, not last year,.

A coach is responsible for getting all players to fit into his system. Developing the future of certain athletes is obviously more important than others (though I don't see much sign that Hynes is working wonders on Zacha, for instance)but getting a team to play a coherent system with the roster it has in the present, not hopefully has in the future, is part of a coach's job.

You are the one who brought up Babcock as an example to defend Hynes.I merely pointed out that Hynes is quite different than Babcock and really not a legitimate comparison. If we are in agreement about that, I think it was you who made the irrelevant statement. (Though, for the record, Babcock still had Detroit playing an effective defensive system without Lidstrom...)

I joined in June but was reading this board for over a decade... just decided to log in and add some negativity to my life, so what better place then HF, right?

In regards to the rest, it's just pointless. Overacting and complaining seems to be your narrative, so common sense is pretty useless when going back and forth with you.

- "Let's fire the coach, cause we're on a losing streak and we look disorganized and lost"
- "Hynes isn't working wonders with Zacha"

Those are comments I hear from you on a daily basis (mostly the 1st part but the Zacha comment cracked me up so I had to slide it in there), yet, you always forget to look at the big picture. You're like a little kid who wants it's cake and eat it too. It's a process, it's a rebuild and the second you'll understand that it won't happen in a heartbeat, your life will be a little brighter and less bleak.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

I joined in June but was reading this board for over a decade... just decided to log in and add some negativity to my life, so what better place then HF, right?

In regards to the rest, it's just pointless. Overacting and complaining seems to be your narrative, so common sense is pretty useless when going back and forth with you.

- "Let's fire the coach, cause we're on a losing streak and we look disorganized and lost"
- "Hynes isn't working wonders with Zacha"

Those are comments I hear from you on a daily basis (mostly the 1st part but the Zacha comment cracked me up so I had to slide it in there), yet, you always forget to look at the big picture. You're like a little kid who wants it's cake and eat it too. It's a process, it's a rebuild and the second you'll understand that it won't happen in a heartbeat, your life will be a little brighter and less bleak.

You don't respond to my points, as per usual, just make ad hominem attacks. Shocker.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

You don't respond to my points, as per usual, just make ad hominem attacks. Shocker.

What points? Last I checked, complaining isn't a point.

Please, can you "bullet point" your points, I'll gladly analyze them with a level headed approach.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

What points? Last I checked, complaining isn't a point.

You will find my points in my post. You responded effectively to none of them.

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

You will find my points in my post. You responded effectively to none of them.

Can it be that you had no points, so no answer was needed?

Again, you want this, that and the other. We all want the same thing but when looking at teams who are going through a rebuild/losing streak, you won't see structure, discipline and chemistry on a constant basis or else we wouldn't be near the bottom of the standings.

A coach can only do so much with the players that are handed to him. Our blueline is pure garbage and borderline AHL worthy. With that said, what system do you want us to play? The same rope a dope system we had last year, minus Larsson? Do you want a Greene-Lovejoy pairing on the ice 22 to 24 minutes a game?