News Article: Devils drafting and Conte

[devilsblood]

So because guys leave as FA's that's automatically Lou's fault?

No but saying that the system changed, and Lou kept on with business as usual?

I probably said it wrong, and it was most probably inadvertent by Conte but he pinned that on Lou.

 

[NJDevs26]

But how do you blame the system change? That rule is not Devils specific, everyone in the league dealt with that. The rule changed, Lou kept on with quo.

Deal with it how? Who was he supposed to trade before they became FA besides Clarkson and Fayne? Was he supposed to trade Nieds when he was winning a Norris and 1.5 years away from FA? Was he supposed to trade Parise coming off injury and sacrifice 2012 for a mediocre return? Was he supposed to trade Gomez and Martin off first place teams? Was he supposed to buy the KHL to prevent the merc from leaving?

If you want to blame Lou for everything fine, but that doesn't mean that's what Conte is doing, you guys are just looking at those quotes through a prism.

 

[Marv4Life]

It's not FAs leaving that's Lou's fault. It's more of him not doing a good job in replacing them whether through trades, free agency or drafting.

 

[Devils Dominion]

At the time, I don't recall there being much of an uproar. Hoeffel didn't seem like a guy with that much upside, but seemed par for the course for a 57th overall pick. If anything at the time, I think Hoeffel was ranked a little higher by most outlets.

http://www.insidecollegehockey.com/7Archives/Draft/2007/predraft_ranks0536.htm

The Hockey News had Hoeffel #27. ISS had him #22 (although looking at it, that might not have been their final ranking). TSN had him #39.

Here's the snippet about Hoeffel from the NHL's 200+ page draft guide that they provided to the media.

I dug up the 2007 Devils draft day thread here.
Interesting that former HFB poster JaysFanatic was right on the mark within a minute of the pick. So was ECL, about Hoeffel and Frazee.
And check out my post on Page-11

***start on page-6 in case the link takes you to page-1
http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?p=9653721

 

[tailfins]

I dug up the 2007 Devils draft day thread here.
Interesting that former HFB poster JaysFanatic was right on the mark within a minute of the pick. So was ECL, about Hoeffel and Frazee.
And check out my post on Page-11

***start on page-6 in case the link takes you to page-1
http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?p=9653721

Um...I'm not sure what you mean by "right on the mark". Shortly after he said that he thought the Hoeffel pick sucked, he said:

I'm with you on this one. I wanted Torquato.

Which is kinda the point. If you say a 2nd, 3rd, 4th round pick is terrible, odds are that you're going to be right. The actual challenge is being able to identify the picks that are good. Check out some of the names that were thrown around: Torquato, Anderson, Palmieri, Teddy Ruth. None of those guys amounted to anything. So, saying Hoeffel was going to be bad - fine. But, saying they should have drafted Torquao instead. That poster's not looking like a genius.

 

[Richer's Ghost]

It's funny how many names people wanted that have been busts. But they were right about that guy we took that was a bust! "I was right!"

mmm hmmm

 

[JimEIV]

Angelo Esposito Bro!

 

[GhostofKenKlee]

The armchairing GMing is getting interesting. Citing an almost SEVEN year old thread on a pick and doing a dance about it is unique.

 

[Wingman77]

It's funny how many names people wanted that have been busts. But they were right about that guy we took that was a bust! "I was right!"

mmm hmmm

The armchairing GMing is getting interesting. Citing an almost SEVEN year old thread on a pick and doing a dance about it is unique.

Welcome to the age of social media; where people need a soap box for self validation and recognition

 

[Devils Dominion]

Um...I'm not sure what you mean by "right on the mark". Shortly after he said that he thought the Hoeffel pick sucked, he said:



Which is kinda the point. If you say a 2nd, 3rd, 4th round pick is terrible, odds are that you're going to be right. The actual challenge is being able to identify the picks that are good. Check out some of the names that were thrown around: Torquato, Anderson, Palmieri, Teddy Ruth. None of those guys amounted to anything. So, saying Hoeffel was going to be bad - fine. But, saying they should have drafted Torquao instead. That poster's not looking like a genius.

I was referring to Hoeffel.

A few of us were clearly not happy with Conte's pick that day-and for good reason it turns out.
The dude was an awful player then and nothing has changed.
Good chance he will be out of hockey in a season or two.

Props to the guy who said both Frazee and Hoeffel will bust back in 2007.
I propose that we hire him to replace Conte.

 

[Richer's Ghost]

I was referring to Hoeffel.

A few of us were clearly not happy with Conte's pick that day-and for good reason it turns out.
The dude is an awful player and will be out of hockey in a season or two.

Props to the guy who said both Frazee and Hoeffel will bust back in 2007.
I propose that we hire him to replace Conte.

so you'd hire the guy who was wrong about his own picks just because he was right about Conte's picks.

Solid.

 

[Devils Dominion]

so you'd hire the guy who was wrong about his own picks just because he was right about Conte's picks.

Solid.

No no no, that's not what I said.

Hire ECL, who said he hated the Hoeffel and Frazee picks, back in 2007.

You are referring to JaysFanatic, a different poster (who is missed here BTW).

 

[Richer's Ghost]

No no no, that's not what I said.

Hire ECL, who said he hated the Hoeffel and Frazee picks, back in 2007.

You are referring to JaysFanatic, a different poster (who is missed here BTW).

so who would ECL have taken? Can't just point at flaws without offering solutions. Until someone proves they do a better job you don't just switch from bad to worse.

 

[Devils Dominion]

so who would ECL have taken? Can't just point at flaws without offering solutions. Until someone proves they do a better job you don't just switch from bad to worse.

I didn't think I would have to say it, but, it was a joke.

But, it's fun to go back in time when our draft picks were made and see fan reaction at the time, without being a Monday morning QB.

 

[Brooklyndevil]

It's not a terrible article. And I don't blame Conte for all that went wrong. However, I do blame him for the two Swedes JJ and Teddy. If one of them would have panned out it wouldn't be bad, however, I consider both busts even though JJ is playing and at times has contributed. And we're still waiting for Matteau to make the team....hopefully.

 

[Brodeur]

It's not a terrible article. And I don't blame Conte for all that went wrong. However, I do blame him for the two Swedes JJ and Teddy. If one of them would have panned out it wouldn't be bad, however, I consider both busts even though JJ is playing and at times has contributed. And we're still waiting for Matteau to make the team....hopefully.

While I'm disappointed, I'm not sure blame is the word I'd use. Judging 18 year olds is going to be an inexact science.

I followed the Kings closely during those two drafts and they had some misfires as well. And I think most would consider them to be one of the better drafting clubs.

In 2008, they traded #17 and #28 to move up for Colten Teubert whom they seemed to have immediate buyer's remorse. They intended to draft Viktor Tikhonov at #32, but got sniped by the Coyotes. Instead they took Slava Voynov there, so perhaps they lucked out (well, until recently).

In 2009, I remember reading a pre-draft article about Tomas Tatar. He was asked which team had shown the most interest in him and he said that he had met the most with the Kings. LA ended up taking Kyle Clifford over him in the 2nd round.

 

[Emperoreddy]

It's not a terrible article. And I don't blame Conte for all that went wrong. However, I do blame him for the two Swedes JJ and Teddy. If one of them would have panned out it wouldn't be bad, however, I consider both busts even though JJ is playing and at times has contributed. And we're still waiting for Matteau to make the team....hopefully.

Tedy was ranked by TSN as 26th overall and we took him at 24. It wasn't a reach at all, and most likely was a bit of a home run pick considering the state of that draft and where we were picking.

The only guy that turned into anything around that spot was Eberle, but you can blame the trade with Washington that set us back a few spots for an extra 2nd if you want. (Though that extra second was Cormier who was put into the Kovy deal).

In 2009 again who else were we going to take? JJ was ranked 16th by TSN and we got him at 20.

 

[Bleedred]

Did anyone ever read the article where Tedenby was the best offensive player after Stamkos in that draft? The same article said he was also a great two way player.

 

[glenwo2]

It's not a terrible article. And I don't blame Conte for all that went wrong. However, I do blame him for the two Swedes JJ and Teddy. If one of them would have panned out it wouldn't be bad, however, I consider both busts even though JJ is playing and at times has contributed. And we're still waiting for Matteau to make the team....hopefully.

The only way Matteau makes it here is if Zubrus is kicked to the curb.

Boosh has gotten how many stints up with the Big team again? Several.

Matteau only had that stint immediately after being drafted(and the Devils having to force a year to burn from the ELC or whatever that is. I'm clueless).

If and when he does get brought up, it would be the first time since being sent down the first time that we see just how developed he's gotten.

 

[nugg]

I never liked the Josefson pick. Another "safe" defensive forward with little offensive upside. Turns out he has 0 offense and can't stay healthy

Don't like the Matteau pick either. Because of his dad and again, little offensive upside

Same with the Quenneville pick. Not enough offense, and now he's concussed

Mike Hoeffel was also a terrible pick (Lou : "but...but, he's an American, and he went to College, and he's responsible defensively. Who cares about goals!?") Nick Spaling and Wayne Simmonds went right after him.

And when Lou does pick the offensive player it's the wrong one (Tedenby) leaving John Carlson and Tyler Ennis to go shortly after him)

And taking Vasyunov when Jamie McBain went 4 picks after (where's your American/College fetish when you need it now Lou!?) was also a major miss.

Devils have the 52nd and 54th pick in the 2nd round of the 2008 draft. Who do they pick? Brandon Burlon and Patrice Cormier. Who goes 53? Travis Hamonic. Ouch.

Kirill Tulupov. Who are 4 of the next 5 players drafted? Eric Gryba, Cal Clutterbuck, Brad Marchand, and Steve Mason. Bad bad job there. This is where Lou used to find value. Not anymore

Jeff Frazee. 2nd round pick in 2005. Who goes right after? Ondrej Pavelec, Justin Abdelkader, Paul Stastny. And then Mason Raymond a bit further down. But no, we needed Ari Ahonen v.2.0 (Lou: "But he's an AMERICAN, who's going to COLLEGE, got to stock up on those college hockey americans!")

If you really dissect it this is very bad drafting record. Maybe not an F...but probably like a D or D+

I'll NEVER figure that one out. We even had his Dad!

 

[goawaygary*]

I'll NEVER figure that one out. We even had his Dad!

Not drafting Claude's kid is going to hurt is too.

 

[nugg]

Oh dag, when I read that in the story the first time I thought that was Lou's quote.

Conte is definitely calling out Lou there.

I don't see it as a slight on Lou in the least, just explaining that those picks don't happen anymore, ie. less prospects as a whole.

 

[Emperoreddy]

I'll NEVER figure that one out. We even had his Dad!

They figured they needed to get a goalie in the system since Marty wasn't getting any younger. Frazee was ranked higher then Quick by central scouting. He was expected to be better then he currently is.

It happens, means every scout got this one wrong.

 

[Emperoreddy]

Not drafting Claude's kid is going to hurt is too.

WAY to soon to know this.

 

[Sykie]

It's not a terrible article. And I don't blame Conte for all that went wrong. However, I do blame him for the two Swedes JJ and Teddy. If one of them would have panned out it wouldn't be bad, however, I consider both busts even though JJ is playing and at times has contributed. And we're still waiting for Matteau to make the team....hopefully.

To be fair, Jacob Josefson was better rated than Marcus Johansson on most places. So maybe it's not all about drafting, but it's about developping players. And developping players is not Conte's business.