Devils 2016-17 team discussion (player news and notes) - Part XIV

[devilsblood]

I think Bertuzzi was still a pretty good player at the time, but I always thought that trade was pretty crummy for the Panthers. And didn't Bertuzzi get injured very early in that season and wound up only playing like a handful of games, before getting healthy at the deadline and being shipped to Detroit?

I think that package was still pretty weak, considering Luongo was the best under 30 goalie in the world at the time and top 2 overall. Remember, Lundqvist had only played one year in the NHL at that time.

They wound up getting Vokoun a year later, who was like 31 or 32 by that time, but easily a top 5-10 goalie. He had some really good years in Florida, much like Luongo. They just stunk and always missed the playoffs and never went anywhere.

Ya Bertuzzi did have 25g's and 71 pt's the year prior. He really only had 2 years in his career better then that. And then as noted looks like he was injured for about the entirety of the year before being traded to Detroit.

Still Triumph's point stands. Don't trade a top young goalie for a 31 yr old PF.

 

[tailfins]

amazing to think about what the threads would be like here if this team struggled for a few years in marty's prime.

if we trade cory, and i dont think we should (i say that as someone who was disappointed when we beat the flyers) we absolutely need to get a #1 goalie back anyway. when what we really need are prospects and picks. if we went with wedgewood/kinky until blackwood is ready, this forum would probably be sponsored by prozac.

I'm not sure the point of this post.

This team has won 28 out of 79 games. 28 wins, 51 losses. If they win out, they'll still have gone backwards by 7 wins, but it's much more likely they'll have dropped 9-10 wins vs last year.

The only other teams that were bad last year and got significantly worse are Colorado, Vancouver and Arizona. It's not great company.

If this board isn't already sponsored by Prozac, it's only because there's no one left. The Flyers GDT was done after 13 pages.

The real danger facing the Devils is fan apathy.

 

[RememberTheName]

There aren't really many teams that would want to trade for Schneider, even though he is a very good goalie. The teams that I see that might be willing to trade for Schneider are Calgary, Winnipeg, Dallas, Carolina, NY Isles, Philly, and maybe Ottawa. All of these teams dont really have a phenomenal goalie, but the rest of their roster is pretty good. I don't think the Devils would trade with Philly, so just cross that off. That leaves 6 possible teams. What kind of package do you guys think that each of them could put together. Ill just make a list of what I think could be correct values for each team

Calgary: Sam Bennett, Mark Jankowski, Tyler Parsons
Winnipeg: Connor Hellebuyck, Jack Roslovic/Kyle Connor, 3 rp
Dallas: Julius Honka, Roope Hintz, Kari Lehtonen, 1 rp
Carolina: Noah Hanifin, Alex Nedeljokvic
NY Isles: Matt Barzal, Ilya Sorokin, 2 rp
Ottawa: Colin White (Now we can have both of them, and Colton), Cody Ceci, 1 rp

What do you guys think

 

[MartyOwns]

I'm not sure the point of this post.

This team has won 28 out of 79 games. 28 wins, 51 losses. If they win out, they'll still have gone backwards by 7 wins, but it's much more likely they'll have dropped 9-10 wins vs last year.

The only other teams that were bad last year and got significantly worse are Colorado, Vancouver and Arizona. It's not great company.

If this board isn't already sponsored by Prozac, it's only because there's no one left. The Flyers GDT was done after 13 pages.

The real danger facing the Devils is fan apathy.

i would wholeheartedly disagree that our biggest danger is fan apathy. the days of relocation threats are far gone.

also not sure about the winning% comments. i would prefer we lose out the rest of the year, but im assuming we'll get at least 1 more W. when its time to be competitive, hopefully by the 2018-2019 season, id rather have a known entity in corey and start working in blackwood.

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

There aren't really many teams that would want to trade for Schneider, even though he is a very good goalie. The teams that I see that might be willing to trade for Schneider are Calgary, Winnipeg, Dallas, Carolina, NY Isles, Philly, and maybe Ottawa. All of these teams dont really have a phenomenal goalie, but the rest of their roster is pretty good. I don't think the Devils would trade with Philly, so just cross that off. That leaves 6 possible teams. What kind of package do you guys think that each of them could put together. Ill just make a list of what I think could be correct values for each team

Calgary: Sam Bennett, Mark Jankowski, Tyler Parsons
Winnipeg: Connor Hellebuyck, Jack Roslovic/Kyle Connor, 3 rp
Dallas: Julius Honka, Roope Hintz, Kari Lehtonen, 1 rp
Carolina: Noah Hanifin, Alex Nedeljokvic
NY Isles: Matt Barzal, Ilya Sorokin, 2 rp
Ottawa: Colin White (Now we can have both of them, and Colton), Cody Ceci, 1 rp

What do you guys think

Given his down year, I just don't think Schneider would return anything close to what would make it worth moving a top-5 starting goalie. I'm sure GMs are bigger-picture thinkers, and would overlook this anomaly of a season, but it isn't wise to sell low... especially considering Cory is one of our only bluechip players.

It would seriously prolong the rebuild. If Blackwood continues to progress, we can revisit the concept in a few seasons. Where it stands, Cory should stay.

 

[Brooklyndevil]

Given his down year, I just don't think Schneider would return anything close to what would make it worth moving a top-5 starting goalie. I'm sure GMs are bigger-picture thinkers, and would overlook this anomaly of a season, but it isn't wise to sell low... especially considering Cory is one of our only bluechip players.

It would seriously prolong the rebuild. If Blackwood continues to progress, we can revisit the concept in a few seasons. Where it stands, Cory should stay.

I have to agree. Cory is definitely getting overvalued, especially after his performance this year and not just him it seems to be goaltenders in general.

 

[Better Call Sal]

i would wholeheartedly disagree that our biggest danger is fan apathy. the days of relocation threats are far gone.

also not sure about the winning% comments. i would prefer we lose out the rest of the year, but im assuming we'll get at least 1 more W. when its time to be competitive, hopefully by the 2018-2019 season, id rather have a known entity in corey and start working in blackwood.

I completely agree.

 

[RememberTheName]

I have to agree. Cory is definitely getting overvalued, especially after his performance this year and not just him it seems to be goaltenders in general.

I mean fair enough. Lets say this season was just a fluke and next season he continued to perform as a top 5 starter. Then how would the packages be?

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

I mean fair enough. Lets say this season was just a fluke and next season he continued to perform as a top 5 starter. Then how would the packages be?

Better.. ?

I mean, if he performs like a top-5 starter next year, I think we have a shot at a wild card spot. I'm certain Shero will add some more talent to the roster next year; it's almost a guarantee, given our roster flexibility, cap space, and ability to take on excess players from teams with positional surpluses going into the expansion draft.

And if the above comes true, and Cory plays like a star, there won't even be a discussion about moving him.

 

[217 Forever]

Better.. ?

I mean, if he performs like a top-5 starter next year, I think we have a shot at a wild card spot. I'm certain Shero will add some more talent to the roster next year; it's almost a guarantee, given our roster flexibility, cap space, and ability to take on excess players from teams with positional surpluses going into the expansion draft.

And if the above comes true, and Cory plays like a star, there won't even be a discussion about moving him.

That's a whole bunch of "ifs" my friend...

 

[MachoDiablo]

Right, there's not much sense in dealing Cory while his value is down, which it certainly is after this season. It could turn out this season was a bit of a fluke, but the market isn't great right now and he won't bring back what he's otherwise capable of netting.

The only exceptions there are if you get an out-of-left-field deal that bowls you over, or if the team is convinced that Cory is well and truly declining and that this is the best time to cut losses, but I highly doubt either situations is happening.

 

[devilsblood]

As per fan apathy.

Bad teams are just not going to get alot of fan consideration. So small gdt's at the end of an awful season? Not an a red flag imo.

In truth I'd say attendance has looked pretty good this year considering how bad we are and for how long.

I think when the team does turn it around we, and moreso ownership, will be pretty happy with fan interest and turnout.

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

That's a whole bunch of "ifs" my friend...

Oh, of course. A ton

I don't think it's that far-fetched to say Shero will be adding more talent to the roster this summer. The "if's" come into play when we start speculating who he'll be adding, what position he'll be seeking, how he'll be adding them...

 

[MichaelJ]

ESPN ranked the teams that were on most players' no-trade lists and as the least desirable destinations. The Devils were not on the list.

The list:
1. Winnipeg Jets (22 points)
2. Edmonton Oilers (7 points)
3. New York Islanders (6 points)
4. Arizona Coyotes (5 points)
5. Florida Panthers (3.5 points)

Honorable mentions:
Buffalo Sabres (3 points)
Calgary, Colorado, Columbus, Ottawa, Toronto (1 point)

 

[Tundra]

ESPN ranked the teams that were on most players' no-trade lists and as the least desirable destinations. The Devils were not on the list.

The list:
1. Winnipeg Jets (22 points)
2. Edmonton Oilers (7 points)
3. New York Islanders (6 points)
4. Arizona Coyotes (5 points)
5. Florida Panthers (3.5 points)

Honorable mentions:
Buffalo Sabres (3 points)
Calgary, Colorado, Columbus, Ottawa, Toronto (1 point)

Since Lou left, our image has improved, I remember that we were once on this list.

 

[Cheddabombs]

Wow not even on the honourable mentions, nice. I remember when we were on that list, guess times change. Lou's policies were very restrictive so I could see why new-age players may not want to play under those kinds of rules.

Someone show Shattenkirk that, see we're desirable!

 

[Billdo]

Is Winnipeg that bad to live in? I know nothing about it.

 

[Devils Dominion]

Is Winnipeg that bad to live in? I know nothing about it.

Brutally frigid and long winters.
Small town.

 

[Tundra]

Is Winnipeg that bad to live in? I know nothing about it.

The travel is atrocious. That's the big thing against Winnipeg.

 

[Zippy316]

How it works: We asked nine agents to list the top three teams most often listed on no-trade clauses. It’s an inexact science, since players often have no-trade lists much longer and other players have a list of teams to which they can be traded. So in some cases, it’s an estimate of teams listed most frequently or mentioned most frequently in no-trade conversations.

We awarded teams listed first three points, second two points and third one point to get the point total.

That's how they made the list. I guess it's nice to know the Devils aren't the most undesirable team for the majority of players, but it's not like they took the 10 team list from every player.

 

[Cheddabombs]

Brutally frigid and long winters.
Small town.

The travel is atrocious. That's the big thing against Winnipeg.

Both of these, more so the former. The weather isn't pleasant, at least relative other markets.

 

[MullerBrotenVerbeek]

Brutally frigid and long winters.
Small town.

In addition to these fantastic feathers in their cap, isn't it a surprisingly violent city with a lot of crime?

 

[None Shall Pass]

In addition to these fantastic feathers in their cap, isn't it a surprisingly violent city with a lot of crime?

That's what happens when there's no parks.

 

[Zippy316]

In addition to these fantastic feathers in their cap, isn't it a surprisingly violent city with a lot of crime?

Because I'm completely bored and decided to look this up, the crime is concentrated in one area of the city, so I don't think that's a major issue. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law,_government,_and_crime_in_Winnipeg

 

[devilsblood]

In addition to these fantastic feathers in their cap, isn't it a surprisingly violent city with a lot of crime?

Dag.

"Winnipeg has long been one of Canada's most violent cities. ... From 2007 to 2012, Winnipeg was the murder capital every year. Over a similar time period, Winnipeg has consistently had the highest rates of robbery, sexual assault, and violent crime index of any large Canadian city."

And more recently.

http://www.winnipegsun.com/2016/07/20/winnipeg-is-canadas-most-violent-city

StatsCan found Winnipeg still had the highest violent crime severity index of all cities studied in 2015. That measure is based on the severity of the crimes committed and the punishments that result from them, as well as the population it relates to.