Devils 2015-16 team discussion (player news & notes) part XIV

[Emperoreddy]

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[Emperoreddy]

CHedda, the problem is we got a 2nd for NEXT year's draft. It doesn't equal value wise to a 2nd in this year's draft because of time.

I mean we can go into the real nitpicking and say because this year's draft is crap and next years might (keyword MIGHT) be stronger that that plus the 4th balances out the loss in value due to time, but I'm not sure how strong an argument that is.

 

[LeedsMonster]

CHedda, the problem is we got a 2nd for NEXT year's draft. It doesn't equal value wise to a 2nd in this year's draft because of time.

I mean we can go into the real nitpicking and say because this year's draft is crap and next years might (keyword MIGHT) be stronger that that plus the 4th balances out the loss in value due to time, but I'm not sure how strong an argument that is.

The difference in value between a 2nd this year or next is negligible. The pick recoups the perceived gap in value by next year's draft, so I don't get the issue.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

CHedda, the problem is we got a 2nd for NEXT year's draft. It doesn't equal value wise to a 2nd in this year's draft because of time.

I mean we can go into the real nitpicking and say because this year's draft is crap and next years might (keyword MIGHT) be stronger that that plus the 4th balances out the loss in value due to time, but I'm not sure how strong an argument that is.

When it comes down to it, if you're going to make a big stink about what year the pick is, you have to consider the strength of the drafts. It's virtually unanimously agreed upon that it's weak. And if GMs believe it's weak, the value of the pick when dealt is limited. Give me value tomorrow over poop (most likely) today please and thank you.

 

[Zippy316]

I was really crossing my fingers that we were getting Khokhlachev. I thought for sure it was going to be a Stempniak for Khokhlachev swap.

 

[NJDevs26]

The whole pick now having more value than the one later philosophy also led to the #29 kept pick contreversy though

 

[Cheddabombs]

CHedda, the problem is we got a 2nd for NEXT year's draft. It doesn't equal value wise to a 2nd in this year's draft because of time.

I mean we can go into the real nitpicking and say because this year's draft is crap and next years might (keyword MIGHT) be stronger that that plus the 4th balances out the loss in value due to time, but I'm not sure how strong an argument that is.

I understand that, though I disagree with it. But just looking at the player Stemps is and what the market dictated the price would be given the deals that went down, I think the deal is more than fair. For sake of argument lets assume the 2nd round pick is going to be in a similar position both years, realistically the depth of the talent available in both drafts would have a negligible difference. That's if we keep the pick. We've seen Shero is not afraid to package picks for a player, or to move up or down, and having a 2nd round pick in general is always a nice throw-in.

I think expectations were too high if people are disappointed from that return.

 

[kiwidevil]

A 2017 2nd is a perfect little asset to move up a couple of spots in a draft. Might take a little more, but if we didn't have it we wouldn't have the choice.

 

[Emperoreddy]

The whole pick now having more value than the one later philosophy also led to the #29 kept pick contreversy though

I stand by that the idea made sense on paper. That draft just really sucked and we picked the wrong guy, but he is gone so that is water under the bridge.

 

[Emperoreddy]

I understand that, though I disagree with it. But just looking at the player Stemps is and what the market dictated the price would be given the deals that went down, I think the deal is more than fair. For sake of argument lets assume the 2nd round pick is going to be in a similar position both years, realistically the depth of the talent available in both drafts would have a negligible difference. That's if we keep the pick. We've seen Shero is not afraid to package picks for a player, or to move up or down, and having a 2nd round pick in general is always a nice throw-in.

I think expectations were too high if people are disappointed from that return.

A 2nd this year is to high? or some kind of prospect?

 

[Cheddabombs]

A 2nd this year is to high? or some kind of prospect?

Maybe that was poor wording. If people are genuinely criticizing getting a 2nd round pick next year, as opposed to this year, I think they are nitpicking too hard. The difference really isn't that much. It's going to be either a similar asset, or a similar valued trade chip.

 

[Emperoreddy]

Maybe that was poor wording. If people are genuinely criticizing getting a 2nd round pick next year, as opposed to this year, I think they are nitpicking too hard. The difference really isn't that much. It's going to be either a similar asset, or a similar valued trade chip.

I guess it depends on what we flip the picks for if we manage to do it. I think we have to flip some of them to get good players further along as we need to start getting a team that can make some noise in front of Cory while we can.

Right now its still more hypotheticals while we at the same time wave the white flag on this season. It could still work out really well for us come draft time, but right now there isn't much reason to be excited IMO.

 

[MadDevil]

Let's hope Boston bottoms out next year.

 

[kiwidevil]

Maybe that was poor wording. If people are genuinely criticizing getting a 2nd round pick next year, as opposed to this year, I think they are nitpicking too hard. The difference really isn't that much. It's going to be either a similar asset, or a similar valued trade chip.

Ppl would be ******** their pants right now if we got a 2016 3rd and 4th for Stempniak.

Or even worse didn't trade him and all he ends up doing is hurting our draft position. .

Shero is doing what we are all thinking. Gaining assets for the future as this team has done all it can, but the playoffs are a bridge too far. Also using the deadline as the best time to purge perceived waste to hungry teams. There was a very good chance we would be waiving Gelinas and Matteau by the end of training camp next year.

 

[Emperoreddy]

Let's hope Boston bottoms out next year.

Rather the pick already be traded for an actual player before then.

 

[HobokenIrish]

Any teams facing some Restricted Free Agent/up against the cap dilemmas like Anaheim was last summer? If so we are in a good position with cap space and picks to step in like we did for Palmieri

 

[Emperoreddy]

Any teams facing some Restricted Free Agent/up against the cap dilemmas like Anaheim was last summer? If so we are in a good position with cap space and picks to step in like we did for Palmieri

Tampa Bay if they keep Stammer. Oilers aren't but they do need to start making some choices on all those forwards and start building the rest of their team (so Yak, maybe even RNH could become available depending on where they end up drafting).

I feel like Chicago has to make cap moves every year.

 

[Devil X]

Lets also remember that we added 2 picks that can be moved either after the 2016 draft or next trade deadline for a young player like Palmieri.

I think because of what we managed to put together everyone moved up our compete time table and i think Shero and company are still on their 4 to 5 year plan.

Add assets when the chances arise, then use those pieces to make other moves.

Adding another second in 2017 and having an extra 3rd could help us get help and totally skip prospect time tables.

I think we need to wait and see how Shero does things before we start to question how valuable a draft pick is. If that pick becomes an NHL really player then we turned Lee Stempniak into a future core offensive player.

That extra 3rd we had in 2016 got us Palmieri who knows what could happen.

 

[Devilsfan992]

Any teams facing some Restricted Free Agent/up against the cap dilemmas like Anaheim was last summer? If so we are in a good position with cap space and picks to step in like we did for Palmieri

Tampa Bay definitely if Stamkos is re-signed.

 

[MichaelJ]

I'm pretty sure this pick is being looked at primarily as a trade asset, either to move up in this draft or include in an offseason deal after the 2016 draft has concluded.

 

[Emperoreddy]

Lets also remember that we added 2 picks that can be moved either after the 2016 draft or next trade deadline for a young player like Palmieri.

I think because of what we managed to put together everyone moved up our compete time table and i think Shero and company are still on their 4 to 5 year plan.

Add assets when the chances arise, then use those pieces to make other moves.

Adding another second in 2017 and having an extra 3rd could help us get help and totally skip prospect time tables.

I think we need to wait and see how Shero does things before we start to question how valueable a draft pick is.

That extra 3rd we had in 2016 got us Palmieri who knows what could happen.

Kind of has to be moved up because if we are keeping Cory we need to help him win, or we are wasting his prime years.

 

[nugg]

I was really crossing my fingers that we were getting Khokhlachev. I thought for sure it was going to be a Stempniak for Khokhlachev swap.

Seth Griffith would have been great too.

 

[Billdo]

I know it's water under the bridge at this point but I wish Lou would've gotten something from San Jose for Deboer. Most teams do it, I know he was set in his ways but that would've been sweet. Now we've got to wait however long for their third for taking Lou. It isn't coming our way this year which is annoying that they have the option.

 

[nugg]

I know it's water under the bridge at this point but I wish Lou would've gotten something from San Jose for Deboer. Most teams do it, I know he was set in his ways but that would've been sweet. Now we've got to wait however long for their third for taking Lou. It isn't coming our way this year which is annoying that they have the option.

Well in that same token, we didn't give up a 2nd or 3rd for Shero either.

 

[JimEIV]

The whole pick now having more value than the one later philosophy also led to the #29 kept pick contreversy though

I still rather have Matteau and Quenneville vs just Fiala.

And now it is Boutros Boutros by-golly-Pelly and Quenneville vs Fiala.

Still like it.