OT: COVID-19 - NO POLITICS (MOD/warning post #527)

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DopeyFish

Mitchy McDangles
Nov 17, 2009
6,642
4,741
I am worried because I am truly running low on toilet paper. I'll be out in a few
days:eek:
here's a hint for people who have bathroom tissue issues

try local small businesses. Convenience stores. Smaller corp chains like Rabba / 7/11 and the like. Local grocery stores.

They're going to be the ones hammered last. People instinctively go to the lowest priced / highest supply stores. When a panic purchase environment kicks off, immediately go to where people wouldn't go.

Sure, you're going to pay a premium. But better to pay the premium than not get what you need.

I went to Rabba right when I heard No Frills was getting slammed... only a few people in the store and was able to pick up everything including TP.
 

leburn98

Registered User
Jan 28, 2013
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The Podium

Registered User
Feb 19, 2010
22,956
10,218
Toronto
For all you folk worrying about the TP crisis at Cosco or wherever, may I suggest you make a run down to your local hardware store and grab a t-connector, some flexible steel/plastic hose and a nozzle gun and go the way of sanity, cleanliness, and bum preservation. A tried and true method, trust me, your bum will thank you. ;-)

View attachment 335355

Those Thailand butt hoses were nice....until you were in a public washroom
 

HoweHullOrr

Registered User
Oct 3, 2013
11,623
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My science teachers talked about this in high school nearly 20 years ago. I'm paraphrasing but it was something along the lines of "the next thing that'll kill millions or even billions won't be war or nuclear weapons being used, it's almost certainly going to be from a virus." History repeats itself and virus' mutate. The fact that you can travel across the world in just hours could really ramp up the next plague.

Yes, pandemic emergency planning, research, testing and development of vaccines is nothing new. Bush administration had it in 2005, Obama in 2010. Here's an excerpt from CIDRAP (Center for Infectious Disease Research & Policy). Cutting budgets and staff reductions have been issues certainly under the current administration (U.S), but probably go back even further.

"Longer-term goals that could streamline pandemic vaccine production even more require federal investments in a broad range of research, the report said."

Obama's science advisors outline plan for faster pandemic vaccine

Bush asks $7.1 billion to prepare for flu pandemic

CIDRAP, Nov 1, 2005

"The White House also released a 17-page version of its preparedness plan, with a promise that the full plan will be released tomorrow morning. The summary gives few specifics, but it does call for:
  • Subsidizing state-based stockpiles of antiviral drugs
  • Possible use of quarantines and restrictions on travel and the shipment of goods
  • Possible use of the military to maintain the nation's infrastructure.
 
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Burnie97

Registered User
Jun 26, 2015
14,260
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It's the first step and their findings will be shared with others around the world.

Also, University of Saskatchewan apparently has a Coronavirus vaccine in the testing phase on animals.

Canada's First Coronavirus Vaccine Made In Saskatchewan Is Now In Testing Stages



Jerusalem's minister of science and technology says they'll have a vaccine ready for human trials within weeks, should be through safety testing in 90 days if all goes well

I heard 12 to 18 months for a working vaccine... so at that rate that seems extremely fast.

However bring that shit on if true. It is possible in some cases. Especially since they have isolated the virus already.

Typically its at least a year from what I've heard on the news etc... but maybe its times like these that advancements in medical science will have even more of a spike. One can hope.
 

Superstar

"Be water, my friend."
Jun 25, 2008
12,471
8,558

This is good right? I'm a bit confused what this means.


Means they could probably extract the genome of this corona virus for greater understanding...perhaps help make a better vaccine or a generic vaccine down the road...in contrast, the SARS virus was so lethal that it killed off it's host so quickly and then died off that scientists didn't get much of a chance to explore in depth of what the SARS virus was all about.
 
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Kiwi

Registered User
Mar 5, 2016
21,097
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The Naki
Yes, pandemic emergency planning, research, testing and development of vaccines is nothing new. Bush administration had it in 2005, Obama in 2010. Here's an excerpt from CIDRAP (Center for Infectious Disease Research & Policy). Cutting budgets and staff reductions have been issues certainly under the current administration (U.S), but probably go back even further.

"Longer-term goals that could streamline pandemic vaccine production even more require federal investments in a broad range of research, the report said."

Obama's science advisors outline plan for faster pandemic vaccine

Bush asks $7.1 billion to prepare for flu pandemic

CIDRAP, Nov 1, 2005

"The White House also released a 17-page version of its preparedness plan, with a promise that the full plan will be released tomorrow morning. The summary gives few specifics, but it does call for:
  • Subsidizing state-based stockpiles of antiviral drugs
  • Possible use of quarantines and restrictions on travel and the shipment of goods
  • Possible use of the military to maintain the nation's infrastructure.

Every year the Trump administration has proposed budgets that cut funding to the CDC and every year Congress ignored him and passed year on year budgets that increased spending to the CDC that Trump signed into law

That's according to the ABC, so you are incorrect when you talk about budgets being cut under this administration, I'm also highly dubious any US administration has cut that budget for decades

Also why am I reading things from 2005 and 2010? That most recent example was a decade ago under a different administration, I don't care what past administrations did years ago I want to know what this administration is doing to fight the pandemic, the rest of that stuff is absolutely pointless
 
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Randy Randerson

Registered User
Jul 28, 2016
10,637
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Hamilton
I heard 12 to 18 months for a working vaccine... so at that rate that seems extremely fast.

However bring that shit on if true. It is possible in some cases. Especially since they have isolated the virus already.

Typically its at least a year from what I've heard on the news etc... but maybe its times like these that advancements in medical science will have even more of a spike. One can hope.
I think there's an element of luck as well

Here's where the Israeli* thing came from: Israeli scientists: 'In a few weeks, we will have coronavirus vaccine'
 

PuckMagi

Registered User
Apr 13, 2013
5,460
1,966
Toronto
Anyone that mocked it owes an apology to @PuckMagi

also big thumbs up to the mods for not shutting down the thread when it was first started

Thanks. I knew when I posted it that some people would mock me or make jokes or whatever. I was actually quite pleasantly surprised at how many other posters here knew all about what was going on and what was about to happen. I had been following this virus closely since mid-January back when I saw all the videos of people collapsing in Wuhan. I was also kind of surprised that the mods allowed the thread... so big thanks to them!

Here was my OP from the 1st thread from Feb. 29th:

This is off-topic and I'm not looking to get into a debate about this if you disagree, but I wanted to warn my fellow Leaf fans.

We are going to have confirmed outbreaks of coronavirus in Canada and the United States over the next week or two. Toronto and Vancouver are the most likely places for it to start spreading. The numbers will get bigger and they will not be able to stop the spread. There will be a run on grocery stores and everyone will be staying in their homes.

I just wanted to warn everyone to get prepared for a SHTF scenario. Stock up on food and whatever else you will need to survive in your house for many months. Get extra supplies so you can help your friends and family who don't prepare. Buy things with a long shelf life that you normally consume anyways. If I'm wrong, you'll use everything eventually. Buy diapers (+ formula if not breast feeding) if you have a baby. Buy lots of pet food if you have pets. Get lots of medication if you need to take prescription medication. Bags of white rice are going to be the most valuable thing you can buy. Toilet paper will be one of the first items to be sold out everywhere.

I don't mean to panic anyone, but this is happening now. Better to panic first before everyone else does. I don't normally discuss politics or topics like this on here. I stick to talking about hockey here. But I figured I might as give a warning to my fellow Leaf fans. The more people who are prepared, the better. I don't have any special inside information or anything like that. I've just been following the developments on this virus very closely for over a month. I'm fully prepped at this point. Just wanted to give everyone a heads up before the craziness starts.

I think it may reach the point where they either have to cancel the NHL season or have teams playing in empty stadiums like they're doing for soccer matches in Italy.


OT: - Coronavirus - Start Prepping
 
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HoweHullOrr

Registered User
Oct 3, 2013
11,623
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Every year the Trump has proposed budgets that cut funding to the CDC and every year Congress ignored him and passed year on year budgets that increased spending to the CDC that Trump signed into law

That's according to the ABC, so you are incorrect when you talk about budgets being cut under this administration, I'm also highly dubious any US administration has cut that budget for decades

You are right about Trump trying to cut CDC and Dept. of Health budgets each year he has been in office, but Congress approving bills funding at higher levels than Trumps budget proposal. However, funding has slightly decreased.

The Forbes article says: "The cuts started in 2018, as the White House focused on eliminating funding to Obama-era disease security programs." Past tense.

"The Trust for America’s Health 2019 report on funding of the public health system includes a chart on CDC funding adjusted for inflation, and that shows a small overall decrease, of $460 million from fiscal 2016 to 2019, or $170 million from fiscal 2017 to 2019."

The most recent emergency response budget for the Corona virus was approved by Congress at a higher amount than the White House proposal (Congress $8.3 B approved, Trump proposal $2.5 B).

Then there are qualified CDC people who have been forced out, and the lack of a job of coordinating a pandemic response in the White House.

"President Obama had instituted the unit in 2016 following a years long Ebola outbreak in West Africa. Trump appointed Ziemer, who had been coordinator of the President’s Malaria Initiative under both President George W. Bush and Obama, to head the office in April 2017."

Ziemer departed abruptly a little over a year later just as a new Ebola outbreak was starting in Congo.

Tom Bossert, a former White House homeland security adviser who helped develop the administration’s biodefense strategy and was the designated lead for coordinating the American response to a biological crisis, was also reportedly pushed out when Bolton took over. Bossert resigned in April 2018, a day after Bolton started as national security adviser. Three anonymous sources told the Washington Post that Bolton requested his resignation.

But the lack of someone in the White House to coordinate the response to a widespread disease outbreak in the U.S. is something numerous experts and groups at the time had cautioned against.

In a November 2019 report, the Center for Strategic & International Studies recommended restoring the global health security position on the NSC as one of seven key changes to better protect the American public from global health threats.

“It remains unclear who would be in charge at the White House in the case of a grave pandemic threat or cross-border biological crisis,” the report reads, noting that such leadership is “critical in navigating challenging political issues like quarantines and travel bans and in communicating to and reassuring the American public.”

The authorities currently in place at HHS are insufficient to address these critical, complex, and often urgent interagency demands,” the report continues. “In addition to coordinating the interagency process, a global health security and biodefense directorate at the NSC can reform fragmented programs and ensure higher efficiencies, strengthened accountability, and better spending of scarce resources.”

Then, there's the issue of Trump (just yesterday) talking about how the testing effort was going well whereas his top health official had to state the testing effort has been a failure.

The testing system for coronavirus in the US is currently failing, a top health official has admitted.
"The system is not really geared to what we need right now... let's admit it," said Dr Anthony Fauci from the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases.


US admits 'failing' on coronavirus testing

I guess some people can find some comfort in the fact that some of Trump's efforts to cut budgets & qualified staff have met with successful resistance, but not sure whether we should all feel hopeful that the necessary intent and understanding is there.
 
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AllDay28

Registered User
Oct 15, 2015
3,611
2,705
Obviously now you are focusing on the stocks after 3 years of record growth. Probably didn't talk about them too much then.

But the fact remains, the US economy is incredibly strong. The strongest in the world, actually. And it will recover, these plunges have absolutely nothing in common with 2008. Dow 30k+ by July.

hes lost all the money hes gained.. but im sure you knew that.

The US stock market has now wiped out the entire $11.5 trillion of value it gained since Trump's 2016 election victory | Markets Insider

that said ive made a pretty 180 turn on this and its a serious thing for older people and hopefully no one comes in contact with it. I mean we most certainly will but ya.
 

Kiwi

Registered User
Mar 5, 2016
21,097
16,087
The Naki
You are right about Trump trying to cut CDC and Dept. of Health budgets each year he has been in office, but Congress approving bills funding at higher levels than Trumps budget proposal. However, funding has slightly decreased.

The Forbes article says: "The cuts started in 2018, as the White House focused on eliminating funding to Obama-era disease security programs." Past tense.

"The Trust for America’s Health 2019 report on funding of the public health system includes a chart on CDC funding adjusted for inflation, and that shows a small overall decrease, of $460 million from fiscal 2016 to 2019, or $170 million from fiscal 2017 to 2019."

The most recent emergency response budget for the Corona virus was approved by Congress at a higher amount than the White House proposal (Congress $8.3 B approved, Trump proposal $2.5 B).

Then there are qualified CDC people who have been forced out, and the lack of a job of coordinating a pandemic response in the White House.

"President Obama had instituted the unit in 2016 following a years long Ebola outbreak in West Africa. Trump appointed Ziemer, who had been coordinator of the President’s Malaria Initiative under both President George W. Bush and Obama, to head the office in April 2017."

Ziemer departed abruptly a little over a year later just as a new Ebola outbreak was starting in Congo.

Tom Bossert, a former White House homeland security adviser who helped develop the administration’s biodefense strategy and was the designated lead for coordinating the American response to a biological crisis, was also reportedly pushed out when Bolton took over. Bossert resigned in April 2018, a day after Bolton started as national security adviser. Three anonymous sources told the Washington Post that Bolton requested his resignation.

But the lack of someone in the White House to coordinate the response to a widespread disease outbreak in the U.S. is something numerous experts and groups at the time had cautioned against.

In a November 2019 report, the Center for Strategic & International Studies recommended restoring the global health security position on the NSC as one of seven key changes to better protect the American public from global health threats.

“It remains unclear who would be in charge at the White House in the case of a grave pandemic threat or cross-border biological crisis,” the report reads, noting that such leadership is “critical in navigating challenging political issues like quarantines and travel bans and in communicating to and reassuring the American public.”

The authorities currently in place at HHS are insufficient to address these critical, complex, and often urgent interagency demands,” the report continues. “In addition to coordinating the interagency process, a global health security and biodefense directorate at the NSC can reform fragmented programs and ensure higher efficiencies, strengthened accountability, and better spending of scarce resources.”

Then, there's the issue of Trump (just yesterday) talking about how the testing effort was going well whereas his top health official had to state the testing effort has been a failure.

The testing system for coronavirus in the US is currently failing, a top health official has admitted.
"The system is not really geared to what we need right now... let's admit it," said Dr Anthony Fauci from the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases.


US admits 'failing' on coronavirus testing

I guess some people can find some comfort in the fact that some of Trump's efforts to cut budgets & qualified staff have met with successful resistance, but not sure whether we should all feel hopeful that the necessary intent and understanding is there.

Forgive me if I'm wrong but did that say cut when adjusted for inflation? Because if that's the case the budget has increased year on year not decreased, that's a neat little accounting trick that shows the current administration in the worst possible light now doesn't it?

The president get to choose who's in charge of what, including the CDC and if he didn't like the former officials he's allowed to replace them with people he does

That's within his presidential perview

The vice president of the US (2nd most powerful person in government) is leading and directing the response to the virus with multiple experts and the CDC under him giving advise about how to deal with the situation the US is in

If you want to argue incompetence and differing messages at a federal level which is under Trump's perview I'm on board, I don't think this pandemic has been handled well by the administration even though it's health outcomes look pretty solid with only 40 odd deaths in a population of 330 million thus far

This budget argument is dumb however, the CDC are getting more money year over year and the country has a trillion dollar fiscal deficit and is 20+ trillion dollars in debt

Or do we just ignore unpleasant little realities like that? Just keep on doing that forever like Greece?

This is getting old, you don't like Trump I get it but some of this stuff is just stupid when there's plenty of actual faults to pick at from the Trump administration
 
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Resistance

Registered User
Nov 10, 2019
87
63
It is all coming to an end in Toronto within 72 hours. The stores here were nuts tonight. There's people hanging outside them at 3am right now. Once reality hits throughout the day tomorrow, another massive run on the stores.. however tomorrow there's a little less on the shelves, so people will be angry. 2 days from now, down, too dangerous to shop.

I'm sorry if you thought this was a game, or "just the flu". Millions are about to be sealed off.

It's the only way, because they don't have enough equipment to survive a pandemic.
 

Kiwi

Registered User
Mar 5, 2016
21,097
16,087
The Naki
hes lost all the money hes gained.. but im sure you knew that.

The US stock market has now wiped out the entire $11.5 trillion of value it gained since Trump's 2016 election victory | Markets Insider

that said ive made a pretty 180 turn on this and its a serious thing for older people and hopefully no one comes in contact with it. I mean we most certainly will but ya.

Now do everybody else's market drops since the pandemic hit......

The US has had an incredible amount of market growth over the last 3 years, the fact international markets have plummeted this amount and it's only wiped out the last 3 years of gains is a testament to how strong the US stock exchange has been
 

GQS

Registered User
Aug 2, 2005
3,493
2,215
hes lost all the money hes gained.. but im sure you knew that.

The US stock market has now wiped out the entire $11.5 trillion of value it gained since Trump's 2016 election victory | Markets Insider

that said ive made a pretty 180 turn on this and its a serious thing for older people and hopefully no one comes in contact with it. I mean we most certainly will but ya.

Can someone tell me why the stock market is always so volatile? I mean hypothetically speaking what if the vast majority of investors around the world DID NOT PANIC and instead sat tight on their investments? Wouldn't the drop in the markets be vastly minimized instead of dropping so much like it has now?

I just don't get why every little event in the world can cause the markets to go down so easily when if people simple sat tight the mood swings in the markets wouldn't be so huge.
 

meefer

Registered User
Jun 9, 2015
4,721
4,672
Bangkok
Those Thailand butt hoses were nice....until you were in a public washroom

555 (in Thai pronounced ha ha ha), so very true, and if you’re caught short and all that’s available is a squat toilet...just pray your knees are in good shape.
 

Pookie

Wear a mask
Oct 23, 2013
16,172
6,684
How stupid is this?

People afraid of contracting a communicable disease that is best mitigated through social distancing ..... rushing out to stand in a large crowd with other people scared of contracting the communicable disease.



This is a marathon folks. 6-18 months.

You will need to venture out in public again when your 2 week supply of Mr Noodles runs out. And the grocery stores will have food then too.
 
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Pookie

Wear a mask
Oct 23, 2013
16,172
6,684
Can someone tell me why the stock market is always so volatile? I mean hypothetically speaking what if the vast majority of investors around the world DID NOT PANIC and instead sat tight on their investments? Wouldn't the drop in the markets be vastly minimized instead of dropping so much like it has now?

I just don't get why every little event in the world can cause the markets to go down so easily when if people simple sat tight the mood swings in the markets wouldn't be so huge.

Part of the issue is that people aren’t making the decisions. Algorithms usually control decision making.
 

francis246

Registered User
Nov 16, 2007
12,958
15,867
It is all coming to an end in Toronto within 72 hours. The stores here were nuts tonight. There's people hanging outside them at 3am right now. Once reality hits throughout the day tomorrow, another massive run on the stores.. however tomorrow there's a little less on the shelves, so people will be angry. 2 days from now, down, too dangerous to shop.

I'm sorry if you thought this was a game, or "just the flu". Millions are about to be sealed off.

It's the only way, because they don't have enough equipment to survive a pandemic.

oh relax. The cases in Toronto have been few. It’s not too dangerous to be outside. As many have mentioned before, minimizing large groupings is a way to control the spreading of the virus. Which will help significantly. Especially if people have it during gestation period. If you are sanitary you are probably going to be fine running out to do errands and go to work
 

francis246

Registered User
Nov 16, 2007
12,958
15,867
I legit don’t get why toilet paper is the favourite thing to purchase right now? Why is it that necessary to get toilet paper?
 
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