OT: Coronavirus (COVID-19): Part VII - READ THE OP

[Fireonk]

Aren't the majority of people dying from Covid riddled with underlying health issues? Statistics say yes. The same "noble people" who are trying to save us from covid don't say a peep, or at least not loud enough for anyone to hear, about how to prevent the taxation of our healthcare system. If smoking, obesity, poor eating habits etc.. were addressed, we wouldn't have so many people at the hospital with covid complications.

The reality of the situation is that smoking, obesity, and poor eating habits aren't things we can quickly turn around or address when we have certain areas that are having issues right now. We have hospitals running short on equipment and staffing again. Elective surgeries are being cancelled. Telling people to work out or eat healthy isn't going to do anything to remedy that situation in the short term.

For long term, yeah let's start pounding it into people's heads that being unhealthy makes you more at risk for basically everything. No arguments there.

 

[romba]

After my dad gets vaccinated it'll be almost completely back to normal. I wouldn't care about getting sick at that point because it would likely be mild and even if I transmit it won't be to my parents.

Just be careful in case they have comorbities- heart disease, cancer, immunosuppressants, diabetes etc. because even if vaccinated there's some risk involved there. I and my parents are vaccinated but I started masking up around them for this reason.

 

[romba]

Cant answer your first paragraph. All ik is that yeah there’s been a lot less cases. Been COVID cases instead.

For your second paragraph I’d risk it simply because of the low % of people in my age group dying from it. I’d take that risk over getting vaccinated when I have no clue what that will do in the future. Plus I’ve already got covid. Yeah it kicked my ass but it’s a damn virus like obviously I expected that, & Ik what it does to me now. I’ve also never got the flu shot and never had a terrible cold, so another thing that would impact my decision.

We don't know long term risks of vaccine, but we don't know the long term risks of Covid too.

If it's "well I'm 99.9999% not going to die from COVID", then it 's "well I'm 99.9999% not going to die from the vaccine".

And I'll tell you, I'm way less concerned about long term issues related to the vaccine than those related to the actual virus replicating in me, even if I don't die from it.

 

[Taluss]

We don't know long term risks of vaccine, but we don't know the long term risks of Covid too.

If it's "well I'm 99.9999% not going to die from COVID", then it 's "well I'm 99.9999% not going to die from the vaccine".

And I'll tell you, I'm way less concerned about long term issues related to the vaccine than those related to the actual virus replicating in me, even if I don't die from it.

Yeah that’s true. Good point.

I think to some it’s more so if I’m 99% sure I won’t die from covid why would I consider getting a vaccine in the first place.

& I’m the opposite here but given anxiety doesn’t help. Ik what covid does to me but I don’t know what this vaccine will do in the years to come. I’m sure it will be fine but there’s always that unknown. I suppose both ways it’s an unknown really.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Vaccines have been around since the mid-1900's and they've been a huge part of why our society has been able to flourish like it has. Theyre the single biggest reason people live to their mid-70's as an average lifespan. We have an overwhelmingly substantial amount of data related to vaccines and how they work. Covid vaccine is no different, this is technology we've discovered and created over a very long period of time. The "boogey-man" unknowns about this vaccine are created by uneducated people on the internet. "Anti-vaxxers" have been around for a long time and in general, theyre loons who don't know anything about medicine. Google is not a substitute for REAL research. We understand the risks, more importantly, doctors understand the risks and everyone should be consulting their doctor and following their advice pertaining to their specific situation.

 

[romba]

Vaccines have been around since the mid-1900's and they've been a huge part of why our society has been able to flourish like it has. Theyre the single biggest reason people live to their mid-70's as an average lifespan. We have an overwhelmingly substantial amount of data related to vaccines and how they work. Covid vaccine is no different, this is technology we've discovered and created over a very long period of time. The "boogey-man" unknowns about this vaccine are created by uneducated people on the internet. "Anti-vaxxers" have been around for a long time and in general, theyre loons who don't know anything about medicine. Google is not a substitute for REAL research. We understand the risks, more importantly, doctors understand the risks and everyone should be consulting their doctor and following their advice pertaining to their specific situation.

NEED MOAR DATAS

*provides data*

DATS FAKE DATAS

The internet allows everyone to be an 'expert'. So why listen to real experts when I can go online to find internet 'experts' saying what I want to actually hear?

 

[The S5]

You know why variants keep developing? Because the virus is allowed to spread rampantly by un-vaccinated, un-masked people.

Thanks Dr. Fauci.

 

[Trxjw]

I don't think we have much choice besides to accept it atm. At least until more restrictions on those who arent vaccinated come into play. Unvaccinated people endangering the population slightly sure. But considering the survival rate (especially to those vaccinated) I think its harsh to act as if they are killing a ton of people. Also as a slight add to the "legitimate reason to do so" part. All due respect thats just your opinion, its worth as much as their opinion which is the opposite.

Yeah im not sure why we keep seeing people trying to relate this to seatbelts and obesity etc. Strange one to me. Your examples are exaggerated imo but I agree. What I mean by that is id say a drunk driver is much more dangerous than someone who isnt vaccinated it makes them look worse than they are.

Killing one or killing many, it shouldn't matter. There are legitimate reasons and non-legitimate reasons. Medical reasons? Sure. Being part of a subset of the population who has historically been experimented on by the government? Absolutely. Thinking it will put a microchip in your arm or any of the other insane bullshit those people are spewing? Absolutely f***ing not.

It's not about the level of danger. It's about the fact that they're willfully endangering the lives of others. My examples aren't exaggerated. It's just that one is a scarier prospect in people's minds because people are conditioned to gauge the significance of a death on the manner in which it occurred. That and the fact that one is easier for the one who caused it to ignore. Likely because they'll never know they did it.

 

[bl02]

Pretty interesting study
Physical activity and the risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection, severe COVID-19 illness and COVID-19 related mortality in South Korea: a nationwide cohort study - PubMed

 

[Fireonk]

Yeah that’s true. Good point.

I think to some it’s more so if I’m 99% sure I won’t die from covid why would I consider getting a vaccine in the first place.

& I’m the opposite here but given anxiety doesn’t help. Ik what covid does to me but I don’t know what this vaccine will do in the years to come. I’m sure it will be fine but there’s always that unknown. I suppose both ways it’s an unknown really.

You don't know what Covid will do to you in the years to come either. No reason why the vaccine could have some latent effects but the virus itself couldn't. Both are long term unknowns because the long term hasn't happened yet.

And while the long term is unknown, everything points to the vaccine being a safer bet in the short and medium term. Across all age brackets and demographics as far as I am aware.

 

[The S5]

Because a fat person isn't going to walk into a Starbucks and infect another customer with heart disease or diabetes. You can't catch hypertension and bring it home to your 80 year old father who is battling cancer. That's a completely asinine comparison to draw.

You missed the context of my previous posts.
Of course, the vast majority of covid deaths have come with a pre existing condition. My point being, the death rate for covid amongst the healthy is extremely low. Same with kids, where the seasonal flu is more deadly, yet, we are having them wear masks at school, disregarding the potential health/social problems that may arise as a result.

 

[The S5]

Vaccines have been around since the mid-1900's and they've been a huge part of why our society has been able to flourish like it has. Theyre the single biggest reason people live to their mid-70's as an average lifespan. We have an overwhelmingly substantial amount of data related to vaccines and how they work. Covid vaccine is no different, this is technology we've discovered and created over a very long period of time. The "boogey-man" unknowns about this vaccine are created by uneducated people on the internet. "Anti-vaxxers" have been around for a long time and in general, theyre loons who don't know anything about medicine. Google is not a substitute for REAL research. We understand the risks, more importantly, doctors understand the risks and everyone should be consulting their doctor and following their advice pertaining to their specific situation.

Do you know what they call the guy who finished last in his class at his medical school in Grenada? Doctor.

I know many doctors who I wouldn't trust to cut my finger nail. We should cool it with the doctor god complex.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Do you know what they call the guy who finished last in his class at his medical school in Grenada? Doctor.

I know many doctors who I wouldn't trust to cut my finger nail. We should cool it with the doctor god complex.

Do you choose the Doctor who finished last in medical school in Greneda as your personal doctor? If so, that's on you.

The knowledge doctors gain through schooling and practice goes so deep that you don't even have the ability to comprehend everything you're missing. Find a good doctor, and trust them with important medical decisions. To think you are as capable as a skilled doctor when you aren't trained as one is a delusion of grandeur.

 

[clmetsfan]

A few things:

1. That is blatantly false. We would not be done with this pandemic by now.
2. You do realize that PoC tend to be among the lowest vaccinated groups and it comes from their general distrust of government? Can we blame them? Certainly access to vaccines at this time is no longer an issue.
3. Mandating a vaccine that has still not been FDA approved is absurd. You want shit to move quicker? Blame the f***ing government, more specifically the FDA for dragging ass on moving this from an emergency use authorization to an actually approved vaccine.

That approval is, from an HR and Legal perspective, a rubber stamp for employers to require the vaccine and be nearly free from liability. As someone who works in pharma I can tell you there are a lot of conversations ongoing about what is taking the FDA so f***ing long to just go ahead and officially approve these vaccines.

The FDA needs to be overhauled. It has for years. It has become a roadblock to scientific and medical progression.

1. No it's not. We could be at herd immunity and new variants wouldn't be popping up every couple of months.
2. Yes, we can blame anyone who doesn't take basic precautions.
3. If you honestly think FDA approval will persuade people who think that mask mandates are indicative of fascism, I've got a bridge to sell you.

 

[clmetsfan]

Fair but some people absolutely hate those people not getting vaccinated for some reason.

But anyway I think we need to understand that there's always going to be those people (Who skip it and infect others) it sucks but that's the way its going to be. Maybe we can mellow those down in #s but we can't get rid of them. All we can do is what we feel like is our part.

The reason is because this won't end until we reach herd immunity, and we won't do that unless people get the damn shot.

 

[Trxjw]

You missed the context of my previous posts.
Of course, the vast majority of covid deaths have come with a pre existing condition. My point being, the death rate for covid amongst the healthy is extremely low. Same with kids, where the seasonal flu is more deadly, yet, we are having them wear masks at school, disregarding the potential health/social problems that may arise as a result.

COVID-19, with massive shutdowns, large-scale mask wearing, and countless other precautions, killed more 10x people in the US than the seasonal flu in it's worst year over the last 10. There's no comparison to draw there either.

Health/social complications from kids wearing masks? Really? This is where we're at now? Just more mental gymnastics to avoid the perils of basic human decency.

 

[clmetsfan]

COVID-19, with massive shutdowns, large-scale mask wearing, and countless other precautions, killed more 10x people in the US than the seasonal flu in it's worst year over the last 10. There's no comparison to draw there either.

Health/social complications from kids wearing masks? Really? This is where we're at now? Just more mental gymnastics to avoid the perils of basic human decency.

I'm also sick of the mortality rate being the only barometer that people point to when talking about the impact of a disease that is proven to have long-term effects. Let's talk about the lung, heart, and brain damage that can occur in people who "recover" from COVID. Let's talk about the people who still have trouble breathing or elevated heart rates 6-12 months later.

FDR survived polio. I wonder if he would've been in favor of that vaccine.

 

[Taluss]

Killing one or killing many, it shouldn't matter. There are legitimate reasons and non-legitimate reasons. Medical reasons? Sure. Being part of a subset of the population who has historically been experimented on by the government? Absolutely. Thinking it will put a microchip in your arm or any of the other insane bullshit those people are spewing? Absolutely f***ing not.

It's not about the level of danger. It's about the fact that they're willfully endangering the lives of others. My examples aren't exaggerated. It's just that one is a scarier prospect in people's minds because people are conditioned to gauge the significance of a death on the manner in which it occurred. That and the fact that one is easier for the one who caused it to ignore. Likely because they'll never know they did it.

Yeah well again there’s always going to be those people. It’s absolutely ridiculous yeah. But nothing we can do about it. If they truly think that do you think they listen to anything logical that would be told to them lol. Only thing that can happen is those unvaccinated people are slowly forced to get it one way or another.

It’s also a scarier prospect in people’s minds because a drunk driver is more of a risk to kill someone. No I don’t have any stats that’s a pure guess.

You don't know what Covid will do to you in the years to come either. No reason why the vaccine could have some latent effects but the virus itself couldn't. Both are long term unknowns because the long term hasn't happened yet.

And while the long term is unknown, everything points to the vaccine being a safer bet in the short and medium term. Across all age brackets and demographics as far as I am aware.

Completely agree, which is why I mentioned in the end that I suppose both situations are unknown really.

The reason is because this won't end until we reach herd immunity, and we won't do that unless people get the damn shot.

Genuinely curious though. We can still get heard immunity without everyone vaccinated right? I don’t see why that would stop it. Slow it down sure.

 

[Trxjw]

Yeah well again there’s always going to be those people. It’s absolutely ridiculous yeah. But nothing we can do about it. If they truly think that do you think they listen to anything logical that would be told to them lol. Only thing that can happen is those unvaccinated people are slowly forced to get it one way or another.

It’s also a scarier prospect in people’s minds because a drunk driver is more of a risk to kill someone. No I don’t have any stats that’s a pure guess.

I disagree that there isn't anything we can do about it. We can and should make their lives more difficult. No vaccine? No getting on an airplane. No getting into MSG to see the Rangers. No attending in-person events at your kid's school. The only real limiting factor is the infrastructure to check vaccine status in real time.

It's all relative. A drunk driver on a desolate highway in Montana is less likely to kill someone than a COVID-19 carrying person strolling into a nursing home with no mask on. In my view, it's just a matter of doing the right thing to protect others.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I’m humored and angered when people will take the word of some dude with out a medical degree over someone who has one (and in this case, hoards of people who have one.)

no doctors don’t get shit right 100% of the time, but when it comes to health matters, they’re right a hell of a lot more than some schmucks who have no idea what they’re talking about.

I’m with @Trxjw, don’t get vaccinated if you don’t want to, but don’t expect to be able to do all the things that a vaccinated person can.

 

[Crease]

We are required to be vaccinated against polio, measles, and chickenpox to attend public schools and private summer camps. I fail to understand why a coronavirus vaccine requirement should be controversial.

 

[The S5]

Do you choose the Doctor who finished last in medical school in Greneda as your personal doctor? If so, that's on you.

The knowledge doctors gain through schooling and practice goes so deep that you don't even have the ability to comprehend everything you're missing. Find a good doctor, and trust them with important medical decisions. To think you are as capable as a skilled doctor when you aren't trained as one is a delusion of grandeur.

Did I mention I also know a highly skilled ENT who killed a patient on the table in his office? Or, an ER doc who had to look up what was actually in the vaccine after being told by a mom that their child was allergic?

 

[The S5]

COVID-19, with massive shutdowns, large-scale mask wearing, and countless other precautions, killed more 10x people in the US than the seasonal flu in it's worst year over the last 10. There's no comparison to draw there either.

Health/social complications from kids wearing masks? Really? This is where we're at now? Just more mental gymnastics to avoid the perils of basic human decency.

Are you vaxxed? Good, me too, so, no worries. I don't worry about the non-vaxxed. The mortality rate of the vaccinated is extremely low, so, what are you so worried about?

 

[NYSPORTS]

We are required to be vaccinated against polio, measles, and chickenpox to attend public schools and private summer camps. I fail to understand why a coronavirus vaccine requirement should be controversial.

i’m vaccinated. Wonder if we’ll need booster shots to continually keep up with this though. That kinda concerns me.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Did I mention I also know a highly skilled ENT who killed a patient on the table in his office? Or, an ER doc who had to look up what was actually in the vaccine after being told by a mom that their child was allergic?

The fact that you're using anecdotes as your evidence only further solidifies my arguement.