Concussions

[pgj98m3]

Adding this to help us understand what's going on.....

Concussion in the National Hockey League: a systematic review of the literature

 

[pgj98m3]

In looking today, I have seen lots of information online from neurology clinics, etc, stating that it is okay to fly after a mild concussion (the cabin is pressurised after all) and also some information stating that it may make you feel worse while in the aire (because of the noise, etc), but in my cursory search I did not come across any stating that it is not okay. All that to be said, there do not seem to be any studies referencing the time period you are referring to although in the one study you reference the authors state that that sort of study would be a good idea. Therefore, I think that it is an overreach to state that the Canucks organization was negligent in having him fly when he did.

I agree there is a lot of discussion without good research.
Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

 

[StrictlyCommercial]

My 2nd last concussion resulted in my body shaking uncontrollably followed by months of PCS. My last concussion just had me out for a couple days and then I felt fine. They are nothing if not unpredictable. You can recover from a big hit after a couple days sometimes, while a light tap in the right spot could put you out for months on end. Rest and time are the key to getting better in any case. The injured player needs to be honest with themselves and those around them regarding their symptoms. A big problem in sports is that the injured player will try to tough it out, but with concussions, that is the worst thing you can do. Hopefully the culture of the Canucks' room is one where players aren't afraid to admit having symptoms to allow for proper care and caution.

 

[m9]

Lets not use the NFL as an example of how to treat concussions.

That may be your opinion, but I think that when people look back on things the NFL will be considered a pioneer in many ways for prevention, research and treatment of concussions. I don't mean that in a way to prop up the NFL either, but the reality is they know it has been a problem and they have tons of money riding on fixing the problem.

 

[pgj98m3]

That may be your opinion, but I think that when people look back on things the NFL will be considered a pioneer in many ways for prevention, research and treatment of concussions. I don't mean that in a way to prop up the NFL either, but the reality is they know it has been a problem and they have tons of money riding on fixing the problem.

That is only partially true...they have put some money towards compensating severely damaged players and probably at least as much in lawyers fees trying to avoid paying.

 

[RandV]

That is only partially true...they have put some money towards compensating severely damaged players and probably at least as much in lawyers fees trying to avoid paying.

I don't follow the NFL, but I'd make a guess that it's a combination that on one hand they're going to protect their own business interests and profits first and foremost as any corporate entity would but on the other hand even while following a cost-benefit model they still have way more money to sink into the problem than the anyone else does.

 

[pgj98m3]

I don't follow the NFL, but I'd make a guess that it's a combination that on one hand they're going to protect their own business interests and profits first and foremost as any corporate entity would but on the other hand even while following a cost-benefit model they still have way more money to sink into the problem than the anyone else does.

Exactly

 

[Captain Bowie]

What the hell is going on in this poll?

 

[bbud]

Had one concussion very high speed car accident was hit by another car while stopped 3years later still carry symptoms likely will for life according to Drs .
As for Petterson he is still travelling with team so seems not severe symptoms as could be that's good news I didn't look at light for 14 months and I do know Drs say often 5 to 7 days minor concussions will ease up it's what I was told at time .

 

[Hockeyphysio]

I work with people who have concussions as a Physiotherapist, although not with professional athletes. I also have had a couple severe concussions (rugby), including one that resulted in a loss of depth perception for awhile.

The research seems still pretty murky on what a precise protocol should be. Current thinking is slow and graded return to activity. Most organizations should have baseline testing to see where Elias was at after his head injury and use that to make some sort of informed decision. You also have to keep in mind, some of the symptoms associated with a concussion event may relate to a neck injury (ex Whiplash) or inner ear injury (some forms of vertigo , like BPPV)

Saying that, I do not see how there is any upside in flying him around the next day. If he was my client I would have let him rest and do some light workouts for a few days with one of the trainers and go from there. Just seems prudent and smart.

 

[n00bxQb]

I've had six documented concussions and that I suffered all between 1995 and 2000. Most of which were from sports (two from basketball, one from baseball, one from wrestling in PE (a WWF move, not a real wrestling move), one from a car accident, and one from being an idiot). I don't think I have any day-to-day long-term effects, but that entire period of my life is vague at best if I don't actually have a written or photographic record of it.

I know the one from the car accident really messed me up. My math teacher wouldn't let me out of the mid-term a couple of days after the accident (even with a doctor's note) and I ended up failing it, which was extremely out of character for me (I scored top 250 in Canada on the Cayley math contest the year before without studying). He felt bad and ended up letting me retake it at the end of the course (scored 100%), so it ended up okay, but it demonstrates how messed up my brain was at that point.

 

[DL44]

One thing that is for certain is that no one individual is effected the same... which is the crux of how complicated the issue of standardizing treatment is.

Even in this thread alone you have people who suffered concussions and have suffered a huge variance of symptoms and duration of effects.

I've suffered probably about 15ish grade 1 concussions with 2 severe ones. I played 8 yrs of football, plus 8 yrs of rugby with just 2 yrs overlapping...

I consider myself lucky in the sense that the legacy of my concussion history has resulted in "merely" a severe lack of short term memory.
Wife could tell me something, or at work an employee could request something from me, and it's gone from my consciousness within minutes. It's bad.... to the point where at work they now know if it isn't written or emailed, requests or communication with me is next to useless. If I sit down and concentrate on the communications I've had during the day, I can usually remember and put things together... I.e. wife ìs going out tonight... and she has told me 5 different times where and why and she's walking out the door I'm like.. where you going? She used get pissed... she knows now tho. But now I also avoid that last question and instead sit there for a few minutes racking brain to remember wtf is up... and I can will the answer to me... but it sucks. Also.. alcohol probably doesn't help, heh...

I used to practice as a 'quack' chiropractor... high knowledge of the neurological system.. practiced for about a decade till focusing on our family business... but dealt with many head and neck trauma and concussion patients.
I was trained and educated at a time when the word concussion wasn't a toxic word..
It was a matter of fact..
Got your "bell rung" - grade 1 concussion... memory loss surrounding your injury? - grade 2 concussion..
Ktfo- grade 3.
I.e. Pettersson on first glance looks like a grade 1 or 2.. but it depends on if he can recall sequence of events... without video of course.

Even 20 yrs ago... when I suffered my grade 2... I wasn't allowed to play/practice (rugby) for 3 weeks. I also had to be woken up every 2 hrs from sleep for 24 hrs after the game...

Still remember the incident gloriously... I was playing for SFU and we were playing UBC... a big deal.
My memory : I went for a tackle, took a shot to the head was buzzed, ran back to my position, coaches and players on the sideline are yelling and motioning to me, asking if I'm ok, I motion no, and they took me out of the game and I got assigned the concussion protocol...

What actually happened : I went in for the tackle, got buzzed, backed up into position, went back in with a crazy kamikaze tackle on another player, got back up stumbling, but the play came back my way and I dived back in with a sick tackle, ball came loose, we got it and the play went the other way.. I went back into position and but was behind the play, looking shaky and coaches were trying to get play stopped to get me off... so I had a few minutes of gameplay completely wiped out..
I only found out about what happened when I went to practice (as a spectator) the following week... blew my mind..
But I had gained legendary status for the 3 backtobacktoback insane tackles I managed to pull off without any memory of it...

Concussions are different for everyone.

 

[JuniorNelson]

The brain is super complex. Brain injuries are difficult to diagnose. Symptoms are only indicators and do not tell the whole story.

NHL wears laughable helmets for that environment. Then they wear them loose! Petterson might as well have been wearing a bandanna.

 

[pgj98m3]

One thing that is for certain is that no one individual is effected the same... which is the crux of how complicated the issue of standardizing treatment is.

Even in this thread alone you have people who suffered concussions and have suffered a huge variance of symptoms and duration of effects.

I've suffered probably about 15ish grade 1 concussions with 2 severe ones. I played 8 yrs of football, plus 8 yrs of rugby with just 2 yrs overlapping...

I consider myself lucky in the sense that the legacy of my concussion history has resulted in "merely" a severe lack of short term memory.
Wife could tell me something, or at work an employee could request something from me, and it's gone from my consciousness within minutes. It's bad.... to the point where at work they now know if it isn't written or emailed, requests or communication with me is next to useless. If I sit down and concentrate on the communications I've had during the day, I can usually remember and put things together... I.e. wife ìs going out tonight... and she has told me 5 different times where and why and she's walking out the door I'm like.. where you going? She used get pissed... she knows now tho. But now I also avoid that last question and instead sit there for a few minutes racking brain to remember wtf is up... and I can will the answer to me... but it sucks. Also.. alcohol probably doesn't help, heh...

I used to practice as a 'quack' chiropractor... high knowledge of the neurological system.. practiced for about a decade till focusing on our family business... but dealt with many head and neck trauma and concussion patients.
I was trained and educated at a time when the word concussion wasn't a toxic word..
It was a matter of fact..
Got your "bell rung" - grade 1 concussion... memory loss surrounding your injury? - grade 2 concussion..
Ktfo- grade 3.
I.e. Pettersson on first glance looks like a grade 1 or 2.. but it depends on if he can recall sequence of events... without video of course.

Even 20 yrs ago... when I suffered my grade 2... I wasn't allowed to play/practice (rugby) for 3 weeks. I also had to be woken up every 2 hrs from sleep for 24 hrs after the game...

Still remember the incident gloriously... I was playing for SFU and we were playing UBC... a big deal.
My memory : I went for a tackle, took a shot to the head was buzzed, ran back to my position, coaches and players on the sideline are yelling and motioning to me, asking if I'm ok, I motion no, and they took me out of the game and I got assigned the concussion protocol...

What actually happened : I went in for the tackle, got buzzed, backed up into position, went back in with a crazy kamikaze tackle on another player, got back up stumbling, but the play came back my way and I dived back in with a sick tackle, ball came loose, we got it and the play went the other way.. I went back into position and but was behind the play, looking shaky and coaches were trying to get play stopped to get me off... so I had a few minutes of gameplay completely wiped out..
I only found out about what happened when I went to practice (as a spectator) the following week... blew my mind..
But I had gained legendary status for the 3 backtobacktoback insane tackles I managed to pull off without any memory of it...

Concussions are different for everyone.

Thank you for a very thoughtful reply.

 

[DL44]

The brain is super complex. Brain injuries are difficult to diagnose. Symptoms are only indicators and do not tell the whole story.

NHL wears laughable helmets for that environment. Then they wear them loose! Petterson might as well have been wearing a bandanna.

But to be accurate... the VAST majority of concussions in hockey would not be affected by the quality of the helmet... most are acceleration based from a hit to the body as opposed to direct trauma-based.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

But to be accurate... the VAST majority of concussions in hockey would not be affected by the quality of the helmet... most are acceleration based from a hit to the body as opposed to direct trauma-based.

Thanks for your earlier post. And this point as well.

 

[pgj98m3]

I'm a bit worried...we are having a thoughtful discussion without name-calling or flaming.....have we all become pod people???????

 

[Nomobo]

I’ve had three severe bell ringers caused by motorcycle accidents and the only seeming after effects I’ve had is that I seem to spend a lot of time on this hockey forum. Could that be a sign of brain malfunction? Never mind that I’m still supportive of management.

 

[M2Beezy]

The concussion debate is almost as good as the time we got a free lesson on PR from our resident experts.

Puerto Rico?

 

[pgj98m3]

I’ve had three severe bell ringers caused by motorcycle accidents and the only seeming after effects I’ve had is that I seem to spend a lot of time on this hockey forum. Could that be a sign of brain malfunction? Never mind that I’m still supportive of management.

I'm impressed you didn't take advantage of that out but I will consider your delicate psyche in the future (LOL).

 

[Melvin]

Jesus a lot of people have had concussions.

 

[krutovsdonut]

some guy jumped off a ledge onto my head when i was 18 and i spent a couple days in hospital that i don't recall. i also often forget the incident when filling in insurance forms because i do not really recall it directly, i just know what people tell me. it was about that time i decided jim benning was my personal hero.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

I've had 5 concussions. 4 of the 5 were minor and healed within a few weeks. The last one I still had post concussion syndrome after a few months and flattened a few discs in my neck. I also tore my rotator cuff. That was not a good day.

 

[Hockeyphysio]

I've had 5 concussions. 4 of the 5 were minor and healed within a few weeks. The last one I still had post concussion syndrome after a few months and flattened a few discs in my neck. I also tore my rotator cuff. That was not a good day.

Thats what makes concussions so tough, because some of the symptoms could come from your neck or something co-current with the brain injury

 

[DL44]

Jesus a lot of people have had concussions.

Side effect of fun.