Post-Game Talk: Cole's Plus/Minus: The Crosby and Vanek Show (w/ guest Craig Adams)

[IcedCapp]

I don't really understand this conversation. It's somehow a negative that Dupuis gets to play with skill? And puts up points while playing with skill? Not many people can put up points while playing with unskilled linemates...

 

[wheelz87]

+Crosby. Unbelievable game from 87. How was he not a top 3 star of the game? HA!
+Dupuis. What a tip! And a great game, great finish on the 2nd goal.
+Letang. Just for that pass on the game tieing goal alone.
+Martin. You have to credit the guy for playing great hockey this year.

-BB on the 3rd line. I get it, he's being eased in. Still.. he is top 6 or bust. Not a physical player and not a speed threat, he is a skilled and crafty kid. Malkin and Neal are struggling badly, let this kid play the left side.

-Geno. He really needs to start upping his game.

-Retaliation. ******* Kunitz. Ott got a GOOD hit in on you. LET IT GO!! Kunitz is almost as bad (maybe worse?) at taking these as Geno.

 

[Ugene Magic]

he put up 59 last year with Staal and Cooke/TK, with virtually 0 PP time.

Not sure how that translate into Sid and Geno making him better

Exactly.

He's currently tied for tenth in scoring goals with Sid and many others.

Sids wingers have 13, and Malkin's has 11 with one guy.

 

[KIRK]

There was one play where Geno picked the puck up down low in the D-Zone and usually he just explodes with speed but he just geared down. I suspect he may have an injury.

-DB's line juggling minus the bit in the third with Geno-Sid-Neal.

I'm counting possibly a half dozen 'usually he just . . .' things with Geno a game. Injury? Mailing it in? LW situation? Inconsistent ice time? Lack of trust from the coaches? Discomfort adjusting back to 'Penguins hockey' (not to say that he ever was a Bylsma guy in that regard)?

Whatever it is-- and we can debate it ad nauseum-- I think only the biggest kool-aid drinker would say the Pens have a chance to win a cup with Geno playing the way he is now. Then again, I've always kind of figured the Pens playoff fortunes have a coincidental-- or not so coincidental resemblance-- first, second, and third to how Geno is playing.

Put that on Malkin. Put that on the coaches. Put that on the Easter Bunny. I don't give a poop. It's developed pretty quickly into a bigger problem than the breakout.

 

[Darth Vitale]

‏@charliesheen
watching the best goalie in the world Ryan Miller, stand on his head, then some dooshy teammate got in his way. #sux

Only Charlie Sheen can deliver.... Tiger Logic â„¢.

Those damn dooshy teammates! What were they thinking?

 

[KIRK]

You could say the same thing about Neal. How many goals does he create off of his own individual effort? Doesn't matter how you score, so long as you do it. Not like most of Sid's are pretty but I don't think anyone would mistake him for playing poor offensive hockey.

Aside from the shot, there's no difference between Neal and Kunitz/Dupuis. In fact, one could argue, quite convincingly, that Kunitz or Dupuis is every bit if not more likely to make something happen on his own or win a board battle.

 

[Pancakes]

Geno is converting at a very low shooting percentage but he's still getting a lot of shots. He'll come around. It's highly unlikely he remains this unlucky all year with his shots.

You know what's scary, though? Sid's shooting percentage isn't that great either. That's scary, considering how well he's playing. If he starts getting a little luckier...wow.

 

[sniugneP]

Big plus to McCormick for stop punching and let Glass pulled down his own jersey. Not something to see very often.

 

[KIRK]

By the way Engelland played 13 minutes and Bort played 8:49. The Pens basically didn't even play their third pairing this game.

Nor should they have.

Too bad that principle doesn't extend to Kennedy.

 

[Sideline]

Big plus to McCormick for stop punching and let Glass pulled down his own jersey. Not something to see very often.

QFT. McCormick showed a lot of respect for other players in that exchange. That's great to see.

 

[Pancakes]

Nor should they have.

Too bad that principle doesn't extend to Kennedy.

Not complaining about it, just pointing it out. I think people overrate the importance of the third pairing for us. Those guys barely play, so it's kinda weird how much energy people expend worrying about who is playing on our third pairing.

Especially by the time the playoffs come, that third pairing will barely be a factor, because our top 4 will be playing 90% of the game.

 

[Ugene Magic]

Big plus to McCormick for stop punching and let Glass pulled down his own jersey. Not something to see very often.

Very classy, just like Glass patting him after.

 

[StoneColdFlower*]

Nor should they have.

Too bad that principle doesn't extend to Kennedy.

It's a deep draft. Maybe Toronto will part with Kulemin for Kennedy and a pick.

 

[IcedCapp]

Not complaining about it, just pointing it out. I think people overrate the importance of the third pairing for us. Those guys barely play, so it's kinda weird how much energy people expend worrying about who is playing on our third pairing.

Especially by the time the playoffs come, that third pairing will barely be a factor, because our top 4 will be playing 90% of the game.

I actually agree with the premise here, which is why I want Niskanen traded. Despres needs to be in the top-4.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Big plus to McCormick for stop punching and let Glass pulled down his own jersey. Not something to see very often.

Agreed lots of class showed there waiting or Glass to put his jersey back on. I doubt it would have been the same had it been Ott

 

[eXile59]

To be fair, he's been playing with Sid for a lot longer than the past year and a half. Dupuis has largely been tethered to Sid's wing since his second season here.

Nobody is arguing that he's a legitimate 50+ point guy without Sid...but he's turned into a player who's putting his chances into the net, instead of the guy who was shooting the puck 10 feet wide every time like he was before. He deserves a lot of credit for that.

Kind of sounds like that's what some people are arguing though. He's a crucial member of this team & doesn't get enough credit for being one of the better 5 on 5 players in the league but some are acting like he's some dynamic offensive force because of his stat sheet. That's just not accurate.

 

[wgknestrick]

= thought TK had a decent game today with some great passes out of his own zone to spring other players. He still isn't near the TK of past, but needs to start stringing more of these games together. Baby steps.

+Crosby needed to start shooting "first" more and he was more aggressive today. His line was noticeable every time they stepped on the ice. Crosby needs to get back into the shoot all the time, every time to open the ice for his teammates. This made him the elite player we know he is.

=MAF still worries the hell out of me with his sloppy rebound control. He made a lot of key saves today, but still frustrates me with how often he loses sight of the puck in a game. I think he caught 2 pucks all game. I wish TV would take over his coaching. If MAF could control the puck like TV, watch out.

-Malkin's line is still a train wreck on 5v5. Him and Neal constantly get caught below the goal line on dump ins. 33% on faceoffs.

=Sutter is still probably the best defensive forward in the game, so I'm cutting him some slack. He's gotta get more SOG to start chipping in offensively.

+Glass had a strong game.

-Cooke was pretty invisible out there...-2 on the day.

- Bylsma needs to quit changing the lines around. Let the guys build some chemistry for once. Will you ever put Kunitz back with Malkin? Will we ever see you line up all of our best players in a game (with Glass / Adams scratched)?


+ Deupers obviously. He was one of the Pen's best players and almost got the hatty at the end.

 

[#66]

+ Adams and Orpik for coming in for MAF at the end of the game. This team needs more glue like that.

+ Sid... Slowly racking up the points and tuning the turn overs out.

+ Dupes... Solid as they come and wears that Pens jersey with pride.

+ Vitale... So much more than just a grinder. I really like his skating and his sense too. He's one of the few Pens to hold on to the puck just a little longer before POPing.

+ MAF... Some bad rebounds but stayed square to pucks and read plays well.

- Support around the net. "Head on a swivel" really needs to be screamed at this D 24/7.

- Malkin... He's playing the old K style and wants the puck to do the work. Thats OK when you have puck carriers as wingers but he doesn't right now. He needs to start moving his feet more and gaining the blue line himself. I'm hoping that someone like Disco or even Sid sits him down and talks to him because he seems a little mopey.

 

[eXile59]

I might take some crap for this but I'm getting use to it. I think Letang might be our MVP. He's 4th in the league in scoring for D-men, plays 25 minutes a game, & as we saw against NJ we're a different team with out him.

 

[KIRK]

Not complaining about it, just pointing it out. I think people overrate the importance of the third pairing for us. Those guys barely play, so it's kinda weird how much energy people expend worrying about who is playing on our third pairing.

Especially by the time the playoffs come, that third pairing will barely be a factor, because our top 4 will be playing 90% of the game.

You know, I'm fairly well convinced that really doesn't matter. Kunitz and Dupuis are fine with Sid because they're fine during the regular season. Guys like Despres might develop into better playoff options, but it takes a coaching staff that is willing now to see (because you need to let a guy go through the growing pains now to reap the payoff in April).

I remember when Letang came up in 2007. Now, that was a guy who went through a **** load of growing pains. Despite a set top four with Gonchar, Whitney, Orpik, and Eaton, Letang still averaged 18 minutes a game. He showed more potential than a guy at his end like Sydor, so Sydor was kept as the 'just in case guy'.

Could Despres be a better playoff option than Niskanen? Could Bortuzzo be a better playoff option than Engo? Could Bennett be a top six option? It takes a coach willing to find out.

I actually agree with the premise here, which is why I want Niskanen traded. Despres needs to be in the top-4.

THIS

Or, at the very least, you still feed Despres 16 minutes or so a night with Niskanen healthy.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I'm counting possibly a half dozen 'usually he just . . .' things with Geno a game. Injury? Mailing it in? LW situation? Inconsistent ice time? Lack of trust from the coaches? Discomfort adjusting back to 'Penguins hockey' (not to say that he ever was a Bylsma guy in that regard)?

Whatever it is-- and we can debate it ad nauseum-- I think only the biggest kool-aid drinker would say the Pens have a chance to win a cup with Geno playing the way he is now. Then again, I've always kind of figured the Pens playoff fortunes have a coincidental-- or not so coincidental resemblance-- first, second, and third to how Geno is playing.

Put that on Malkin. Put that on the coaches. Put that on the Easter Bunny. I don't give a poop. It's developed pretty quickly into a bigger problem than the breakout.

I bet you it won't be a problem in a month.

Hell, I'll even make an avy bet witcha. Already have one poster sporting the spoils of early-season hand-wringing, why not make it two?

 

[lornloxor]

+Crosby, another 3 point night
+Dupuis, good hustle and 2 goals
+Martin, what a great year he's having

=Bylsma's attempt at jamming

-Malkin, he needs to be better
-dumb penalties

 

[KIRK]

I bet you it won't be a problem in a month.

Hell, I'll even make an avy bet witcha. Already have one poster sporting the spoils of early-season hand-wringing, why not make it two?

Well, as much as I'm sure Bylsma will inspire the greatness back into him, I'll take your bet.

EDIT: By the way, I'd like you to be as right about the playoffs as you've been about the regular season. Hasn't helped you before, of course, but I digress . . .

 

[IcedCapp]

Well, as much as I'm sure Bylsma will inspire the greatness back into him, I'll take your bet.

You guys need to define the terms better, because I don't think KIRK will EVER be happy

 

[td_ice]

+Crosby, another 3 point night
+Dupuis, good hustle and 2 goals
+Martin, what a great year he's having

=Bylsma's attempt at jamming

-Malkin, he needs to be better
-dumb penalties

Dude was scaring me with that. I thought he flipped.