Player Discussion Chris Kreider

[bigdog16]

Well into their 30s? Not many. Though there have been examples and I have listed them in response to AK who asked the same thing. You can feel free to search out the responses. Should you choose not to, I will summarize and tell you that on a 6 year deal, Kreider will be just fine for at least 4 of the years. And if he spends the last one or two as a 3rd line player that is just fine.

Now tell me other centers like ZBad that have kept being just as productive well into their 30s? Also tell me specifically which if Mika's skills will not be diminished with age?

The biggest trait that players lose with age is their speed. Take Kreiders speed away from him, your not left with much. Take Zbads speed away from him, you still have his vision, passing ability, his shot, his hands. Guys like Stamkos, Kopitar, Malkin are similar players stylistically as Zbad. They are in their 30s and doing fine

 

[NYSPORTS]

If he does get moved I'll miss his playoff heroics

if he was that young today he would have already have been resigned.

 

[Captain Lindy]

Also Zbads game ages way better than Kreiders. You take away Kreiders speed and he isnt very effective, his skill is pretty limited. Zbad can slow the game down, has more skill, and can see the game in a way Kreider cant. I feel like Kreiders game might fall off a cliff halfway thru his next contract

Espo never had speed but he had one aspect that Kreider also specializes at: Screening the goalie to create goals. Espo played almost into his 40s doing that.

 

[bigdog16]

Espo never had speed but he had one aspect that Kreider also specializes at: Screening the goalie to create goals. Espo played almost into his 40s doing that.

Espo also played in the 80s....Completely different game where speed wasnt utilized the same way it is today. I do agree Kreider is an elite net front presence, one of, if not the best in the league. But i mean are we really going to pay a guy 6-7 mil to be a good net front guy?

 

[Rongomania]

Because you do not want to be paying a player whose skills are diminishing as he is getting into his 30s at a time when the Rangers are competing for the Cup. Is that correct or not?

If the answer is yes, then please simply answer the question that I have asked you to answer multiple times. How can you possibly not have such concerns about ZBad?

If that is not the case, and you are not concerned with that, then tell me why you would not want Kreider here?

Which one is it?

Dude, you're beating a dead horse. Right now, in this moment, no I am not concerned about the FAR SUPERIOR Zibanejad. Again, we can discuss this in two years when who the F knows what will happen.

We just don't need hat Kreider deal now, all I'm sayin'.

 

[Leonardo87]

I was always talking kreider- you are the one whom claimed I'd treat Zbad and Panarin the same. I never brought either of them up. We can talk them in 2 and 5 years bud.

Kreider shouldn't get a 6+ year deal with us. Bottom line

I’d push up the annual salary to make up for the one extra year. Maybe like a 6.85 for 6 Years. I think most people here are ok with the higher annual, if it is under 7 years. Plus the cap should go up, especially with the expansion on the horizon,and think they will be buying out another contract this summer.

 

[CasusBelli]

Espo also played in the 80s....Completely different game where speed wasnt utilized the same way it is today. I do agree Kreider is an elite net front presence, one of, if not the best in the league. But i mean are we really going to pay a guy 6-7 mil to be a good net front guy?

With ADA and Fox aiming at his stick for deflections? It’s a compelling case — and that would likely be only for the final few years of the contract (at worst). Without point-men who can get shots through traffic? No way.

 

[eco's bones]

Espo never had speed but he had one aspect that Kreider also specializes at: Screening the goalie to create goals. Espo played almost into his 40s doing that.

Espo really liked to set up 15/20' out in the slot. He was an immovable object and adept at keeping his body between checkers and the puck and could spin off either foot and he was an accurate shooter. That was his bread and butter. He wasn't nearly as much right on top of the goalie the way Chris usually is. Tim Kerr was another like Espo. Those were big, physical skillful Bruins teams. Johnny Bucyk was if anything stockier than Espo and a great player in his own right. Espo's linemates were usually Ken Hodge and Wayne Cashman. Bucyk usually played with Fred Stanfield and Johnny McKenzie.

 

[True Blue]

The biggest trait that players lose with age is their speed. Take Kreiders speed away from him, your not left with much.

Take away Krieder's speed, you still have hands for tip ins, board work, BEST net front presence in the entire NHL

Joe Thorton, Joe Pavelski. Patrice Bergeron. To start. Defensively, look at Burns & Chara. Not quite 35 yet, but Blake Wheeler is looking good. Not quite 35 year, but at 33 Radulov is looking pretty good.. Justin Williams is looking good. So to was Marleu. So too was Eric Cole.

Zero reason as to why Krieder cannot be an effective player in his 30s.

Take Zbads speed away from him, you still have his vision, passing ability, his shot, his hands. Guys like Stamkos, Kopitar, Malkin are similar players stylistically as Zbad. They are in their 30s and doing fine.

And plenty have fallen off a cliff. To believe that age will not affect his vision, skating or hands is ludicrous.

Seems to me what we have here is a big case of selective reasoning. I like Mika. He will perform well in his 30s. I do not like Krieder nearly as much. He will not perform well into his 30s.

 

[True Blue]

Dude, you're beating a dead horse. Right now, in this moment, no I am not concerned about the FAR SUPERIOR Zibanejad. Again, we can discuss this in two years when who the F knows what will happen.

We just don't need hat Kreider deal now, all I'm sayin'.

Can you answer the question I posed to you? If you cannot or simply will not, fine and we can walk away from it.

 

[Whoot Whoot]

Dreger just tweeted hopes of a contract fading

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Dreger just tweeted hopes of a contract fading

Does that mean we trade him?

 

[Mike in Houston]

Does that mean we trade him?

You got to. Can't have a potential Tavares situation in the summer and get nothing.

 

[NYRangers0723]

Honestly I felt they were getting closer but I guess I was wrong. I wonder if Gorton has given CK a deadline? Maybe that changes things

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

You got to. Can't have a potential Tavares situation in the summer and get nothing.

I have a bad feeling that is exactly what Gorton will manage to do.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

I think our chances to make the playoffs don't change by much if we trade Fast and Kreider, because we are winning primarily based on goaltending not based on great play from our players or great coaching.

 

[NYRangers0723]

I think our chances to make the playoffs don't change by much if we trade Fast and Kreider, because we are winning primarily based on goaltending not based on great play from our players or great coaching.

But our schedule gets tougher. Losing one of your top offensive weapons and defensive players will have a effect even with great goaltending

 

[NYSPORTS]

Who knows what info is true. Hoping this isn’t a Gordon screwup.

Honestly, the decision to resign or trade him should have been made weeks or months ago. The money or length Kreider is looking for shouldn’t be blindsiding nor should the contract negotiating only started a few weeks ago.

This decision should have been made already. Maybe the trade is premature with a day to go but any contract negotiations should have been done a while ago IMO.

This news about contract and dollars would be a turnoff for me if I’m the team attempting to trade for him b/c it reinforces he’s a rental and my perception of top dollar might not be enough.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

If Kreider wants a lot or is not giving us much of a discount then trade and see if he is interested in signing come July 1st. Call up Gettinger.

 

[will1066]

I think our chances to make the playoffs don't change by much if we trade Fast and Kreider, because we are winning primarily based on goaltending not based on great play from our players or great coaching.

This is simply not true and I would designate you for assignment if I could, man.

 

[NYRangers0723]

Who knows what info is true. Hoping this isn’t a Gordon screwup.

Honestly, the decision to resign or trade him should have been made weeks or months ago. The money or length Kreider is looking for shouldn’t be blindsiding nor should the contract negotiating only started a few weeks ago.

This decision should have been made already. Maybe the trade is premature with a day to go but any contract negotiations should have been done a while ago IMO.

This news about contract and dollars would be a turnoff for me if I’m the team attempting to trade for him b/c it reinforces he’s a rental and my perception of top dollar might not be enough

.

well I agree they should have done this earlier. Plus maybe Gorton have gotten CK to sign a cheaper offer earlier before he really took off. Me personally I never felt we were getting massive return. I felt from the get go we were getting a late first and decent prospect which is better than nothing but more realistic

 

[bigdog16]

Take away Krieder's speed, you still have hands for tip ins, board work, BEST net front presence in the entire NHL

Joe Thorton, Joe Pavelski. Patrice Bergeron. To start. Defensively, look at Burns & Chara. Not quite 35 yet, but Blake Wheeler is looking good. Not quite 35 year, but at 33 Radulov is looking pretty good.. Justin Williams is looking good. So to was Marleu. So too was Eric Cole.

Zero reason as to why Krieder cannot be an effective player in his 30s.

And plenty have fallen off a cliff. To believe that age will not affect his vision, skating or hands is ludicrous.

Seems to me what we have here is a big case of selective reasoning. I like Mika. He will perform well in his 30s. I do not like Krieder nearly as much. He will not perform well into his 30s.

Joe Thornton put up multiple 100+ point seasons, Pavelski was a regular over 70 points, Bergeron a regular over 65 while also being regularly the best defensive fwd in the league, Wheeler over 90 points, Marleau 70-80, Cole was a 70+ guy. Kreiders career high is 53 points. Those guys have/had skillsets that dwarf Kreider’s. Kreider doesnt have a very broad skillset unlike the players you mentioned. An argument could be made for Justin Williams, but again is that someone you want to be paying 7m four years from now?

You are right, maybe age does get to Zbad. But there is a boat load more of power fwd type players who are toast by age 32 compared to skilled players. Im not gonna sit here and make you put together lists of players because thats annoying, but I would be curious to see a list of players who put up Zbad type numbers at 26 years old who have just fallen off a cliff in their 30s.

I cant help but think of the Andrew Ladd situation when it comes to Kreider

 

[Pizza]

I trust Gorton.

However, IMHO the reality is that not having Kreider makes us a less difficult team to play against.

This from a person that has had his fair share of moments where Kreider frustrates the crap out of me.

Panarin in our line up has made a huge difference for the Rangers. Teams have a lot more than Kreider to worry about now.

Take that away along with size, strength, net-front presence, etc. and I don't see how we are better.

Oh well. Too bad.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Big long contracts fail or disappoint at a much higher rate than they succeed. Especially when a player is around 30. I feel far more comfortable staying away from big long term contracts.

some bad contracts just from the Rangers in the last few years:

Staal fail
Giradi fail bought out
Stepan would be a fail if we did not trade him
Skjei so far disappointment
Hagelin would have been fail if we did not trade him
Lundqvist disappointment
Smith fail and it was not a long contract
Shattenkirk huge fail
Truba disappointment
Trading way Miller because we did not want to pay him 5 mil big fail

Now the opposite:

Trading away Zucc, Hayes, McDonagh looks good because their production has dropped after new big contracts.

Only big success is Panarin

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Honestly I felt they were getting closer but I guess I was wrong. I wonder if Gorton has given CK a deadline? Maybe that changes things

This sounds more like a "get your last and best offers in" to other teams rather than any sort of deadline aimed at Kreider's contract. They had quite a while to sort that out and couldn't.