Proposal: CGY/PIT: Mangiapane for Simon

[HabsQC]

Wait who ?

 

[Lunatik]

Wait who ?

solid contribution, thanks

 

[blankall]

He reminds me more of Matt Zuccarello

Don’t see the Gaudreau skating. He’s good though

Style is different, but they definitely both read the game very well and both drive plays. I'd agree mangiapane can't dangle like Gaudreau.

Mangiapane isn't as physically engaging as Zucarello though.

 

[Halla]

so dude who proved he can be a bottom 6 player at the NHL vs dude who hasnt shown he can be an NHLer (and based on his size and skillset seems like one of those career AHL scoring champ types)

 

[Volica]

The Flames get a skilled young forward to help their team now who can play LW/RW as required.

The Pens get a skilled young LW who had trouble scoring in the NHL last year but produced well in the AHL and is waiver-exempt so he can develop there until he's ready.

Mangi didn’t have trouble scoring in the NHL last season. He was played 6 minutes a night in a 4th line role with fringe NHLers.

He made that line look dangerous. Just another reason Gulutzan had to be fired.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Mangi didn’t have trouble scoring in the NHL last season. He was played 6 minutes a night in a 4th line role with fringe NHLers.

He made that line look dangerous. Just another reason Gulutzan had to be fired.

Yes, he did have trouble scoring in the NHL last season. That's objectively true.

What you're doing is providing a rationale for his scoring trouble.

 

[HabsQC]

solid contribution, thanks

So is this proposal... My question shouldn't have been who, but why?

 

[Lunatik]

So is this proposal... My question shouldn't have been who, but why?

He said why in the OP......

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

so dude who proved he can be a bottom 6 player at the NHL vs dude who hasnt shown he can be an NHLer (and based on his size and skillset seems like one of those career AHL scoring champ types)

Lol Ok. He is 21 and was leading the AHL in points per game for most of the season.

But sure... lots of guys that are 21 leading the AHL in points per game fizzle out and don’t become NHL players.. oh wait that almost has never happened in the last ten years.

You sound knowledgeable

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

Yes, he did have trouble scoring in the NHL last season. That's objectively true.

What you're doing is providing a rationale for his scoring trouble.

No, objectively speaking, the NHL sample size of Mangiapane is entirely inconclusive.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

No, objectively speaking, the NHL sample size of Mangiapane is entirely inconclusive.

I didn't say anything was conclusive about how he would produce moving forward or if he had played more games last season. But the fact was that he had trouble scoring in the games he had. That's not up for debate.

 

[Johnnybegood13]

He's a great AHL player. Very small. Has yet to see a true NHL opportunity. Shades of Gaudreau.

He's not "very small" at all, I played golf in a group behind him and I'm guess he's close to 5'11, 190lbs, a very strong looking young man, along with having some nice skill he also plays the game with an edge. Zero chance I trade him for Simon

 

[blankall]

He's not "very small" at all, I played golf in a group behind him and I'm guess he's close to 5'11, 190lbs, a very strong looking young man, along with having some nice skill he also plays the game with an edge. Zero chance I trade him for Simon

Maybe his head and neck are just small. He looks pretty small on the ice. If what you are saying is true though, that makes me pretty excited for him as a prospect.

He's listed at 5'10'' and 184 lbs. Is he the first NHL player to list smaller than actual?

 

[Riptide]

Sounds like Simon is worth more based on your descriptions.

Players who haven't really shown that they're NHL regulars do not usually go for all that much - especially when they need waivers to go to WBS.

 

[Johnnybegood13]

Maybe his head and neck are just small. He looks pretty small on the ice. If what you are saying is true though, that makes me pretty excited for him as a prospect.

He's listed at 5'10'' and 184 lbs. Is he the first NHL player to list smaller than actual?

Most of those numbers come from the players first camp at 18 years old. I saw him at summer development camp a few years ago and he was far smaller.

 

[Brockon]

Lol Ok. He is 21 and was leading the AHL in points per game for most of the season.

But sure... lots of guys that are 21 leading the AHL in points per game fizzle out and don’t become NHL players.. oh wait that almost has never happened in the last ten years.

You sound knowledgeable

Have you heard of Kenny Agostino? 26 years old, 22 NHL GP, 6P - 241 AHL GP, 236 P. I believe that he was the leading AHL scorer in 2016-17 with 83 P for the Chicago Wolves. Now with his 4th NHL team (Montréal) because he doesn't have what it takes to make a line up in a scoring role on a decent team.

Maybe he gets a chance to play with the Habs, but that's more about their roster problems than his ability to play in the NHL - Calgary, St Louis and Boston all let him leave after 1 year.

 

[Lunatik]

Have you heard of Kenny Agostino? 26 years old, 22 NHL GP, 6P - 241 AHL GP, 236 P. I believe that he was the leading AHL scorer in 2016-17 with 83 P for the Chicago Wolves. Now with his 4th NHL team (Montréal) because he doesn't have what it takes to make a line up in a scoring role on a decent team.

Maybe he gets a chance to play with the Habs, but that's more about their roster problems than his ability to play in the NHL - Calgary, St Louis and Boston all let him leave after 1 year.

You are asking a Flames fan if he's heard of a player involved in the Iginla trade? I like Agostino personally, but he never had a comparable season to Mangiapane's 21 year old season until he was 24. Context matters. While I am nowhere near as high on Mangiapane as many other Flames fan, comparing him to Kenny Agostino doesn't exactly make a ton of sense.

Now, here is a list of players aged 21 and under, that over the past decade have averaged the same or higher point per game ratio (1.18) as Andrew Mangiapane did this past season. This will allow people to decide for themselves on the matter. (Min. 25GP)

2008-09

• Steve Downie - 33 points, 27 games (1.22)

2009-10

• Logan Couture - 53 points, 42 games (1.26)

2010-11

• None

2011-12

• None

2012-13

• Taylor Hall - 34 points, 26 games (1.31)

2013-14

• Ryan Strome - 49 points, 37 games (1.32)

2014-15

• None

2015-16

• Frank Vatrano - 55 points, 36 games (1.53)
• William Nylander - 60 points, 52 games (1.18)

2016-17

• None

2017-18

• Andrew Mangiapane - 46 points, 39 games (1.18)

To be honest, I expected more than 7 names when I set out to do this. But, 5 of the 7 names were first round picks. All are current or former NHL regulars. I would say looking at this list, the chances of Mangiapane being an NHL regular at some point in time, are fairly good.

 

[PensPlz]

Crosby isn't sharing a bunk bed and making bedsheet forts with Simon all summer just to see him traded to Calgary.

(Crosby invited Simon to train with him)

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Have you heard of Kenny Agostino? 26 years old, 22 NHL GP, 6P - 241 AHL GP, 236 P. I believe that he was the leading AHL scorer in 2016-17 with 83 P for the Chicago Wolves. Now with his 4th NHL team (Montréal) because he doesn't have what it takes to make a line up in a scoring role on a decent team.

Maybe he gets a chance to play with the Habs, but that's more about their roster problems than his ability to play in the NHL - Calgary, St Louis and Boston all let him leave after 1 year.

Again Agostino didn’t have success until he was 24ish.

Which is my point, as the above poster noted. Most players that have that kind of statistical success at that age are already making the NHL. It’s actually very uncommon for players to have that kind of success and not become NHL regulars.

Someone that came to mind that had that kind of success to fail was Linden Vey. He was traded for a second rounder after he had a similar offensive season at a similar age to Mangiapane. Then one of his parents attempted to murder his other parent... and his game fell apart