Proposal: Carolina - Los Angeles

Rorschach

Who the f*** is Trevor Moore?
Oct 9, 2006
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Yea Alex Iafallo played on the Kings 1st line but is Iafallo considered a full time option on the 1st line with way more talented prospects like Byfield, Turcotte, Vilardi, Kupari, Fagemo, Thomas, Anderson-Dolan, Madden and others pushing for a place in the Kings lineup over the next few seasons.

LA has so many center prospects that some of them are bound to be pushed to the wing and Iafallo only has 1 season till UFA why not get something for him now while his value is at its highest.

You're right in what you say...so where is our "something for him" in this deal?
If the deal was offering a nice defenseman or a good goaltender prospect/young player with upside, or a late first or a pair of second rounders, that would "something for him".

Saddling us with a old dude/cap dump when when we're in the middle of a youth movement is not "something", it is counter-productive.
 

Mats26

Vet Movement - What's the Maatta?
Sep 16, 2005
3,838
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We can argue the trade value here, but my take is simple.

Kings say No because:

1LW that has chemistry with our current 1C center. Brings stability to the top line while young prospects move in the lineup.
No prospect is ready to play 1LW minutes yet. An area(LW) the Kings are weak in the prospect pool.
Progressivly getting better (stats)every year
UFA this summer means we can protect another player and tell Seattle we have a deal in place for Iaffallo.
Bridge players (he's 26 years old) is lacking on the team right now.


Kings say Yes only if the deal makes sense to plug a hole (on D or upgrade to the LW) - This trade does not do that.
 
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Raccoon Jesus

Todd McLellan is an inside agent
Oct 30, 2008
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Yea Alex Iafallo played on the Kings 1st line but is Iafallo considered a full time option on the 1st line with way more talented prospects like Byfield, Turcotte, Vilardi, Kupari, Fagemo, Thomas, Anderson-Dolan, Madden and others pushing for a place in the Kings lineup over the next few seasons.

LA has so many center prospects that some of them are bound to be pushed to the wing and Iafallo only has 1 season till UFA why not get something for him now while his value is at its highest.

Alex Iafallo is an excellent complementary player, but like a Tanner Pearson, who probably isn't going to get you 60 points but will break 50 once or twice on a better team (he was on pace for it this year). He's one of the only Kings to have improved his production in a shit environment year-over-year-over-year in his career thus far (look at the teams he's played on, yuck). You're mistaking 'vanilla' for ineffective. He's got drive and tenacity, total puckhound, with completely underrated vision and shot to go with good wheels. He works well with Kopitar and Brown because that whole line is lunchpail like that. He can play with talent and while he's not ideally a 1W he'd be playing middle six on any team in the league for great value. If he were to stick with the Kings, he'd be excellent in that role in the coming years. Basically, if JAD turns out to be Iafallo, we're stoked. If not, hey, we have the original!


Why though?
Carolina is retaining Nino somewhat x 2 seasons and Nino is a veteran player that is serviceable and fills more of a need in the future in a bottom 6 role.

I can’t see all those Kings prospects playing in the bottom 6, Iafallo is UFA after the season, so if Iafallo negotiates at a higher price Blake will most likely rather pay a talented ELC controlled prospect rather then pay twice the rate and term for Iafallo who’s numbers are advanced by playing on the 1st line in LA.

If Iafallo walks UFA then the Kings get nothing at all.


You're ignoring the rest of the LA's prospect pool. We have NO SHORTAGE of guys who can fill in the bottom six and LA is arguably the best team in the league at churning out 'just a guy' NHLers, look at their placement rate for late round picks, multiple 4th-7th rounders playing key roles all across the NHL. We just finished ranking 40 prospects on our forum if you want to take a look and if there's anything we have it's forward depth. What role does nino fill? We have the veterans in Kopitar, Brown, Carter. They go to the net and grind. We have younger better players on the way. Why would we commit to nino for two years? We can do better for Iafallo and our cap space.

If he walks he walks, but we get more at the deadline bar none, if we think he's going to move on. But why would he? La's got money to throw around and he's playing important big minutes with one of the best centers in the league. If he gets hurt and we get nothing so be it, but that's better than selling low on Iafallo and Cap.

And, maybe most importantly, we don't need more middling picks. We need blue chip D prospects or high picks if anything. If you want to build something around Iafallo for, say, Jake Bean, maybe we're listening.



I just wanted to hear some opinions from Kings fans about Iafallo’s game since they watch him more on a day to day basis during the season then I do.

I don’t get to watch as many west coast games living on the eastern seaboard but evaluating a player of Iafallo’s skill set of pretty standard stuff.

Im not sure if your familiar with Iafallo’s game or not but zero in on him and watch, look where most of his goals come from, look at him away from the puck.
I didn’t really see anything that stood out except for the drive in his game, Iafallo seems like a heart and soul type of player which could be valuable to a young Kings team in its own right but that also depends on what Iafallo’s agent is asking for as far as term and salary go.

Id also ask Kings fans where they’d value Iafallo as far as average annual value goes and how many years could he be resigned to.

If I were looking to resign Iafallo, I’d be comfortable at 2 maybe 3 seasons at 3.25 aav anything over that and I’d be looking to move him.


Which of course is the concern and I'm glad you admit it.

Alex Iafallo would be viewed like Alex Killorn (pre-nuclear season of course) if he were playing on the east coast instead of a western basement. His attention to detail is phenomenal. We've seen championship teams, as someone mentioned earlier, he gives me a heavy Justin Williams vibe. He can be every bit as intense.
 
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Maurice of Orange

Wahatquenak
Feb 5, 2016
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You're right in what you say...so where is our "something for him" in this deal?
If the deal was offering a nice defenseman or a good goaltender prospect/young player with upside, or a late first or a pair of second rounders, that would "something for him".

Saddling us with a old dude/cap dump when when we're in the middle of a youth movement is not "something", it is counter-productive.
I wouldn’t consider a player that just turned 28 in September an old dude as you’ve stated. Once players get over 30 years old the miles on their wheels tend to rack up.

Neiderreiter can also still be a productive player in the right situation, I don’t understand why some posters dismiss Neiderreiter as if he were a trash player because of 1 down season that was cutoff.

In fact I’ll go out on a limb and state that if Neiderreiter was healthy and on the Kings 1st line he’d most likely out produce Iafallo in that same spot while boasting way better possession numbers.

If you ask me who the more talented player is it would be close but if both players are at the top of their game I’d go with Neiderreiter but as far as value goes I believe Iafallo has more value due to the fact that his cap hit is lower and his contract is up at the end of the season.

If Iafallo can have another season like he did last year it bodes well for Los Angeles but if something we’re to happen and Iafallo game drops off he will eventually get passed by, he may get passed by either way regardless once the many LA’s prospects break into the Kings lineup.
 
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Guitpik

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Jul 8, 2006
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Iafallo isn’t a bad player why not try to gain future assets for a player that’s obviously been pumped up being on the Kings 1st line.

To Blake it’s just good business to gain future assets and by the way his tenure has been as LA’s GM he seems to love draft picks as his drafting has been excellent thus far.

Not a fan of the Kings but if Blake keeps drafting the way he has been LA could be a scary team to play against for years to come.

LA doesn’t need Nino for an extra year but the proposal on the Kings side wasn’t all about Nino alone there are also picks attached including if Niederreiter gets to a certain point mark, also Niederreiter contract runs out when Brown’s and Carter’s contracts run their course as well gaining space for the Kings to resign any player they deem worthy of resigning coming off an ELC in the future.
Blake stated in an interview that they are reaching the stage of their rebuild where they are not going to be looking for more draft picks, but to continue developing their young talent. That includes bringing up those players that are ready to make the jump to the show.

It's not that Nino has no value, for Iafallo it makes little sense. The Kings already have extra picks in the 2021 draft, so mid-round picks don't move the needle in a trade.

I don't see Blake sacrificing Iafallo for a player they are looking to flip at the TDL. If they were to do that, they'd be better served moving Iafallo than Nino. Iafallo is the type of player the Kings protect in the ED, Nino is the type they expose.
 

Maurice of Orange

Wahatquenak
Feb 5, 2016
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We can argue the trade value here, but my take is simple.

Kings say No because:

1LW that has chemistry with our current 1C center. Brings stability to the top line while young prospects move in the lineup.
No prospect is ready to play 1LW minutes yet. An area(LW) the Kings are weak in the prospect pool.
Progressivly getting better (stats)every year
UFA this summer means we can protect another player and tell Seattle we have a deal in place for Iaffallo.
Bridge players (he's 26 years old) is lacking on the team right now.


Kings say Yes only if the deal makes sense to plug a hole (on D or upgrade to the LW) - This trade does not do that.
Iafallo is only a stop gap 1LW until the Kings prospects are ready.

The Kings have a lot of defensive prospects 6 or so of which could become serious players for the Kings roster in the future, I agree the wings are the only spot where the Kings can improve in the prospect dept. but with the many center prospects the kings have 3 maybe 4 C’s that might get pushed to the wing so that fills an internal need.

The rest of your assessments and your opinion are noted with no argument from me.
You have valid points and your also the first poster that commented on the Kings expansion plans.
 

Raccoon Jesus

Todd McLellan is an inside agent
Oct 30, 2008
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I wouldn’t consider a player that just turned 28 in September an old dude as you’ve stated. Once players get over 30 years old the miles on their wheels tend to rack up.

Neiderreiter can also still be a productive player in the right situation, I don’t understand why some posters dismiss Neiderreiter as if he were a trash player because of 1 down season that was cutoff.

In fact I’ll go out on a limb and state that if Neiderreiter was healthy and on the Kings 1st line he’d most likely out produce Iafallo in that same spot while boasting way better possession numbers.

If you ask me who the more talented player is it would be close but if both players are at the top of their game I’d go with Neiderreiter but as far as value goes I believe Iafallo has more value due to the fact that his cap hit is lower and his contract is up at the end of the season.

If Iafallo can have another season like he did last year it bodes well for Los Angeles but if something we’re to happen and Iafallo game drops off he will eventually get passed by, he may get passed by either way regardless once the many LA’s prospects break into the Kings lineup.


You're still looking at this wrong. you're looking at it as if everyone is bashing Nino but it's just not a fit because everything you say about Iafallo applies to Nino. Why would we trade for the higher cap hit with more inconsistency and less healthy when the chemistry already exists in the age group with a guy whose cap is lower? The only argument you're making is that Nino is a mystery box that COULD be better. He could also be a total bust here! Iafallo has proven to be consistent, driven, and constantly improving on a shit team for lower salary/cap. And then you're asking us to consider if something goes wrong with Iafallo...well, I'll go with history and trajectory on this one. If I have to bet on which player stays more consistent and healthy this season based on the last three years and the info at hand, it should be a no brainer choice for LA. Especially if the team trajectory is up.
 

kilowatt

the vibes are not immaculate
Jan 1, 2009
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Iafallo is only a stop gap 1LW until the Kings prospects are ready.

The Kings have a lot of defensive prospects 6 or so of which could become serious players for the Kings roster in the future, I agree the wings are the only spot where the Kings can improve in the prospect dept. but with the many center prospects the kings have 3 maybe 4 C’s that might get pushed to the wing so that fills an internal need.

The rest of your assessments and your opinion are noted with no argument from me.
You have valid points and your also the first poster that commented on the Kings expansion plans.

When we have a better left wing to play on our top line, Iafallo will be a very good second- or third-line left winger.

If you’re trying to dump Nino, that’s one thing. Maybe the Kings take Nino for a third. If you’re trying to add Iafallo, the Kings are looking for high picks and defensive prospects. If you’re looking to do both at the same time, it’s going to cost more. If we’re talking Bean or Fleury, a deal can probably be worked out. The Kings are in a great spot and have no reason to make any trades that don’t significantly improve the team. Gaining a third round pick by swapping Iafallo for Nino does not improve the team in any way.
 

Maurice of Orange

Wahatquenak
Feb 5, 2016
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When we have a better left wing to play on our top line, Iafallo will be a very good second- or third-line left winger.

If you’re trying to dump Nino, that’s one thing. Maybe the Kings take Nino for a third. If you’re trying to add Iafallo, the Kings are looking for high picks and defensive prospects. If you’re looking to do both at the same time, it’s going to cost more. If we’re talking Bean or Fleury, a deal can probably be worked out. The Kings are in a great spot and have no reason to make any trades that don’t significantly improve the team. Gaining a third round pick by swapping Iafallo for Nino does not improve the team in any way.
I don’t have nothing further to add from what I’ve already stated regarding the OP. I’ve read and noted what you’ve wrote throughout this thread. There’s no deal to me made I can accept that.

I did want to ask what your opinion is on Kempe, I know less about him as I haven't done as much research on Kempe but is he a player on the rise that could become a 1LW if the Kings don’t happen to resign Iafallo after the 20-21 season?

You’ve also mentioned Bean and Fleury, I don’t believe Carolina would want to part with either player since both could project to be in Carolina’s lineup this season especially if Jake Gardiner falls out of favor with the Canes coaching staff, also Carolina would probably be asking a high price for either defenseman.

I know others have mentioned the Kings defensive prospects but does any of Mikey Anderson, Clague, Bjornfot, Brickley project to be in the Kings defensive rotation this season?

The Kings also have Moverare, Spence and Durzi waiting in the wings and Blake just drafted Helge and Faber in the 2020 2nd round so do the Kings actually need more defensive prospects.

Blake has 9 picks in 2021 does he go for wingers and goalie prospects or is there a need to draft more defenseman?

By the way Blake has drafted from the center out and has done a nice job building up the defense, after the 2021 draft the rebuilding should start paying off for LA.
 
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Raccoon Jesus

Todd McLellan is an inside agent
Oct 30, 2008
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I don’t have nothing further to add from what I’ve already stated regarding the OP. I’ve read and noted what you’ve wrote throughout this thread. There’s no deal to me made I can accept that.

I did want to ask what your opinion is on Kempe, I know less about him as I haven't done as much research on Kempe but is he a player on the rise that could become a 1LW if the Kings don’t happen to resign Iafallo after the 20-21 season?

You’ve also mentioned Bean and Fleury, I don’t believe Carolina would want to part with either player since both could project to be in Carolina’s lineup this season especially if Jake Gardiner falls out of favor with the Canes coaching staff, also Carolina would probably be asking a high price for either defenseman.

I know others have mentioned the Kings defensive prospects but does any of Mikey Anderson, Clague, Bjornfot, Brickley project to be in the Kings defensive rotation this season?

The Kings also have Moverare, Spence and Durzi waiting in the wings and Blake just drafted Helge and Faber in the 2020 2nd round so do the Kings actually need more defensive prospects.

Blake has 9 picks in 2021 does he go for wingers and goalie prospects or is there a need to draft more defenseman?

By the way Blake has drafted from the center out and has done a nice job building up the defense, after the 2021 draft the rebuilding should start paying off for LA.


Iafallo and Kempe are roughly equal at this point. Kempe 'looks' better but always leaves us wanting more. He always seems on the verge of a breakthru but ultimately he's been best as a middle six forward (Kempe-Vilardi-Frk looked unstoppable). I can't imagine they'd want to give him up either as he's one of the few players the Kings have in his age range.

Kings projected defense for this year is likely to be some combo of Doughty/Maatta/Roy/Walker with MacDermid as the 7th and rotating Anderson, Bjornfot, Clague through. Brickley would have to have a monster camp, he probably needs a change of scenery, and of course there could be some surprises. The reason LA needs defensive prospects is that sure one of those guys could break through but we have no 'true' bluechippers amongst them to eventually replace Doughty unless we luck into Owen Power. There's a good high-ceiling crop of Faber/Grans/Nousiainen/Spence/Hults/Durzi and a few other wild cards like Moverare but no one we can really count on right now to fill a top-pairing void. Hope isn't much of a strategy. Just like our point with the picks, it's not about 'more' but about 'better.' blake is going to have to swing assets for a young d-man unless one of these guys goes nuclear.
 

GIN ANTONIC

Registered User
Aug 19, 2007
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We don’t need Iafollo. I mean I’m sure he’d be fine on the Canes but we need cap space for than anything.

If good Nino shows up he’s well worth his contract. If bad Nino shows up he’s frustrating as hell and it’s basically a coin flip as to which one you’re gonna get. Canes would put a 3rd to not play a guessing game and get the cap space but in theory if he does play well then he’s the perfect fit for our 1st or 2nd line.
 

Maurice of Orange

Wahatquenak
Feb 5, 2016
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If Carolina wants Brickley, a fourth would do it.
I did not realize Brickley’s game soured that much in the AHL, I know he was sought after coming out of the college ranks as an undrafted FA but I didn’t know Brickley’s game pretty much did a face plant in the minors.

Don’t follow AHL west coast action so I’ll take him out of consideration as a top defensive Kings prospect.
 

Maurice of Orange

Wahatquenak
Feb 5, 2016
10,155
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We don’t need Iafollo. I mean I’m sure he’d be fine on the Canes but we need cap space for than anything.

If good Nino shows up he’s well worth his contract. If bad Nino shows up he’s frustrating as hell and it’s basically a coin flip as to which one you’re gonna get. Canes would put a 3rd to not play a guessing game and get the cap space but in theory if he does play well then he’s the perfect fit for our 1st or 2nd line.
Canes have Svechnikov, Teravainen, Necas and Foegele holding the wing spots in the top 6 with the Hurricanes if I’m not mistaken so that kinda pushes Neiderreiter to the 3rd line LW.

I would switch Nino and Foegele if it meant Neiderreiter would score more but if Baderreiter shows up then all bets are off as far as keeping Nino in the top 6 wing.
 

kilowatt

the vibes are not immaculate
Jan 1, 2009
18,488
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I did not realize Brickley’s game soured that much in the AHL, I know he was sought after coming out of the college ranks as an undrafted FA but I didn’t know Brickley’s game pretty much did a face plant in the minors.

Don’t follow AHL west coast action so I’ll take him out of consideration as a top defensive Kings prospect.

It's not entirely Brickley's fault. The Kings have had a lot of good prospects come into the system the last couple years and Brickley's faced a few injuries. He's pretty low on prospect rankings now, but I think that's more prospect fatigue than anything. But he's not really too exciting of a prospect. The Kings have several very promising defensive prospects: Bjornfot, Anderson, Grans, Faber, Clague, Hults, Spence, and Nousiainen. That's not to mention the outstanding play of Matt Roy and Sean Walker. There's just not really an opportunity for Brickley for much longer, unless he really asserts himself this year. The Kings just have too many good prospects in the cupboard.
 
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GIN ANTONIC

Registered User
Aug 19, 2007
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Canes have Svechnikov, Teravainen, Necas and Foegele holding the wing spots in the top 6 with the Hurricanes if I’m not mistaken so that kinda pushes Neiderreiter to the 3rd line LW.

I would switch Nino and Foegele if it meant Neiderreiter would score more but if Baderreiter shows up then all bets are off as far as keeping Nino in the top 6 wing.

Foegele isn’t ready for top 6 duties. His game is still really raw. Lots of good tools but he’s developing well on the 3rd line.

If bad Nino shows up we either need Dzingel to step in and start producing in a big way or make some moves to bring in another winger
 
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Rorschach

Who the f*** is Trevor Moore?
Oct 9, 2006
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Los Angeles
I wouldn’t consider a player that just turned 28 in September an old dude as you’ve stated. Once players get over 30 years old the miles on their wheels tend to rack up.

Neiderreiter can also still be a productive player in the right situation, I don’t understand why some posters dismiss Neiderreiter as if he were a trash player because of 1 down season that was cutoff.

In fact I’ll go out on a limb and state that if Neiderreiter was healthy and on the Kings 1st line he’d most likely out produce Iafallo in that same spot while boasting way better possession numbers.

If you ask me who the more talented player is it would be close but if both players are at the top of their game I’d go with Neiderreiter but as far as value goes I believe Iafallo has more value due to the fact that his cap hit is lower and his contract is up at the end of the season.

If Iafallo can have another season like he did last year it bodes well for Los Angeles but if something we’re to happen and Iafallo game drops off he will eventually get passed by, he may get passed by either way regardless once the many LA’s prospects break into the Kings lineup.

Our team is drafting 18-20 year olds and starting to graduate 22-23 year olds. 28 is a very old dude...five years outside our window.
 

Anguyen92

Registered User
Aug 23, 2020
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The Kings spent the last two trade deadlines getting trades on their veterans to freshen up the core that's aging. If we wanted a 28-year old on our roster, we could have probably just resign Toffoli when he went UFA, this offseason, and it could have cost slightly less than the cap hit of what Niederreiter has. We didn't because there's a lot of promising prospects that we have and the time has come (although some may say the team should have done this earlier) to move on from the Stanley Cup winning core.
 
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biturbo19

Registered User
Jul 13, 2010
25,859
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Nino seems like he's in a kinda awkward situation with Carolina. Where he's still a solid contributor, and has versatility. His cap number isn't horrible, but isn't good either.

Like...what team wouldn't want a nice versatile two-way Top-9 Forward literal Swiss Army Knife type winger with size, speed, a bit of physicality, a bit of ability to play all situations? But the sorta "prototypical middle-6" profile is a tough sell in a flat cap world at $5.25M filling out his last couple potential "peak" years, and with the sort of volatility he has in his production. Is he a 15G-40Pt guy? Or a 25G-50Pt guy?

Puts him in that sort of awkward spot where he's probably more useful to Carolina as good solid depth, where he can still put in solid minutes...compared to what they'd get for him in trade, with that contract (which is basically nothing, without significant salary coming back to balance).


I think he'd be a perfect fit for the Canucks...but it's one of those things that just isn't feasible without sending cap back to offset. And the price of any sort of "cap swap" deal to balance, would probably drive the trade price of acquisition, out of the realm of what makes sense for a player like that. I'd love to hear proposals that make sense...i'm just not sure they're out there. He's exactly the sort of speedier, heavier, two-way LW/RW they need to float around the Top-6. But unless Sutter was going back to the Carolinas, or it was part of a bigger deal...it's hard to make it sensible.


This is how players like Nino get trapped in weird situations.
 
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Kurrilino

Go Stoll Go
Aug 6, 2005
8,745
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Calgary
I really don't like Iafallo.
But trading a player like him for a 3rd a conditional 4th and a cap dump????????
We are way better off waiting for our youngsters to grow up and trade him at deadline.

If you want Iafallo and expect us to take on Niedereiter you better attach a 1st
 

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