Carey Price Legacy will be permanently damaged

[Iceman]

As I said a cup would help his resume and I mean it did not look un-sustainable when he was running at .935%. It was the result of a great technic and lots of confidence.

So this mean he should/could replicate in the future or something close and I bank on him playing another 6-8 years at elite level. At that point I think he would make the HHOF even without a cup.

But if he keeps getting injured and retire in 4-5 years he won't make it.

It's incredibly tough to get into the HHOF as a goalie, it might change in the future but right now we have goalies like Barrasso, Joseph, Vernon and to a lesser extend Osgood and maybe even Liut and Vanbiesbrouck sitting outside the HHOF. If they remain outside the HHOF for the unforeseeable future, how many goalies currently active can walk past these guys into the Hall?

 

[Ace of Hades]

Legacy?

You can talk about whether he has one or not, once his career is finished.

 

[bob27]

The "hate" he receives in HFBoards seems over the top in a vacuum, but if you consider the preposterous hype he received after his Hart trophy season it is perfectly proportional. He was not just the best goalie in the league (AINEC), he was a generational talent, the best player in the league and on his was railroaded by the media to become the best goalie ever. People were struggling to figure out whether Carey Price or Conor McDavid would be the best foundational piece to start your franchise in 2015.

All this after a wildly inconsistent career followed by one great season. The hype was absolutely out of control and if anything it is surprising how many excuses the Canadian media machine still makes for him considering he has never showed to be worthy of the titanic expectations once bestowed upon him.

 

[BBB24]

TSN reported tonight that Carey Price was solid in his return, gave up five goals on 39 shots. I wonder how many other goalies around the league get the same accolades after giving up five goals on less that forty shots. Man is this guy ever overrated. Before anyone ask, yes I saw the game and there were at least three softies by him, but that’s ok, it’s Carey.

 

[smack66]

TSN reported tonight that Carey Price was solid in his return, gave up five goals on 39 shots. I wonder how many other goalies around the league get the same accolades after giving up five goals on less that forty shots. Man is this guy ever overrated. Before anyone ask, yes I saw the game and there were at least three softies by him, but that’s ok, it’s Carey.

The Canadian media legacy grows

 

[That70sline]

So basically no player except Sid and Ovi have a legacy in the past 20 years.

Don't know where you read that. Your just making up things.

 

[That70sline]

You'd pick Halak before price... This says every thing we need to know.

While i dont agree with the Halak choice, i can see where some people might be worried taking Price over Halak in a game 7. Some may believe Halak can find that Special play he had back when he beat out price for the starting role. And Price has never been reallllllyyy good in the playoffs.

Still I'd go with Price between those 2, But the obvious answer for me would be Jon Quick, since he's never lost a game 7.

 

[Lshap]

As a whole, yes you really do.

There's a reason people argue Thomas shouldn't be in the HoF despite being the best in the league while he was in it.

There's a reason Benn is considered just a good winger instead of the best player in the league. There's a reason the Sedins aren't considered 100+ pt players. The truly greats are great for the vast majority of their career.

Looking at Price's career, he's been the best one year, great in 3 others (but not the best) and average at best the other 6, soon to be 7, years of his career.

He's going to have to have one hell of an end of his career.

You're presenting a fair argument, but 'legacy' is more a player's perceived impact, not his total numbers. Quite a few stars play on beyond their prime and compromise their career stats -- Lundqvist, Chara, Iginla, etc. -- yet their legacies remain secure, because nobody cares about the seasons after a player's prime. So why would they care about the seasons before a player's prime?

After all, at the bottom of players' stats column it says, "Career", not "Legacy". They're two different things.

I'll maintain that if 30-year-old Price plays the next few years at the same level he's played the last few, his legacy will be established, and all talk of his early 20s will be ignored as irrelevant. Right now I don't think anything's been established beyond him being among the top goalies.

 

[Bleedred]

Yea, what legacy? He had one amazing season, one season doesn't form a legacy

A lot of goalies have only had ONE amazing season like Price did in 14-15. It's unsustainable to have more than one season like that. Most goalies don't even have a season that amazing. Tim Thomas is like the only guy that's had two seasons like that in the modern era. Hasek has had a handful of seasons like, adjusted for era. Outside of Lundqvist, Luongo, Quick and Miller, I don't think another active goalie has had a season nearly that good. And Miller and Quick have both only had season better than ,920% (Miller might have his second this year, but it will be as a backup and Quick is currently north of .920%) in their career so far. I guess you can say Rask did in 13-14? I'm not gonna count his lockout shortened season or his backup to Thomas years. You lose credit for that, as doing it in 20-30 games isn't as impressive as 50-60 or more. Or else Brian Elliott would be the king of these. Holtby has never even had a season like that either. I guess you can count Bob last year too. Not the lockout year, as he only played 38 games.

That said, Price has been trash this season. He looked like a junkmobile again last night. I think he wanted back a couple of those goals. He'll either bounce back to what he was (or a .920-ish goalie) or he'll continue a trend of downward play like Schneider has this year. Either way, I think he's an amnesty buyout candidate during the next CBA. Even if he bounces back, I think he's getting bought out in a few years when there's an amnesty buyout. I don't see Bergevin being in Montreal in 2020 or 2021.

 

[Vancouver Canucks]

Don't know where you read that. You are just making up things.

He's making things up.

 

[Prettyisland]

If you look at the start of his career , has there been a player who has had the narrative do a 180 like price?

2008 after winning ahl playoff mvp honors he’s next great Canadian net minder.

Plays poorly , loses job to Halak , considered draft bust

Couple years of solid numbers followed by a incredible season. Considered best goalie in the world

Gets injured for year Canadiens suffer, he is injury prone ( yet regarded as covering up the habs warts from being a lottery team “

Comes back last year has solid year and habs make playoffs he’s back

Bad year with injuries this year his entire legacy in jeopardy?

If it’s a pattern I expect a comeback lights out season next year.

Looking forward to everyone’s flip flop.

But honestly until that blue line is fixed up it doesn’t matter lol

 

[Mrb1p]

No it means, Price isn't the clear cut "best goalie in the world" like I hear all the time from some in the Canadian and Canadien media.

It's the Derek Jeter, Kobe Bryant effect (in the 2nd half of their careers). At least they won World Series & NBA titles to gain their "name".

He's a top 5-10 goalie, but there are about 10 goalies that you can basically rank 1 to 10 or 10 to 1 at any given time, yet Price is anointed the "best" for some weird reason despite his weak showings in the playoffs.

The following list of goalies careers have been just as good, and in some cases better than Price, save for 1 season. Yet Price is somehow the best of this generation?

Lundquvist
Holtby
Rinne
Quick
Bobrovsky
Rask
Dubnyk
Schneider
Crawford
Fleury

Lundqvist, fine, hes older and hes been consistently elite. Lacks a clear number one year to my taste but still.
Luongo, same as Hank.

Holtby has one Vezina and one nominations... hes 4 nominations short of Price. Hasnt won anything either, his vezina year is worse, hes on a much better team, international play too is worse.

Rinne has 2-2-4. No wins, one SCF, no international success, plays for a juggernaut. Not ahead.

Quick has no Vezina win, one as 2, two nominations and two other top 10, he does have a major award in a conn smythe and two cups. Same number of noms, no wins, less top 10, less international success, better team and nothing since the Kings have fallen off. Yep, i doubt he has a better legacy. Hes close to Tim Thomas kinda.

Bob has two Vezinas and a number 8... nothing else, sub 900 save percentage in the POs, never won a series, won a single game in his career. Great anyway, two vezina wins is hard to dispute and he has some really dominant showings on bad teams.

Dubnyk? Cmon man.

Rask has one win and two other top 10, four short of Price and one less nomination. No hart, no Lindsay, no international success, cup as a 2nd string.

The rest is stupid and shouldnt even be discussed.

 

[Mrb1p]

If you look at the start of his career , has there been a player who has had the narrative do a 180 like price?

2008 after winning ahl playoff mvp honors he’s next great Canadian net minder.

Plays poorly , loses job to Halak , considered draft bust

Couple years of solid numbers followed by a incredible season. Considered best goalie in the world

Gets injured for year Canadiens suffer, he is injury prone ( yet regarded as covering up the habs warts from being a lottery team “

Comes back last year has solid year and habs make playoffs he’s back

Bad year with injuries this year his entire legacy in jeopardy?

If it’s a pattern I expect a comeback lights out season next year.

Looking forward to everyone’s flip flop.

But honestly until that blue line is fixed up it doesn’t matter lol

Its just about undermining the Habs on HF. See Subban too.

 

[LoonieDeals]

Seeing all these posts dismissing Dubnyk, whne comparing Price is laughable. I'm not making a claim that Dubnyk is the best goalie, or a top 3 or top 5. Would I pick Dubnyk to start my franchise, no.

My point: Dubnyk stats since joining Minnesota are VERY VERY similar to Price's career stats. Price just gets the Canadian & Canadien media hype.

 

[sandysan]

Seeing all these posts dismissing Dubnyk, whne comparing Price is laughable. I'm not making a claim that Dubnyk is the best goalie, or a top 3 or top 5. Would I pick Dubnyk to start my franchise, no.

My point: Dubnyk stats since joining Minnesota are VERY VERY similar to Price's career stats. Price just gets the Canadian & Canadien media hype.

price gets to also play behind defensive stalwarts like jordie been, karl alzner, schlemko, morrow, barberio, green as grass D ( when they are not injured) on a team that A) had zero center depth and B) systemically cannot score.

I get that the boxscore watchers want to opine about things, I mean all of that time in front of an open Xcel spreasheet has to count for something, right ? But if montreal were not at the bottom in scoring, or didnt have a craptastic defense a lot of these concerns about Price's play go poof. on a team that can score, and a team with average defense, price can be the difference.

The people who say that he's a flash in the pan, you do recognized that the expectation that he needs to keep EVERY game at 2 goals or less ( not matter how bad our defense plays, and trust me it can be REALLY bad) to have a chance to win, and more than half he can only let in one goal to have a chance to get points is completely unrealistic, right ?

Trust me the habs may have 99 problems, price aint one.

 

[Dolemite]

If there’s a legacy that’s going to be ruined it’s the legacy of the Habs. If ownership doesn’t clean house after this season fans are going to stop going to games.

 

[DickSmehlik]

TSN reported tonight that Carey Price was solid in his return, gave up five goals on 39 shots. I wonder how many other goalies around the league get the same accolades after giving up five goals on less that forty shots. Man is this guy ever overrated. Before anyone ask, yes I saw the game and there were at least three softies by him, but that’s ok, it’s Carey.

Just wait until they report that Crosby is having the better season than Malkin or that Toews is not a reason for the Blackhawks missing the post-season this year, followed by a fond look back at the summer that the Jay Bouwmeester sweepstakes gripped a nation.

 

[LoonieDeals]

price gets to also play behind defensive stalwarts like jordie been, karl alzner, schlemko, morrow, barberio, green as grass D ( when they are not injured) on a team that A) had zero center depth and B) systemically cannot score.

I get that the boxscore watchers want to opine about things, I mean all of that time in front of an open Xcel spreasheet has to count for something, right ? But if montreal were not at the bottom in scoring, or didnt have a craptastic defense a lot of these concerns about Price's play go poof. on a team that can score, and a team with average defense, price can be the difference.

The people who say that he's a flash in the pan, you do recognized that the expectation that he needs to keep EVERY game at 2 goals or less ( not matter how bad our defense plays, and trust me it can be REALLY bad) to have a chance to win, and more than half he can only let in one goal to have a chance to get points is completely unrealistic, right ?

Trust me the habs may have 99 problems, price aint one.

LOL. Love your type. Turn to personal insults when facts are't in your favour.

And you conflating facts may work with others, but it will not work with me.

Benn was acquired last year (when they had Weber, Markov, Petry, Emelin).
Barberio was playing behind Subban, Markov, Petry, Emelin in 15-16 and last year behind Weber, Markov, Emelin, Petry...?

Alzner, Schlemko & Morrow this year..

Price stats this year behind the craptastic d makes him one of the WORST.. He's basically in a 3 way tie for the worst starting goalie in the NHL with Craig Anderson & Jaro Halak.

Even prior to this year, his stats (except that one year) hasn't been as great as some homers make it seem, where he has separated himself from the pack as the "best goalie in the world".

 

[WesMcCauley]

Price brought the Habs to the conference finals in 2014 when they had no buisness beating that Bruins team

Lundqvist has done that for years in NY. Played behind a team with no legit #1C, Average #1D and no top point producer for many years. His save % on high danger shots has been unreal for many years aswell. The NYR teams that beat Caps and Pens in the playoffs multiple times were nothing without Lundqvist.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Legacy?? What legacy?

 

[That70sline]

A lot of goalies have only had ONE amazing season like Price did in 14-15. It's unsustainable to have more than one season like that. Most goalies don't even have a season that amazing. Tim Thomas is like the only guy that's had two seasons like that in the modern era. Hasek has had a handful of seasons like, adjusted for era. Outside of Lundqvist, Luongo, Quick and Miller, I don't think another active goalie has had a season nearly that good. And Miller and Quick have both only had season better than ,920% (Miller might have his second this year, but it will be as a backup and Quick is currently north of .920%) in their career so far. I guess you can say Rask did in 13-14? I'm not gonna count his lockout shortened season or his backup to Thomas years. You lose credit for that, as doing it in 20-30 games isn't as impressive as 50-60 or more. Or else Brian Elliott would be the king of these. Holtby has never even had a season like that either. I guess you can count Bob last year too. Not the lockout year, as he only played 38 games.

That said, Price has been trash this season. He looked like a junkmobile again last night. I think he wanted back a couple of those goals. He'll either bounce back to what he was (or a .920-ish goalie) or he'll continue a trend of downward play like Schneider has this year. Either way, I think he's an amnesty buyout candidate during the next CBA. Even if he bounces back, I think he's getting bought out in a few years when there's an amnesty buyout. I don't see Bergevin being in Montreal in 2020 or 2021.

Good Argument here but its not only about save %. There is a lot more that goes into it. Individual awards, Cups, Being Clutch, wins, gaa.

 

[tacogeoff]

Legacy?? What legacy?

This.

Lets let him finish his career and see where the chips fall before we start throwing around the title of Legacy.

 

[Bleedred]

Good Argument here but its not only about save %. There is a lot more that goes into it. Individual awards, Cups, Being Clutch, wins, gaa.

GAA and wins are team stats. A goalie facing 35 shots is gonna have a higher GAA than the goalie with the identical save percentage who faces only 25-30.

There was a time where Price had a reputation for being a big game imploder. It probably still exists with some people, but I think his 2014 gold medal win in the Olympics helped shed that a little bit. He’s been fine his last several playoffs, but his first 25 playoff games over 4 or 5 years left a lot to be desired.

 

[That70sline]

Lundqvist, fine, hes older and hes been consistently elite. Lacks a clear number one year to my taste but still.
Luongo, same as Hank.

Holtby has one Vezina and one nominations... hes 4 nominations short of Price. Hasnt won anything either, his vezina year is worse, hes on a much better team, international play too is worse.

Rinne has 2-2-4. No wins, one SCF, no international success, plays for a juggernaut. Not ahead.

Quick has no Vezina win, one as 2, two nominations and two other top 10, he does have a major award in a conn smythe and two cups. Same number of noms, no wins, less top 10, less international success, better team and nothing since the Kings have fallen off. Yep, i doubt he has a better legacy. Hes close to Tim Thomas kinda.

Bob has two Vezinas and a number 8... nothing else, sub 900 save percentage in the POs, never won a series, won a single game in his career. Great anyway, two vezina wins is hard to dispute and he has some really dominant showings on bad teams.

Dubnyk? Cmon man.

Rask has one win and two other top 10, four short of Price and one less nomination. No hart, no Lindsay, no international success, cup as a 2nd string.

The rest is stupid and shouldnt even be discussed.

2 Stanley cups & a conn smythe is enough to talk Legacy. Being clutch, having 0 game 7 loses on the resume. Quick has also never had a really bad season. Always above average to outstanding. He also started his career with a very bad LA kings team.

Also, the great team thing is true but it takes a great team to form a Legacy, Roy (avs, habs) Marty (devils) Hasek (wings).
and Quick winning the Conn smythe with such a great team means he was better than all those great players.

 

[That70sline]

GAA and wins are team stats. A goalie facing 35 shots is gonna have a higher GAA than the goalie with the identical save percentage who faces only 25-30.

There was a time where Price had a reputation for being a big game imploder. It probably still exists with some people, but I think his 2014 gold medal win in the Olympics helped shed that a little bit. He’s been fine his last several playoffs, but his first 25 playoff games over 4 or 5 years left a lot to be desired.

Some would say that getting a lot of shots raises your save% and its harder lower your save % when your getting less shots. Also, A goalies focus comes into play.

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