DL44
Status quo
More damning was his handling of the puck like a grenade. He killed virtually every possession his line had this preseason. It's remarkable how ineffective he was with the puck...
Post-Game Talk: Canucks 5 - Flames 1 || Everything is awesome. We're awesome. You're awesome.
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More damning was his handling of the puck like a grenade. He killed virtually every possession his line had this preseason. It's remarkable how ineffective he was with the puck...
Baby Pettersson
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Guys don't sound the alarms or anything but we are in first place in the entire league! Few more wins and the presidents trophy is ours! 
DL44
Status quo
Guys don't sound the alarms or anything but we are in first place in the entire league! Few more wins and the presidents trophy is ours!
And Art Ross.. and +/- Award.. and..
Jumex
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mossey3535
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- Feb 7, 2011
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Yep, another tire-fire outing from Sbisa....but to be fair he's being forced to play his wrong side to accommodate Hutton....but you still have to wonder why they let a natural right-side d-man in Corrado walk, and forced everyone else to try and play on their wrong side....man, would I have loved to see a Hutton-Corrado combo on the blueline.
Well to be fair Frankie could have fought harder for his spot in pre-season. But in an off-season where I argued that Sbisa still has some miniscule possibility of improvement, seeing this first game just pissed me off.
All through the game I would look up and say "why is that guy so far out of position? Oh, it's Sbisa".
mossey3535
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Good and barely adequate are not the same thing. Calgary for whatever reason was out of sorts last night. A different team is going to leave him in the dust if he continues to be this slow. Every movement was laboured. His stride reminded me of Hodgson's. How is this guy going to hit and grind like this? And if he can't do those things what good is he to us?
Not to mention he could have gotten numerous interference calls for how he draped himself on his checks because he could barely keep up.
Remember, I liked Prust in Montreal. Maybe he'll get his body right in a couple of a games but this first showing doesn't bode well for the future.
xtra
Registered User
The reason I take the prust- kassian trade as bad is we gave up a 5th round pick. If you don't want kassian on the team for whatever reason release him or suspend him or whatever. Don't give up a pick for no reason. And before anyone says it's only a 5th, all draft picks matter as a 5th could turn into an Ben hutton
This fighting conversation is a bit ridiculous. Can fighting change the momentum around? Absolutely it CAN. If you've never seen a game turn after a fight, you've probably been watching the sport for a week, or you're one of those people who bend over backwards to fit the happenings to your narrative.
Does that mean it works EVERY time? No, of course not. It's a fight, not a magic silver bullet sprinkled with pixi dust and kissed by Fortuna. If a team is feeling a bit sluggish sometimes a scrap can get the adrenaline flowing. Sure, might work on both teams but if one team is going while the other team is sluggish, the relative benefit to the sluggish team is potentially greater. It's not a guarantee to change anything, if it was we'd see fights like timeouts in basketball. But absolutely it's something that CAN give a spark, not guaranteed to, but if your team doesn't have the emotions flowing on a given night then finding a dance partner is something a guy like Dorsett can try to do to turn things around.
If Dorsett fights 20 times this season, 10 of which are retalliatory/ sticking up for teammates, 10 are tryiNg to wake his teammates and 1 of those are a catalyst to a win then good job Dorsett.
Not sure the fights last night had any impact on the game, but *sometimes* they do, absolutely.
Does that mean it works EVERY time? No, of course not. It's a fight, not a magic silver bullet sprinkled with pixi dust and kissed by Fortuna. If a team is feeling a bit sluggish sometimes a scrap can get the adrenaline flowing. Sure, might work on both teams but if one team is going while the other team is sluggish, the relative benefit to the sluggish team is potentially greater. It's not a guarantee to change anything, if it was we'd see fights like timeouts in basketball. But absolutely it's something that CAN give a spark, not guaranteed to, but if your team doesn't have the emotions flowing on a given night then finding a dance partner is something a guy like Dorsett can try to do to turn things around.
If Dorsett fights 20 times this season, 10 of which are retalliatory/ sticking up for teammates, 10 are tryiNg to wake his teammates and 1 of those are a catalyst to a win then good job Dorsett.
Not sure the fights last night had any impact on the game, but *sometimes* they do, absolutely.
me2
Go ahead foot
Now imagine a two team league with a 60 game season, with each team fighting each other 60 times. Yes that is a combined 62 wins in 60 games.
Prust probably has some value if we want to trade him at the deadline. He was reasonably effective for Montreal in the playoffs.
I guess if Prust's value is a 3rd or a 4th and we gave up a 5th with Kassian, that probably puts Kassian's value as a 4th or a 5th. That still seemed like terrible value at the time, but given what we know now of Kassian's struggles, it makes more sense.
biturbo19
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The problem with this, is that it's presupposing that "winning" or "losing" the fight matters. Whereas it's really more the act of fighting that can swing the momentum. The message that dropping the gloves sends.
Players aren't sitting there on the bench going, "oh yeah, here we go Dorsy...oh wait, he lost? Booooooo, nevermind, i'm no longer interested".
Of course, those fights last night...
The Dorsett thing with Ferland to kick things off was extremely dumb to watch for us as fans. But inside that locker room...you know he's been in their heads all summer long and win or lose the fight, it sends a clear message, and sets a tone.
The Prust fight...it's hard to imagine that did anything for anyone other than blow a bit of airtime.
But i don't really think pegging anything as far as results to "winning" and "losing" is a meaningful way of looking at it. That's extremely vague on the "outcome", and extremely specific on a particular "detail" that doesn't exactly matter.
I think you've gotta remember...an awful lot of hockey players are kind of "meatheads". One thing they do understand, is violence and ideas like "manning up" and "answering the bell". Seems kind of naive to think fighting has no impact on the game. What that impact is and how it's decided, is very unpredictable, open to debate, and obviously very difficult to quantify and boil down to a statistic.
me2
Go ahead foot
I think that since it up. Dorsett ingratiates himself with his teammates and GM, gets a huge payday and had little to no effect on wins. At best it is a team building exercise.
These guys are paid to be meatheads, the moment they stop they are just really bad skill players.
If there is a "message" impact from this then Ferland will change the way he plays the game and Calgary will play a much nicer, softer game for the rest of the season when they play the Canucks. I'd bet against that. Perhaps the message sent from from Calgary was "Calgary laughs at our goon".
Hartley might also choose to play a smarter, more passive defensive game to counter the puck movement but I doubt he gives a crap fights when calculating that plan. I wouldn't be surprised if Hartley just winds them up more knowing Hartley. These guys brush this stuff aside.
Billy Kvcmu
Registered User
I remember hearing ppl saying that Canucks fans like to complain even when they are winning. In 2012 it was May Ray, now it's Prust and Sbisa.
Eddy Punch Clock
Jack Adams 2028
Guys don't sound the alarms or anything but we are in first place in the entire league! Few more wins and the presidents trophy is ours!
Yeah but we're only 2 points from last place.
WTG
December 5th
there are human hockey players on both sides that get a momentum swing. why would you assume our hockey punch player gets more than their hockey punch player?
this is backwards. its really easy to quantify, and quantification has come up with it meaning very little
You like players going 100 miles an hour and falling off the face of the earth??? There's skill and there's effectiveness...they aren't the same.
WTG
December 5th
Same...
I really don't get the hate. My favorite canucks growing up were Mitchel and Raymond.
2012 raymond was not the most effective player because of his injury but 2009-2011 raymond was extremely effective
Cupless44
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- Jun 25, 2014
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I agree with you. Bartkowski looked good to me with his skating and getting the puck up the ice quickly.
Cupless44
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Have to agree. Even with a good 5 to 1 road win some can't lay off the agenda.
We just heard an entire summer of nothing but Benning bashing, would be ice to enjoy the odd thing around here.
Speaking of a move that was mercilessly panned, Prust is doing more on the ice than the so called "good young player" he was traded for.
Pretty much unanimously everyone is pleased with last night. The only people pushing an agenda right now are those trying to justify benning moves.
It's irritating. Everyone has given credit where it was due. **** sakes this place.
It's irritating. Everyone has given credit where it was due. **** sakes this place.
Cupless44
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- Jun 25, 2014
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Kinda unfair to jump on the people hating the trade based on merely on ice performance.
They were, we all were, unaware he was in Stage 1 of NHL/NHLPA Substance Abuse and Behavioral Health Program while with Vancouver.
Impossible in retrospect to look at the trade as a bad one considering all the circumstances.
Edit:
Some knew but this isn't really a place you can discuss these issues.
Good reminder though that there is information that go on behind the scenes of running a hockey team that fans on posting boards don't have access to.
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