GDT: Canadiens @ Devils - 12 More To Go! - 7:00 PM - MSG+2

[Camille the Eel]

I mean yeah, but maybe the high event style we play + playing sub NHL goaltending leads to a goalie death spiral.

It does seem odd that we can't get anyone to play well for more then a couple games.

Yeah and we’ve been allowing a shit load of dangerous counterattack rushes. Partly that was playing from behind last night and exposing ourselves to it by having the D constantly going for broke with our forwards. But last night Montreal actually played our speed game better than we did.

On the other hand, for a bunch of shifts we may have played our best dump and cycle style of the year, Greer and Zetterlund contributing, but all our lines dabbling in it at times.

It’s shocking the change when you take Hughes out of our lineup. It shows just how much we’ve been relying on him.

 

[Buck Dancer]

Ya who wants a perennial vezina winning goalie … Some of you guys are insane. If not him , how about Sheshterkin ? Maybe the Rags trade their soon to be vezina maybe Hart winning MVP Allstar franchise player ? Or is he not good enough ? I don’t like the past 10 games he’s played , too risky , hard pass … Give me a break
Do t want Hellebuyck?! Lol . Ok name one goalie better turn him that would even remotely be available .

I don't see why the Jets would trade him in the first place when they have guys like Scheiffle, Connor, Ehlers, etc on their roster. They would go from bubble team to being in no man's land, which is the worst place to be for any team.

We look like we're slipping in the standings and teams behind and around us are winning their fair share of games. When all will be said and done, I think we'll be picking in the top #4. The lottery can screw us but if everything stays the same, I think we'll have a legit shot at one of Slafkovsky or Jiricek and that's who we should take.

There's not a #1 goaltender that will be made available this summer, so we should keep our assets, ride with Blackwood and sign/trade for another 1B option. Bernier is a massive wildcard here and if our new 1B is doing his job, we'll be able to move Bernier pretty easily to a team in need of a goaltender, since he's a pending UFA.

 

[Emperoreddy]

 

[Bleedred]

Hellebuyck isn’t having a great season, but he isn’t having a bad one either. Not by any means.

He leads the league in games played, minutes played, shots faced, shots saved, goals allowed (this is a symptom of playing all those minutes and facing all those shots).

I’d much rather him than any of the other names. He’s still elite. Gibson is a has-been, Binnington is pretty much a never-was and Samsonov is a never-will be.

 

[Buck Dancer]

Hellebuyck isn’t having a great season, but he isn’t having a bad one either. Not by any means.

He leads the league in games played, minutes played, shots faced, shots saved, goals allowed (this is a symptom of playing all those minutes and facing all those shots).

I’d much rather him than any of the other names. He’s still elite. Gibson is a has-been, Binnington is pretty much a never-was and Samsonov is a never-will be.

I don't want him for the simple reason it would cost us an arm and a leg plus we have Blackwood on the books for one more year. Adding a 29 year old to a team that is a couple of years away from making some legit noise wouldn't be the best idea because that would leave us with 2 to 4 years of quality starts, which isn't enough for what we'll be giving up to acquire him.

 

[Bleedred]

I don't want him for the simple reason it would cost us an arm and a leg plus we have Blackwood on the books for one more year. Adding a 29 year old to a team that is a couple of years away from making some legit noise wouldn't be the best idea because that would leave us with 2 to 4 years of quality starts, which isn't enough for what we'll be giving up to acquire him.

I'd totally trade him for a first round pick, Blackwood, and either a so-so prospect or a so-so roster player.

 

[Eggtimer]

I don't see why the Jets would trade him in the first place when they have guys like Scheiffle, Connor, Ehlers, etc on their roster. They would go from bubble team to being in no man's land, which is the worst place to be for any team.

We look like we're slipping in the standings and teams behind and around us are winning their fair share of games. When all will be said and done, I think we'll be picking in the top #4. The lottery can screw us but if everything stays the same, I think we'll have a legit shot at one of Slafkovsky or Jiricek and that's who we should take.

There's not a #1 goaltender that will be made available this summer, so we should keep our assets, ride with Blackwood and sign/trade for another 1B option. Bernier is a massive wildcard here and if our new 1B is doing his job, we'll be able to move Bernier pretty easily to a team in need of a goaltender, since he's a pending UFA.

I agree that Hellebuyck will probably not be available. Very very slim chance but there was talk that the Jets were looking at moving Schiefele.
If they do so , it might kick off a “re-tool” where they build around Dubois Connor Ehlers Perfetti Chibrikov Lucius Morrissey . You’d think that they keep their goalie still but…

 

[NjdevilfanJim]

Ya who wants a perennial vezina winning goalie … Some of you guys are insane. If not him , how about Sheshterkin ? Maybe the Rags trade their soon to be vezina maybe Hart winning MVP Allstar franchise player ? Or is he not good enough ? I don’t like the past 10 games he’s played , too risky , hard pass … Give me a break
Do t want Hellebuyck?! Lol . Ok name one goalie better turn him that would even remotely be available .

That there is the challenge for Fitz finding one that fits the team not to roll over and pay whatever someone wants for an older goalie who when we are ready to really contend could be falling apart....Not having the answer doesn't mean parting with assets just to part with assets for what could be a short term fix....

 

[Eggtimer]

I don't want him for the simple reason it would cost us an arm and a leg plus we have Blackwood on the books for one more year. Adding a 29 year old to a team that is a couple of years away from making some legit noise wouldn't be the best idea because that would leave us with 2 to 4 years of quality starts, which isn't enough for what we'll be giving up to acquire him.

Meh . I think we need to show we can be competitive as soon as possible. Solidify the position and go from there. If we flop once again next season due to crap goaltending… there is t going to be anyone in the stands anymore…
Wastes another year of the kids entry level deals and yet another failure of a season would be devastating for multiple reasons. If you can add a stud proven goalie like him, you do it. I highly doubt he is made available but Hellebuyck is one of about 5 goalies i would consider giving up our 1st for. The other guys are 100% for sure , without a doubt , never in a million years would be available off-season. Off the top of my head , the only guys I’d trade our first for : Sheshterkin Vashalevsky Demko with maybe Sorokin Markstrom Saros anddddd Jarry … last 4 guys I’m not sure on .Sorokin maybe in the first group . Honourable mentions but they are not proven enough for us - Knight Askarov Cossa and the kid Preds have( not sure the spelling )

 

[Eggtimer]

That there is the challenge for Fitz finding one that fits the team not to roll over and pay whatever someone wants for an older goalie who when we are ready to really contend could be falling apart....Not having the answer doesn't mean parting with assets just to part with assets for what could be a short term fix....

You can wait forever to try to find a top 5 goalie. it will never fit our timeline perfectly….. Just like signing Hamilton. It would have been better if we signed him next year or year after to better fit our timeline , and I wish he was say 24 years old lol….But I’d that were the case , he would never hit UFA amd or woild be snatched up immediately and rightfully so. If Hellebuyck was available , you do what you reasonably can to get him.

 

[Bleedred]

Is this too much? Or a lowball?

Our first round pick + Blackwood (or one of Daws/Schmid), + Foote + McLeod for Hellebuyck?

I think Winnipeg would say that's a lowball, but I'm sure some of our fans would say that's too much, especially those who think McLeod isn't what he is yet.

If we got Hellebuyck, Blackwood would almost definitely be gone after this year, if he doesn't go in the trade to begin with. If not Foote particularly then someone else in a similar situation and possibly on D and not forward.

Foote (or a comparable) and McLeod are just throw-ins. A player like McLeod and his three different 22+ game goalless streaks is pretty replaceable. Maybe our first round pick (Since it will be another low one, probably a top-5 barring disaster lottery result) causes us to have to give up less to get Hellebuyck.

They'd wanna take a goalie back if they sent us Hellebuyck and as we've seen this year, neither Daws nor Schmid are of any use to them next year in goal for the NHL team.

 

[Eggtimer]

Is this too much? Or a lowball?

Our first round pick + Blackwood (or one of Daws/Schmid), + Foote + McLeod for Hellebuyck?

I think Winnipeg would say that's a lowball, but I'm sure some of our fans would say that's too much, especially those who think McLeod isn't what he is yet.

If we got Hellebuyck, Blackwood would almost definitely be gone after this year, if he doesn't go in the trade to begin with. If not Foote particularly then someone else in a similar situation and possibly on D and not forward.

Foote (or a comparable) and McLeod are just throw-ins. A player like McLeod and his three different 22+ game goalless streaks is pretty replaceable. Maybe our first round pick (Since it will be another low one, probably a top-5 barring disaster lottery result) causes us to have to give up less to get Hellebuyck.

They'd wanna take a goalie back if they sent us Hellebuyck and as we've seen this year, neither Daws nor Schmid are of any use to them next year in goal for the NHL team.

I would think its somewhat close? It would be our 1st and someone that would suck to lose . Shakir maybe.If it’s a Mercer or Holtz type ask, I would have to pass. Gritsyuk …. I’d have to sleep on it Lol.
1st
Blackwood
???
For
Helle
Cap dump to hopefully lower the cost ot acquire Helle

 

[NjdevilfanJim]

I would think its somewhat close? It would be our 1st and someone that would suck to lose . Shakir maybe.If it’s a Mercer or Holtz type ask, I would have to pass. Gritsyuk …. I’d have to sleep on it Lol.
1st
Blackwood
???
For
Helle
Cap dump to hopefully lower the cost ot acquire Helle

LOL a blue chip cost controlled player and possibly a goalie who gets healthy and turns into a decent player and then we get Helle only to see him go down hill like Corey....No thanks stay patient finish rebuild the right way....

 

[Bleedred]

LOL a blue chip cost controlled player and possibly a goalie who gets healthy and turns into a decent player and then we get Helle only to see him go down hill like Corey....No thanks stay patient finish rebuild the right way....

If Blackwood doesn't play well next year, he almost definitely won't be here in 2023-2024 because he'll be a (restricted) free agent. He won't be worth his qualifying offer at that point if he doesn't improve next year. How do you even bring him back at that point? And what is he seriously worth on a new contract at that point if he plays anywhere near the last two years? Certainly not a raise and not even what he's getting on this current deal.

If they traded Hellebuyck, they would more than likely want a goalie back, but Vancouver didn't get a goalie back from us in the Schneider trade. Not even an AHL goalie.

 

[Buck Dancer]

Is this too much? Or a lowball?

Our first round pick + Blackwood (or one of Daws/Schmid), + Foote + McLeod for Hellebuyck?

I think Winnipeg would say that's a lowball, but I'm sure some of our fans would say that's too much, especially those who think McLeod isn't what he is yet.

If we got Hellebuyck, Blackwood would almost definitely be gone after this year, if he doesn't go in the trade to begin with. If not Foote particularly then someone else in a similar situation and possibly on D and not forward.

Foote (or a comparable) and McLeod are just throw-ins. A player like McLeod and his three different 22+ game goalless streaks is pretty replaceable. Maybe our first round pick (Since it will be another low one, probably a top-5 barring disaster lottery result) causes us to have to give up less to get Hellebuyck.

They'd wanna take a goalie back if they sent us Hellebuyck and as we've seen this year, neither Daws nor Schmid are of any use to them next year in goal for the NHL team.

I’m sorry but that’s an insane return right there. We’re talking about a top #5 pick, a very good goaltender, a 4th line center and a prospect for Hellebuyck? The guy is good but he’s not worth a top #5 pick++ better than Blackwood.

I just think his crap year has created this false narrative that he’s a below average goalie. We were all praising the guy less than 2 years ago and now we’re ready to give away a king’s ransom for Hellebuyck? For Demko, it’s something I’d consider but for Hellebuyck, it’s a hard pass for me.

I’ll take the cost controlled blue chip prospect, McLeod, Foote and keep Blackwood over the scenario that is proposed here.

 

[Bleedred]

I’m sorry but that’s an insane return right there. We’re talking about a top #5 pick, a very good goaltender, a 4th line center and a prospect for Hellebuyck? The guy is good but he’s not worth a top #5 pick++ better than Blackwood.

I just think his crap year has created this false narrative that he’s a below average goalie. We were all praising the guy less than 2 years ago and now we’re ready to give away a king’s ransom for Hellebuyck? For Demko, it’s something I’d consider but for Hellebuyck, it’s a hard pass for me.

I’ll take the cost controlled blue chip prospect, McLeod, Foote and keep Blackwood over the scenario that is proposed here.

I bet Winnipeg fans would think that was awful.

By the way, Blackwood has had TWO crap years in a row. Not just this year. And yes, two crap years in a row is cause to believe that he might not be that good. Remember Cory Schneider and how many years he was supposedly bouncing back?

There’s no indications that Blackwood is a “Very good goaltender” after his last two years. He’s merely a question mark at this point.

Foote and McLeod are really nothing special. The top-5 pick is really where the value comes in for Winnipeg. I’d just as soon keep Blackwood than send him back in that trade, but I’d assume Winnipeg wants a goalie back in that deal and I don’t think they’d want Bernier, who’s an even larger question mark coming off hip surgery at age 34. And I really don’t think they’d be interested in Daws or Schmid, as neither are anywhere close to NHL ready, as evidenced by this season.

 

[glenwo2]

I was not being serious, glen

Well I have to admit that considering your words carry more weight than Bob, I took them a bit more seriously.

 

[NjdevilfanJim]

If Blackwood doesn't play well next year, he almost definitely won't be here in 2023-2024 because he'll be a (restricted) free agent. He won't be worth his qualifying offer at that point if he doesn't improve next year. How do you even bring him back at that point? And what is he seriously worth on a new contract at that point if he plays anywhere near the last two years? Certainly not a raise and not even what he's getting on this current deal.

If they traded Hellebuyck, they would more than likely want a goalie back, but Vancouver didn't get a goalie back from us in the Schneider trade. Not even an AHL goalie.

You don't trade a potential top 5 pick for a 29 year old goalie...

 

[Buck Dancer]

I bet Winnipeg fans would think that was awful.

By the way, Blackwood has had TWO crap years in a row. Not just this year. And yes, two crap years in a row is cause to believe that he might not be that good. Remember Cory Schneider and how many years he was supposedly bouncing back?

There’s no indications that Blackwood is a “Very good goaltender” after his last two years. He’s merely a question mark at this point.

Foote and McLeod are really nothing special. The top-5 pick is really where the value comes in for Winnipeg. I’d just as soon keep Blackwood than send him back in that trade, but I’d assume Winnipeg wants a goalie back in that deal and I don’t think they’d want Bernier, who’s an even larger question mark coming off hip surgery at age 34. And I really don’t think they’d be interested in Daws or Schmid, as neither are anywhere close to NHL ready, as evidenced by this season.

The pick alone makes it’s enough for me to pass on a 29 year old goalie. Add Blackwood and the rest and it just makes it even worse.

As for Blackwood, the amount of rope you’re giving him is crazy. He was crap in a season that was like no other, got COVID, was playing for a team that didn’t have Jack or Bratt play to the level they’ve been playing this year, Hischier was out half the year, etc. As for this year, he had the vaccine issue on top of playing injured for possibly half his games and still managed to keep a .500 record.

We are being way too negative when it comes to Blackwood for reasons I can’t seem to really understand. Mackenzie doesn’t need to be a Vezina type goalie for us to move in the proper direction, he just needs to be good and our team will feed off of that. It’s depressing AF when you’re busting your tail only to have your goalie give up stinkers night after night. It deflates all the positive energy everyone has been building and it’s the main reason why we suck. I have the upmost faith in Blackwood next year for the soul reason that he’ll be playing for his next deal and if it’s with us or not, he’ll want to post up solid #’s in order to get paid. Money is the key motivator in this equation and I doubt he’ll let that opportunity slip.