Canada or the USA U18?

[Seachd]

USA, for once, has all the advantages. You can never rule Canada out, but USA should be the favorite in this one. Kessel has been by far the best player in the tournament, but even if Canada focuses on him, Skille, Mueller and Stoa are all more than capable as well. Frazee has outplayed Price as well, and will need to do so again.

I wouldn't say they have all the advantages. I like Canada's defense and hard work better, and I'm not convinced Frazee will be any better than Price. The US does have the better overall skill level, and Canada's going to have to be careful of that.

Should be a very good game. Hopefully they're allowed to play, and I'm really looking forward to it.

 

[PuckFan01]

And..by the way...your analysis, while tinged with bias, was decent...until the part...

Actually, he lost me when he said Kessel's offense is one dimensional. A ridiculous statement.

If his offense is one dimensional, that is one hell of a dimension. Especially considering how effective he is.

 

[Macman]

If Canada is able to contain Kessel and limit him to no more than one goal, they will win. I'm amazed at how well Canada has gelled. They looked after their first two games like one of those team that just didn't have the chemistry and would never find it, but they've surprised me. Today's game should be a classic.

An interesting footnote. If Canada wins, they will hold every men's hockey title there is -- Olympics, World Cup, world championship, under 20 worlds, under 18 worlds, under 18 World Cup and the under 17 worlds. Win or lose today, it's an amazing achievement and one that may never be repeated. Bob Nicholson and everyone at Hockey Canada should take a bow.

 

[Macman]

Bourdon, while a decent offensive d-man, isn't nearly as well rounded, and some feel could fall past the middle of the first round in a draft that's weak outside the top ten.

I'd be shocked if that happened after this tournament. Bourdon has been a revelation. He has been outstanding and I would expect his stock to rise considerably.

 

[markov`]

USA is the clear-cut favorite for this one. Not only they are better than Canada individually (I don't find any Kessels or Johnsons in Canada roster), they are also a better team, having played in the same team all year long. If Canada wins this one, it's going to be very surprising.

 

[markov`]

until the part where you suggested that Luc Bourdon is somehow in the same stratosphere as Jack Johnson...

You probably haven't seen Bourdon play in this tournament, he's playing like a madman. He's not that far from Johnson.

BUT, Canada does not have one forward that can match up with Kessel skills.

 

[VOB]

Unfortunately, the American's defense..and team overall...is light years better than the Czechs.

And..by the way...your analysis, while tinged with bias, was decent...until the part where you suggested that Luc Bourdon is somehow in the same stratosphere as Jack Johnson...

Correct me if I am wrong but was not the score between the U.S and Czech Republic 4-3?

That certainly shows that the U.S. is not light years ahead of that team!

I am expecting big things from Kessel but having seen Kessel play, I have to agree with CdnHky's assessment. Canada will not give him much ice and will do everything to shut down his forte, the transitional game. Kessel will have to step un on the playmaking department and make his linemates truely better.

I also expect a big game from Mueller, who unlike Kessel, has the strength to cycle the puck down low and create scoring chances.

I think that the American D will be able to handle Canada forecheck but as CdnHky has stated, that remains to be seen as they have not been tested against a strong skating physical team.

In the end though, team USA's cohesiveness will give them the decided edge and a hard fought 5-3 victory.

 

[eaton28]

the USA does have the skill, but can they take canada's extermly physical play?

 

[bossy22]

Who does Camp match up against Kessel? Is there a player on CAN who can match his speed and shadow him the whole game. The Clune, Clutterbuck, Bass line is the grinding line and Pyatt is a grinder as well but maybe someone like Bertram will be assigned to closely check Kessel for this one game.

 

[ALF AmericanLionsFan]

4-2 USA!

 

[bhar]

It was a pretty good game for the most part. I think Canada outworked the USA for most of the game, but the American's skill and powerplay were too much in the end. Frazzy was awsome, kind of reminds me of a young Mike Richter.
Also one other thing, the Americans' shot blocking was incredible; The Canadians would have made this much closer if not for the US's ability to collapse down low and block 40% of the shots coming in.

 

[HabLover]

Unfortunately, the American's defense..and team overall...is light years better than the Czechs.

And..by the way...your analysis, while tinged with bias, was decent...until the part where you suggested that Luc Bourdon is somehow in the same stratosphere as Jack Johnson...

Please explain what Jack Johnson has done in this tourney that cements his #2 ranking by some people? I tend to agree more now with the CSB rankings.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Please explain what Jack Johnson has done in this tourney that cements his #2 ranking by some people? I tend to agree more now with the CSB rankings.

1) He was a dominant presence in his own end. Yeah, he didn't put up a ton of points, but that wasn't what the U.S. coaching staff expected of him. They wanted strong, physical play in the defensive zone, along with good outlet passing, and Johnson delivered, both at 5 on 5 and on the special teams. He was also +7 which led all defenseman.

2) Jack Johnson has been a dominant presence all year. Even if he was average at the U18s (which he wasn't), that wasn't going to take away from his overall play throughout the year.

3) You can side with CSB all you want, but EVERY other major ranking service has Johnson as the number one ranked defender, and in many cases the number two ranked player right behind Crosby.

 

[HabLover]

Unfortunately, the American's defense..and team overall...is light years better than the Czechs.

And..by the way...your analysis, while tinged with bias, was decent...until the part where you suggested that Luc Bourdon is somehow in the same stratosphere as Jack Johnson...

and who won best D-man at the tourney??? I don't think it was JJ!

 

[Rabid Ranger]

and who won best D-man at the tourney??? I don't think it was JJ!

When Ondřej Pavelec is named top goaltender over Jeff Frazee, I take the tournament All-Star team with a grain of salt. Whatever makes you feel better though.

 

[nomorekids]

When Ondřej Pavelec is named top goaltender over Jeff Frazee, I take the tournament All-Star team with a grain of salt. Whatever makes you feel better though.

you'd do better trying to reason with a bowl of oatmeal.

but whatever makes him feel better. he DID once guarantee that Bourdon would be selected before Johnson in a hyperactive fit of Canadian jingoism.

 

[monster_bertuzzi]

3) You can side with CSB all you want, but EVERY other major ranking service has Johnson as the number one ranked defender, and in many cases the number two ranked player right behind Crosby.

Thats news to me....

CCB has Johnson #5 (Pouliot behind Crosby)

Redline has Johnson #5 (Brule #2)

Prospects magazine has Johnson #3 (Brule #2)

ISS has Johnson #3 (Pouliot)

 

[Le Golie]

You can side with CSB all you want, but EVERY other major ranking service has Johnson as the number one ranked defender, and in many cases the number two ranked player right behind Crosby.

To be fair to Johnson, nobody is 'right behind' Crosby.

In my observation, Johnson was very solid but not spectacular. He doesn't control his entire defensive zone like Phanuef does. I can't see his stock rising after this tournament. It won't fall, but it won't rise.

Bourdon on the other hand will see his stock rise al lot. He was playing on the same level as Johnson all week.

Taking into account the perceptions I had of these two players before the tournament - Bourdon impressed me and Johnson didn't really, but their play and impact was comparable.

 

[HabLover]

1) He was a dominant presence in his own end. Yeah, he didn't put up a ton of points, but that wasn't what the U.S. coaching staff expected of him. They wanted strong, physical play in the defensive zone, along with good outlet passing, and Johnson delivered, both at 5 on 5 and on the special teams. He was also +7 which led all defenseman.

OMG.....JJ was a +7!

Hell, Zack Jones was a +6, not even on for a even strength goal against, I guess he's probably #3 now behind Crosby and JJ!

and I guess Bourdon's +5 is a stratosphere apart from JJ's +7?

 

[Le Golie]

OMG.....JJ was a +7!

Hell, Zack Jones was a +6, not even on for a even strength goal against, I guess he's probably #3 now behind Crosby and JJ!

and I guess Bourdon's +5 is a stratosphere apart from JJ's +7?

To be fair, RR didn't make the ridiculous 'stratosphere' comment.

 

[Chris]

Canada... they are a superpower...

Now that's something you don't hear every day!

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Thats news to me....

CCB has Johnson #5 (Pouliot behind Crosby)

Redline has Johnson #5 (Brule #2)

Prospects magazine has Johnson #3 (Brule #2)

ISS has Johnson #3 (Pouliot)

You're right, but Johnson is the almost universal number one ranked defenseman.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

OMG.....JJ was a +7!

Hell, Zack Jones was a +6, not even on for a even strength goal against, I guess he's probably #3 now behind Crosby and JJ!

and I guess Bourdon's +5 is a stratosphere apart from JJ's +7?

Why do you have to act like such a child? Bourdon had one point and was +5. Jack Johnson had two points and was +7. For a stats whore like yourself you would think the writing would be on the wall, but no, not for a fanboy like yourself.

 

[HabLover]

You're right, but Johnson is the almost universal number one ranked defenseman.

Of course Monster Bertuzzi is right, but until someone lays it out for you, JJ to you is #2 in everyone's eyes, but I think this tourney proved otherwise. He may have been solid in some respects, but he clearly didn't dominate to the point he has been hyped by you and NMK, etc.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Of course Monster Bertuzzi is right, but until someone lays it out for you, JJ to you is #2 in everyone's eyes, but I think this tourney proved otherwise. He may have been solid in some respects, but he clearly didn't dominate to the point he has been hyped by you and NMK, etc.

What level of "domination" were you expecting? He was the best defenseman on the best team in the tournament. The fact remains that he is the top ranked defenseman by virtually every major scouting service, and nothing you say can prove otherwise. As for monster bertuzzi, he's the biggest Gilbert Brule fanboy on these boards, so I'm not surprised he'll come to the aid of his hero.