Proposal: Calgary Flames Re-tool

[Double Dion]

I mean I don’t think he had the offensive production this season to warrant much more, including a 25 game goalless streak to start the season. I love the guy and desperately want him at 2C but don’t think teams will be lining up to pay much over 5.5. Maybe you find a team (Seattle, Minny maybe) that offers 6 but that’s as high as he’ll get, so I don’t think 5.5 given this economy is far off

Which of Backlund or Lindholm is he playing ahead of? Danault isn't a 2C. He's never scored 15 goals. He's a shutdown center. He barely produces at a 3C level. Heck our 4C has scored 15 goals.

 

[Mersss]

Because 5.5M in Calgary is 5.5% more than it is in Montreal? Also, he saw that there was not a lot of money handed out to non-elite players last offseason. That said, I wouldn't pay more than Backlund for Danault. He'd need to be under 5 for me. He's never scored 15 goals in the league and while he's good defensively, so are Backlund, Lindholm and to a lesser extent Ryan.

Danault is Selke level defensively speaking.

None of the player you've mentionned above is.

 

[Double Dion]

Danault is Selke level defensively speaking.

None of the player you've mentionned above is.

Backlund and Lindholm certainly are. Backlund has been a Selke finalist and has led the league in several defensive metrics multiple times. He's never won a Selke for the same reason Danault hasn't. He doesn't score 60 points or more. The last player to win the Selke with less than that was Draper 17 years ago.

 

[RasmusAndersson]

Which of Backlund or Lindholm is he playing ahead of? Danault isn't a 2C. He's never scored 15 goals. He's a shutdown center. He barely produces at a 3C level. Heck our 4C has scored 15 goals.

Well it would be a 2A/2B situation with Backlund and future Backlund replacement given Backlund's age. But also using just goals to evaluate all-around players is also very flawed, especially for a team with high-skilled and one-dimensional offensive wingers who would do well with a more defensively-focused 2C, just as Chucky and Mang and Lucic and now Nordstrom do their best w Backlund

 

[Double Dion]

Well it would be a 2A/2B situation with Backlund and future Backlund replacement given Backlund's age. But also using just goals to evaluate all-around players is also very flawed, especially for a team with high-skilled and one-dimensional offensive wingers who would do well with a more defensively-focused 2C, just as Chucky and Mang and Lucic and now Nordstrom do their best w Backlund

You think I'd pay 5M for 10-13 goals if more than goals didn't matter? He's a 1.5M dollar player offensively. I'm already paying 3.5M for his defense.

I get your premise, I think you need matchup centers when you don't have an elite guy. I just think we have 2 of them already. We had Brett Ritchie riding shotgun with Gaudreau. We have Jusso Valimaki costing us a goal every game. These are our bigger issues.

 

[RasmusAndersson]

You think I'd pay 5M for 10-13 goals if more than goals didn't matter? He's a 1.5M dollar player offensively. I'm already paying 3.5M for his defense.

I get your premise, I think you need matchup centers when you don't have an elite guy. I just think we have 2 of them already. We had Brett Ritchie riding shotgun with Gaudreau. We have Jusso Valimaki costing us a goal every game. These are our bigger issues.

Fair, we definitely need help on RW more than anything. Just think we'll need a middle-6 C replacement as well if we move Monahan for that RW or RW prospect+cap space. And for Juuso to stop with the ridiculous turnovers but that will just take time (which unfortunately we don't have lol). Coleman and Schwartz and maybe Saad I would love but are all LH natural LW's. Palmieri a bit too old for my liking. I'm down for any of Coleman Schwartz or Danault tho, but if we can get a prospect like a Kaliyev that is more one-dimensional offense RW I like the idea of 3 great two-way C's instead of just 2

 

[TFHockey]

Shouldn't Calgary look at a team like Carolina who could use an improvement at center?

 

[Double Dion]

Fair, we definitely need help on RW more than anything. Just think we'll need a middle-6 C replacement as well if we move Monahan for that RW or RW prospect+cap space. And for Juuso to stop with the ridiculous turnovers but that will just take time (which unfortunately we don't have lol). Coleman and Schwartz and maybe Saad I would love but are all LH natural LW's. Palmieri a bit too old for my liking. I'm down for any of Coleman Schwartz or Danault tho, but if we can get a prospect like a Kaliyev that is more one-dimensional offense RW I like the idea of 3 great two-way C's instead of just 2

You're not wrong with the idea of 3 2 way centers. I'm just thinking you can probably re-sign Derek Ryan for 1.5 and I think Danault gets 4.5M minimum. If you really break down the numbers their performance per minute isn't that different. It leaves you more cap to upgrade those winger spots. You're correct that with the exception of Palmieri the other wingers I mentioned are natural LWs, but all have played on the right side at points. Coleman has actually almost exclusively played RW. I do like your Monahan trade, although I know we will be in the minority. I just don't want to tie up 5.5M in a 3C and hamstring our cap for a guy who isn't a huge upgrade on a guy we could get for 1.5.

 

[Double Dion]

Shouldn't Calgary look at a team like Carolina who could use an improvement at center?

I'd love to yes, but I wonder if they are interested in taking on 6M in cap? Unless Dougie goes somewhere else they don't have the space.

 

[RasmusAndersson]

You're not wrong with the idea of 3 2 way centers. I'm just thinking you can probably re-sign Derek Ryan for 1.5 and I think Danault gets 4.5M minimum. If you really break down the numbers their performance per minute isn't that different. It leaves you more cap to upgrade those winger spots. You're correct that with the exception of Palmieri the other wingers I mentioned are natural LWs, but all have played on the right side at points. Coleman has actually almost exclusively played RW. I do like your Monahan trade, although I know we will be in the minority. I just don't want to tie up 5.5M in a 3C and hamstring our cap for a guy who isn't a huge upgrade on a guy we could get for 1.5.

Super fair. I want Coleman or Schwartz soooo badly. Coleman specifically would do absolute wonders for our top-6 5v5 while Schwartz would help us generate way more chances, which is by far our biggest need

 

[EquivalentStay]

Danault is Selke level defensively speaking.

None of the player you've mentionned above is.

Imagine saying Danault is Selke level and the others arent, when one has actually finished 4th for the trophy smh

 

[EK392000]

Laine might be the most overrated player in the league. He doesn't help you win at all.

It’s such a shame too. All the talent in the world but just doesn’t have the work ethic to refine his craft and put all the pieces together.

 

[Double Dion]

It’s such a shame too. All the talent in the world but just doesn’t have the work ethic to refine his craft and put all the pieces together.

That's it exactly. He has the size, the shot, the hands, moves well. Just a very immature person. He's actually more talented than Matthews IMO. He should be Ovechkin, but he's basically a better Hoffman.

 

[Double Dion]

Super fair. I want Coleman or Schwartz soooo badly. Coleman specifically would do absolute wonders for our top-6 5v5 while Schwartz would help us generate way more chances, which is by far our biggest need

Coleman would be a real nice fit in a Sutter system too I think. I love Schwartz, just the injuries concern me. Plus, he might like it out here being a flatlander.

 

[RasmusAndersson]

Coleman would be a real nice fit in a Sutter system too I think. I love Schwartz, just the injuries concern me. Plus, he might like it out here being a flatlander.

I’m just thinking I would want one of those players (preferably Coleman) and a legit 2/3C like Danault cause we have more scoring wingers to play him with. he’s been unreal Gallagher and Tatar as they’ve put up 50-60 point seasons w second line minutes.

Gaudreau-Lindholm-Coleman
Tkachuk-Backlund-Mang
Dube-Danault-Kaliyev/Phillips/UFA
Ritchie/Lucic-Ryan-Leivo

Rasmus-Hanifin
Gio-Tanev
Valimaki-Stone/xxxxx

Depending if Coleman would take less than 5 mil

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Shouldn't Calgary look at a team like Carolina who could use an improvement at center?

Canes 2C has 37 points this year. Dont think thats the team that wpuld be looking for Monahan. I would say teams that may want a top 6 center upgrade are Vegas, NYR, or Columbus. Used to have Florida there but they took a swing with Bennett

 

[blankall]

Not sure about the Monahan trade. Think the Flames would be much better off just targeting a RW instead of splitting up Monahan's value. Maatta does nothing for the Flames.

I do like the idea of acquiring Danault though. Lindholm-Danault-Backlund is very solid centre depth. If the Flames can add Danault and a legit RW to their top 6, things start to look a lot different for them IMO.

And no, I don't see a total blow it up going on. When you have players like Lindholm, Tkachuk, Andersson, Hanifin, Valimaki, Markstrom, etc...you don't blow it up.

 

[the Chad Kilger]

retool and remain mediocre

 

[Double Dion]

retool and remain mediocre

It's a tough call. St. Louis was in a very similar position to Calgary before they won the cup. All it took was one good trade. I lean toward a full re-build like you, but see the merits of the other side of it. We do have an elite coach for the first time since he coached us the last time.