C Quinton Byfield (2020, 2nd, LAK) part III

[Raccoon Jesus]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: I still maintain that if Lafreniere were not in this draft class people would be singing a different tune about Byfield, they'd be falling all over themselves fawning about him at #1 instead of trying to poke every hole in his game. The guy can't even tie his skates in the right order at this point.

It would still end up being a Hall/Seguin thing with him and Stutzle here down the stretch but instead of talking about Laf as the best thing since sliced bread and Byfield and Stutzle as completely flawed wildcards they'd be fawning all over these dudes.

 

[AustonMarner]

I was replying to others who had made the discussion about that and was trying to put an end to it. Why did you have to necro-reply two weeks later bring that subject back up?

Didn't realize it was two weeks old.. lol
Not sure why people mentioned it at all.. that's why i said something, cheers

 

[Rorschach]

Absolutely. One thing I noticed in my last play through of the tapes I have on Stutzle was that over a 9 game stretch I watched, he only went to the net when he had the puck. He would pick a backdoor on a d (often from the corner) and skate the puck to the net off a gap. Pretty much goalies went unchallenged with him on the ice, he has no net front presence I've seen.

As a winger at the NHL level, that's okay. As a centre, won't work.

Stutzle might be close to being NHL ready but he's still a ways off being NHL centre ready. I'd go as far as arguing that Byfield is closer to being NHL centre ready than Stutzle

You may be right. But, I feel that Byfield will spend another year in juniors, then the year after in the AHL. And I don't think that's an uncommon estimation, including the Byfield fans in this thread. Stutzle on the other hand, due to his skillset and experience playing against men along with his performances in best-of tournaments, can play next year in the NHL.

Let's say he is used mostly as a winger on the Kings. He gets to play in the NHL with other NHL centers of the Kings, whether it's the Kings best in Kopitar or another kid like Vilardi or Turcotte. He gets to work with NHL coaches. He may even get some center play garbage time on the bottom six lines.

Even if he goes to the AHL instead of the NHL, he'll be available for a cup of tea at the NHL level.

So the question really to me is this, do you feel the Kings want to win now or win later? (Our own personal opinions don't matter since we don't make the decisions.) I believe Anschutz, Blake, Robitaille, Doughty, Kopitar, Brown and Quick/Carter want to pull out of the rebuild and start winning now. We have enough prospects and our two 10-million dollar guys have maybe 2 to 3 years left of prime playing time together. Vilardi has already arrived so winning, which is counterproductive to rebuilding through the draft, may be something that is already forgone.

I know a lot of people in this thread may not want to hear this since it dashes their dreams of a six year rebuild-hoarding of prospects, but that's what it looks like to me on the NHL level.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

You may be right. But, I feel that Byfield will spend another year in juniors, then the year after in the AHL. And I don't think that's an uncommon estimation, including the Byfield fans in this thread. Stutzle on the other hand, due to his skillset and experience playing against men along with his performances in best-of tournaments, can play next year in the NHL.

Let's say he is used mostly as a winger on the Kings. He gets to play in the NHL with other NHL centers of the Kings, whether it's the Kings best in Kopitar or another kid like Vilardi or Turcotte. He gets to work with NHL coaches. He may even get some center play garbage time on the bottom six lines.

Even if he goes to the AHL instead of the NHL, he'll be available for a cup of tea at the NHL level.

So the question really to me is this, do you feel the Kings want to win now or win later? (Our own personal opinions don't matter since we don't make the decisions.) I believe Anschutz, Blake, Robitaille, Doughty, Kopitar, Brown and Quick/Carter want to pull out of the rebuild and start winning now. We have enough prospects and our two 10-million dollar guys have maybe 2 to 3 years left of prime playing time together. Vilardi has already arrived so winning, which is counterproductive to rebuilding through the draft, may be something that is already forgone.

I know a lot of people in this thread may not want to hear this since it dashes their dreams of a six year rebuild-hoarding of prospects, but that's what it looks like to me on the NHL level.

Can you name the last 2nd overall pick who spent an entire season in the AHL?

If the Kings want to win now, don't you think they can maybe sign some players and trade for players who can help now rather than rely on an 18-year-old rookie who may produce like Jack Hughes or Kaapo Kakko? Did those guys help their respective clubs win now?

And to correct you about Byfield jumping to the AHL after one more year in the OHL (which is highly unlikely to happen). Byfield will still be 19 after his third season in the OHL. He won't be permitted to play in the AHL until he's 20.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

You may be right. But, I feel that Byfield will spend another year in juniors, then the year after in the AHL. And I don't think that's an uncommon estimation, including the Byfield fans in this thread. Stutzle on the other hand, due to his skillset and experience playing against men along with his performances in best-of tournaments, can play next year in the NHL.

Let's say he is used mostly as a winger on the Kings. He gets to play in the NHL with other NHL centers of the Kings, whether it's the Kings best in Kopitar or another kid like Vilardi or Turcotte. He gets to work with NHL coaches. He may even get some center play garbage time on the bottom six lines.

Even if he goes to the AHL instead of the NHL, he'll be available for a cup of tea at the NHL level.

So the question really to me is this, do you feel the Kings want to win now or win later? (Our own personal opinions don't matter since we don't make the decisions.) I believe Anschutz, Blake, Robitaille, Doughty, Kopitar, Brown and Quick/Carter want to pull out of the rebuild and start winning now. We have enough prospects and our two 10-million dollar guys have maybe 2 to 3 years left of prime playing time together. Vilardi has already arrived so winning, which is counterproductive to rebuilding through the draft, may be something that is already forgone.

I know a lot of people in this thread may not want to hear this since it dashes their dreams of a six year rebuild-hoarding of prospects, but that's what it looks like to me on the NHL level.

I think the next 18 years of our #2 pick's career matter a lot more than the next 2 no matter what the NHL roster looks like.

It's not about dashing dreams vs. hoarding prospects, it's about smart drafting. You're actually making a case for picking Rossi instead and it's a desperation play. We've seen people draft for need rather than BPA and how it often goes wrong--you're literally advocating for drafting for 600 days and nothing else matters. That's not a strong case.

If you desperately need to win now, sign a UFA. Taylor Hall is available. Alex Pietrangelo is available. I don't want either, but I'd rather blow money on them than self-sabotage my draft and subsequent decades over a short-sighted strategy that's agenda-crafted so you can pick your dude.

But in the end I don't think it's so much that Byfield can't play in the NHL immediately. It's is he best served doing so? And that "drafting for NHL immediacy" isn't a strong strategy.

 

[nergish]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: I still maintain that if Lafreniere were not in this draft class people would be singing a different tune about Byfield, they'd be falling all over themselves fawning about him at #1 instead of trying to poke every hole in his game. The guy can't even tie his skates in the right order at this point.

It would still end up being a Hall/Seguin thing with him and Stutzle here down the stretch but instead of talking about Laf as the best thing since sliced bread and Byfield and Stutzle as completely flawed wildcards they'd be fawning all over these dudes.

Definitely agreed.
Laffy just seems to have this magical element to his game... it harkens back to the French-Canadian legends of yesteryear. People like to imagine his career playing out like a children's book, Canadian folklore stuff.
I think he is that good. But we shall see.

Byfield is just a can't-miss prospect. People will be scratching their head when he's cracking 80 points in the NHL, when they really shouldn't be.
I don't know if he's the next Evgeni Malkin, but he's a great young player that will be a great NHLer one day.

 

[Just Linda]

Can you name the last 2nd overall pick who spent an entire season in the AHL?

If the Kings want to win now, don't you think they can maybe sign some players and trade for players who can help now rather than rely on an 18-year-old rookie who may produce like Jack Hughes or Kaapo Kakko? Did those guys help their respective clubs win now?

And to correct you about Byfield jumping to the AHL after one more year in the OHL (which is highly unlikely to happen). Byfield will still be 19 after his third season in the OHL. He won't be permitted to play in the AHL until he's 20.

Bobby Ryan kinda counts. If not, it's Eric Staal

 

[Rorschach]

Can you name the last 2nd overall pick who spent an entire season in the AHL?

If the Kings want to win now, don't you think they can maybe sign some players and trade for players who can help now rather than rely on an 18-year-oldI rookie who may produce like Jack Hughes or Kaapo Kakko? Did those guys help their respective clubs win now?

And to correct you about Byfield jumping to the AHL after one more year in the OHL (which is highly unlikely to happen). Byfield will still be 19 after his third season in the OHL. He won't be permitted to play in the AHL until he's 20.

This is kind of circular logic to me. I don't feel Byfield is a 2nd overall choice (in this draft) and I do with Stutzle but then the question is weird since I just said I think he's almost NHL-ready. I'm one of the guys who has Byfield outside of the top 3/4. (My most NHL-ready guys are Lafreniere, Stutzle and Rossi...not necessarily in that order.) So if you use your own question but see it from my perspective, it makes sense why I think he'll play in the AHL (or in this case, another pro-league above the CHL but below the NHL), very likely and thus is not a top 3 pick in this draft. As for Hughes and Kakko, you know as well as I do that these two last year were the exception. Even Yakupov put up points his D+1 NHL rookie season (31 in 48gp). Hischier put up 52 points his D+1 in NJ, and I consider Stutzle as even better. Previous year was Matthews (69p) and Laine (64p), year before was McDavid (doesn't count) and Eichel (56p), etc. It doesn't happen every year but it happens a lot that a top 2 pick in a year where there are franchise players at the top of the draft, the forward-position players not only play in the NHL right away but they can contribute, scoring-wise. But again, that's assuming you draft the NHL-ready star forward in the top 2.

And by the way, draft position doesn't determine anything. It's case by case per player. Defensemen and goalies usually take longer (the exception being Doughty). Centers often take longer than wingers. Stutzle coming in as a winger who has extensive experience at center is maybe the best of both worlds.

Regarding "winning now", they can do both...they may have to do both, both with cap and revenue crunches. When you get such an asset as a 2OA in a deep draft at the top, it's normal to expect an asset who may help immediately. You can expect the Rangers will expect Lafreniere to play in the NHL immediately. If Stutzle plays, he will add scoring...that's pretty much what the Kings need the most. And any experience he gains next year will help him the next, next year. And I don't expect the Kings to be able to add any significant scoring without either A) sacrificing a big chunk of our precious prospects, and/or B) sacrificing a big chunk of our precious cap space for years to come. I think the plan in LA is to sign someone experienced to play defense on the left side and to let the youngsters help put the puck in the net, like Vilardi/Frk, if they can. (That's my guess but it makes sense given the Kings situation.)

As for Byfield's age and the AHL, that's good to know...he's too young to even play in the AHL for quite some time. There are other pro-leagues Byfield can go to instead, I guess. He's nowhere near the NHL right now. His D year, he missed a big chunk of the season, played meaningless games on a bad team, and had no noteworthy games against his peers on the world stage. Regardless of whether LA owns his rights, if I was just purely a fan of his regardless of team, I would want to see him get traded to a contending OHL team, play a full season next year in junior, wreck the scoring numbers next year that Lafreniere and Rossi put up this year, and be the number one guy at the WJC. Who knows if that will happen or if he instead turns into Gilbert Brule or Brian Boyle?

That may be an unsatisfying answer for the Byfield fans here but that's my take on it as a Kings fan. Until Blake/Yanetti announce that name at the podium, I plan on keeping my options open as to who I'm committing my fandom to. Until last year where we got Turcotte and Kaliyev, I've never been able to figure out who the Kings were going to draft if there was an open field. I only knew the Doughty pick and that one was a choice of 2 guys. I just trust the Kings to scout well and make a pick that's much more informed than I ever could.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Bobby Ryan kinda counts. If not, it's Eric Staal

Staal was different though, he played in 81 games in the NHL, then a full season of AHL hockey thanks to the lockout. Had there been no lockout, doubtful he'd be playing there. Bobby Ryan's half season would be the closest one, and that was 12 years ago.

If Byfield is going to spend a full season in the AHL, it would happen after his fourth season of play in the juniors. I'd bet my house there's no f***ing way Byfield will spend four seasons in the OHL, and on top of that another season marinating in the AHL.

 

[Rorschach]

I think the next 18 years of our #2 pick's career matter a lot more than the next 2 no matter what the NHL roster looks like.

It's not about dashing dreams vs. hoarding prospects, it's about smart drafting. You're actually making a case for picking Rossi instead and it's a desperation play. We've seen people draft for need rather than BPA and how it often goes wrong--you're literally advocating for drafting for 600 days and nothing else matters. That's not a strong case.

If you desperately need to win now, sign a UFA. Taylor Hall is available. Alex Pietrangelo is available. I don't want either, but I'd rather blow money on them than self-sabotage my draft and subsequent decades over a short-sighted strategy that's agenda-crafted so you can pick your dude.

But in the end I don't think it's so much that Byfield can't play in the NHL immediately. It's is he best served doing so? And that "drafting for NHL immediacy" isn't a strong strategy.

I don't disagree with any of that. But, and don't kill me over this, I think money-wise that Stutzle is the guy now and later. (Money-wise meaning that's who I would bet on due to the odds I perceive.)

It's not binary. Stutzle is not the guy who is only good 2 years and Byfield is the guy only good after two years. Using what I've observed now, and Stutzle has provided more of that than Byfield (fair or not), I think Stutzle is odds on the best player now and if Byfield "makes it" they will be equally good later. And I think Stutzle's chances of getting to his ceiling is also much better. To me it's not close...Stutzle is the much better, smarter draft choice. Again, my opinion.

(I reserve the right to change my mind if/when Byfield blows me away next year, which I think he could do that in juniors. But that's a big "if".)

I considered heavily acquiring a NHL player, but that's separate from the draft. If I'm trying to win now, I do everything I can. The 2OA does not scratch much cap space so it can easily be done on both levels. So, as a separate discussion, lets talk about who we could acquire. I thought about OEL or even Pie. I don't consider either of those players as contracts we can acquire, especially due to term. Same with Hall. All of those guys will have/want term lasting many, many years and we need space to re-sign guys like Vilardi. Also, I think we're in a new paradigm...we can't spend to the cap physically due to lack of revenue so using ELC players is perfect for the organization. It wouldn't surprise me if LA let a few contracts expire, like Lewis, to lower payroll and meet some sort of invisible internal cap tied to post-Covid revenue.

Lastly, again we can't debate the win now strategy...I think there is some sort of misunderstanding here. Let me clarify here, this is not MY strategy. This is my observation of what I think the Kings organization is thinking, given where they are at and who is influential. In a quick nutshell: most influential in ownership - Phil Anschutz...win now, we've been losing quite a while already, capitalize on the salaries paid to Kopitar and Doughty++; front office - Rob Blake...win now, or I don't have a job, we've been losing quite a while, building a farm sounds nice but the job is to win, not to hoard prospects; coaching - McClellan...like Blake, he needs to win to justify his next contract; players - Doughty...as the most expensive player who still has just a few years of prime left, and as a super-competitive guy, you know he wants to win ASAP.

Other than maybe a guy like Yanetti, I don't see any other influential guys or decision makers who feel we have 2 to 3 years more of rebuilding. My opinion again, but I feel LA has always believed this was a re-tool and not a full Edmonton-style rebuild...when Blake re-signed Doughty, I think this was clear.

My 2.5 cents.

 

[Rorschach]

Staal was different though, he played in 81 games in the NHL, then a full season of AHL hockey thanks to the lockout. Had there been no lockout, doubtful he'd be playing there. Bobby Ryan's half season would be the closest one, and that was 12 years ago.

If Byfield is going to spend a full season in the AHL, it would happen after his fourth season of play in the juniors. I'd bet my house there's no f***ing way Byfield will spend four seasons in the OHL, and on top of that another season marinating in the AHL.

I agree with the above points. So, as a hypothetical, what would be a good "path" to the NHL for him, factoring in his age?
D year - get drafted
D year offseason - get traded to a competitive OHL team
D+1 year - destroy the OHL, dominate in WJC, Hlinka, etc.
D+2 year - step into NHL as a winger/sheltered center?

or...
D+2 year - play in a men's league in Europe
D+3 year - AHL + NHL cup of coffee?

or...
D+3 year - NHL full time hopefully?

or...
D+2 and D+3 year - wait and see

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I agree with the above points. So, as a hypothetical, what would be a good "path" to the NHL for him, factoring in his age?
D year - get drafted
D year offseason - get traded to a competitive OHL team
D+1 year - destroy the OHL, dominate in WJC, Hlinka, etc.
D+2 year - step into NHL as a winger/sheltered center?

or...
D+2 year - play in a men's league in Europe
D+3 year - AHL + NHL cup of coffee?

or...
D+3 year - NHL full time hopefully?

or...
D+2 and D+3 year - wait and see

This goes for both Stutzle and Byfield, but whoever winds up being drafted in that spot, I’d give them a long taste of NHL hockey, however long the preseason is and also a nine game run. We saw the Kings just try this with Bjornfot and he had a great season in the AHL and showed signs of becoming a top 3 dman.

Given the unique circumstances and the uncertainty of when the season will resume, both players might have to play where they’re currently at for another season.

I don’t think the Kings are in any rush in banking on the guy they pick at #2 to be a big time contributor from the get go, and at most, they’ll probably let them develop with tons of playing time for one more season if they’re not ready for the pros.

There’s a few other prospects in the pipeline who can help them now, or they can look elsewhere for immediate help without adding unnecessary pressure to Byfield or Stutzle. Do exactly what they did with Kopitar.

 

[Rorschach]

This goes for both Stutzle and Byfield, but whoever winds up being drafted in that spot, I’d give them a long taste of NHL hockey, however long the preseason is and also a nine game run. We saw the Kings just try this with Bjornfot and he had a great season in the AHL and showed signs of becoming a top 3 dman.

Given the unique circumstances and the uncertainty of when the season will resume, both players might have to play where they’re currently at for another season.

I don’t think the Kings are in any rush in banking on the guy they pick at #2 to be a big time contributor from the get go, and at most, they’ll probably let them develop with tons of playing time for one more season if they’re not ready for the pros.

There’s a few other prospects in the pipeline who can help them now, or they can look elsewhere for immediate help without adding unnecessary pressure to Byfield or Stutzle. Do exactly what they did with Kopitar.

Forget Stutzle...speaking strictly on Byfield and whether or not with the Kings, what do you see for the next several years of Byfield?

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Forget Stutzle...speaking strictly on Byfield and whether or not with the Kings, what do you see for the next several years of Byfield?

I see a franchise center being groomed to take over the #1 center spot in two years, as Kopitar will be 35 by then and there is nobody in the Kings’ pipeline like Byfield.

I think he’ll go back for another year of juniors, but I could also see them giving him a taste of the NHL, like they did with Brown in 2003 (who also benefitted by playing in the AHL due to the 2004-05 lockout, just like Staal and the countless other first rounders from the 2003 draft class).

Even after his draft year, Byfield will still be 19 with three seasons of OHL experience. He won’t be in the AHL or OHL in 2021. He’ll be an NHLer by that point.

 

[nbwingsfan]

You may be right. But, I feel that Byfield will spend another year in juniors, then the year after in the AHL. And I don't think that's an uncommon estimation, including the Byfield fans in this thread. Stutzle on the other hand, due to his skillset and experience playing against men along with his performances in best-of tournaments, can play next year in the NHL.

Let's say he is used mostly as a winger on the Kings. He gets to play in the NHL with other NHL centers of the Kings, whether it's the Kings best in Kopitar or another kid like Vilardi or Turcotte. He gets to work with NHL coaches. He may even get some center play garbage time on the bottom six lines.

Even if he goes to the AHL instead of the NHL, he'll be available for a cup of tea at the NHL level.

So the question really to me is this, do you feel the Kings want to win now or win later? (Our own personal opinions don't matter since we don't make the decisions.) I believe Anschutz, Blake, Robitaille, Doughty, Kopitar, Brown and Quick/Carter want to pull out of the rebuild and start winning now. We have enough prospects and our two 10-million dollar guys have maybe 2 to 3 years left of prime playing time together. Vilardi has already arrived so winning, which is counterproductive to rebuilding through the draft, may be something that is already forgone.

I know a lot of people in this thread may not want to hear this since it dashes their dreams of a six year rebuild-hoarding of prospects, but that's what it looks like to me on the NHL level.

He can't do that. It's either two years in Junior or NHL.

 

[Rorschach]

He can't do that. It's either two years in Junior or NHL.

Not sure what you mean. Are you describing his D+2 year is another year in junior or NHL?

 

[nbwingsfan]

Not sure what you mean. Are you describing his D+2 year is another year in junior or NHL?

Yes.

 

[Rorschach]

I see a franchise center being groomed to take over the #1 center spot in two years, as Kopitar will be 35 by then and there is nobody in the Kings’ pipeline like Byfield.

I think he’ll go back for another year of juniors, but I could also see them giving him a taste of the NHL, like they did with Brown in 2003 (who also benefitted by playing in the AHL due to the 2004-05 lockout, just like Staal and the countless other first rounders from the 2003 draft class).

Even after his draft year, Byfield will still be 19 with three seasons of OHL experience. He won’t be in the AHL or OHL in 2021. He’ll be an NHLer by that point.

I think he’ll need to have a Lindros-like next season in the OHL to make that leap. Then again if you mean he’ll be in the NHL as a everyday 4th line forward that’s sheltered, he might be able to do that. He really needs to do something next he he never has...dominate the entire junior class and do it at both ends of the ice.

And if it’s with the Kings, I don’t see much Kopitar in him (the NHL Selke version, 2x leading scorer in the playoffs), without extensive coaching. Kopitar got coached into the dominant two-way player he is now by Terry Murray. And in my mind, he became a winner through shouldering his national team. So there will be some significant gateways he’ll need to make it through. It will be a a very long and interesting journey if he’s Kings property and they try to make him another Kopitar.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I think he’ll need to have a Lindros-like next season in the OHL to make that leap. Then again if you mean he’ll be in the NHL as a everyday 4th line forward that’s sheltered, he might be able to do that. He really needs to do something next he he never has...dominate the entire junior class and do it at both ends of the ice.

And if it’s with the Kings, I don’t see much Kopitar in him (the NHL Selke version, 2x leading scorer in the playoffs), without extensive coaching. Kopitar got coached into the dominant two-way player he is now by Terry Murray. And in my mind, he became a winner through shouldering his national team. So there will be some significant gateways he’ll need to make it through. It will be a a very long and interesting journey if he’s Kings property and they try to make him another Kopitar.

Kopitar was a -44 in his first three NHL seasons, so from the ages of 19 to 21. I think Byfield would be joining a better and more stable franchise than the one Kopitar started with. I’m not expecting a Selke Trophy winner to at 18-19, but his game will grow, just as we’ve seen recently with Barzal, and in the past with the likes of Yzerman and Modano who became complete centers after being all offense in the early stages of their careers.

Byfield has had to carry an average Sudbury team for two seasons, and he plays in every situation and wore a letter this past season at 17. He’ll grow into a leadership role and he will be a dominant two-way center, because he will be learning from one of the best.

 

[Frolov 6'3]

You may be right. But, I feel that Byfield will spend another year in juniors, then the year after in the AHL. And I don't think that's an uncommon estimation, including the Byfield fans in this thread. Stutzle on the other hand, due to his skillset and experience playing against men along with his performances in best-of tournaments, can play next year in the NHL.

Let's say he is used mostly as a winger on the Kings. He gets to play in the NHL with other NHL centers of the Kings, whether it's the Kings best in Kopitar or another kid like Vilardi or Turcotte. He gets to work with NHL coaches. He may even get some center play garbage time on the bottom six lines.

Even if he goes to the AHL instead of the NHL, he'll be available for a cup of tea at the NHL level.

So the question really to me is this, do you feel the Kings want to win now or win later? (Our own personal opinions don't matter since we don't make the decisions.) I believe Anschutz, Blake, Robitaille, Doughty, Kopitar, Brown and Quick/Carter want to pull out of the rebuild and start winning now. We have enough prospects and our two 10-million dollar guys have maybe 2 to 3 years left of prime playing time together. Vilardi has already arrived so winning, which is counterproductive to rebuilding through the draft, may be something that is already forgone.

I know a lot of people in this thread may not want to hear this since it dashes their dreams of a six year rebuild-hoarding of prospects, but that's what it looks like to me on the NHL level.

Rorschach, you write long paragraphs about this and that & you dont even know that Byfield is not eligible for the AHL at age 19. That junior rule is in the league for hundreds years already...

No offense, but to me that is a terrible letdown. I dont know every rule either but meanwhile this is something you should know if you want to talk hockey.


BTW I do not see that people are very negative about Byfield. Only the usual suspects who you can easily detect and perhaps a few more. Nothing wrong with calling out some flaws into his game but people are incredibly positive about him in this topic.

 

[Rorschach]

Rorschach, you write long paragraphs about this and that & you dont even know that Byfield is not eligible for the AHL at age 19. That junior rule is in the league for hundreds years already...

No offense, but to me that is a terrible letdown. I dont know every rule either but meanwhile this is something you should know if you want to talk hockey.


BTW I do not see that people are very negative about Byfield. Only the usual suspects who you can easily detect and perhaps a few more. Nothing wrong with calling out some flaws into his game but people are incredibly positive about him in this topic.

So you’re saying if I am unaware of one random, obscure fact between the transfer of two non-NHL leagues, I have no right to talk about the whole sport of hockey? You realize the number of times it comes up for the Kings that they have a pick this high and at the same time we have to consider the player’s age for the AHL has come up almost never until now. You realize that here on HFB, although we talk prospects, 99% of NHL conversations have nothing to do with the AHL? You realize that not knowing a single fact, a fact I’m not even sure is worth remembering to me and an obscure one at that, had nothing to do with my ability to reason or use logic in arguments? I mean, re-read what you wrote.

I take the time to flesh out my points. That takes effort and I’m thinking of the people who read the points. I guess reading is somehow unpleasant for you? You behave like someone who feels hurt if they read something that disagrees with them.

Last question...who are you again to judge me? I’ve been on HFB both on the Kings board and the general boards for many years, 99% reading, 1% writing. I’ve had highs and lows. I’ve read miles of text on this board. I don’t recall a single thing you’ve written in all of that time that has impressed me, let alone would qualify you to judge me.
I disappoint you...not too worried about it. That you confuse knowing obscure knowledge with the ability to reason and it causes you to lash out at your fellow Kings poster...well, that’s a little bit disturbing.

And I don’t know if your last paragraph is replying or aimed at me. My whole point is not Byfield or Byfield’s game. It’s forming discussion on why I see some people having an evaluation that is quite different from my own evaluation. Evaluating young hockey talent is at best a side-hobby of mine so I like to open discussion to see if I can learn something. Often times the discussion goes nowhere, sometimes I learn something. I make the effort to clearly discuss my point, try to keep it about the discussion and I try to never attack the other person...first. When your point disagrees with the other person, that’s when it’s the most respectful to make the effort to clearly state your point.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

So the question really to me is this, do you feel the Kings want to win now or win later? (Our own personal opinions don't matter since we don't make the decisions.) I believe Anschutz, Blake, Robitaille, Doughty, Kopitar, Brown and Quick/Carter want to pull out of the rebuild and start winning now. We have enough prospects and our two 10-million dollar guys have maybe 2 to 3 years left of prime playing time together. Vilardi has already arrived so winning, which is counterproductive to rebuilding through the draft, may be something that is already forgone.

I know a lot of people in this thread may not want to hear this since it dashes their dreams of a six year rebuild-hoarding of prospects, but that's what it looks like to me on the NHL level.

I know you may not want to hear this as it dashes your dream of the Kings accelerating their rebuild, but this is what it looks like the Kings will be doing on the NHL level:

“You look around the league and sometimes you see young guys and they’re taking two, three, four years,” Kings president Luc Robitaille said. “We want to make sure we give time to our kids. That’s what we’re looking at.”

It appears you may have been off base with your insistence that they need to draft somebody who can join the team now and contribute (which even if it is Stutzle will be no guarantee he'll be able to contribute).

 

[Osprey]

There’s a few other prospects in the pipeline who can help them now, or they can look elsewhere for immediate help without adding unnecessary pressure to Byfield or Stutzle. Do exactly what they did with Kopitar.

This is just a technicality, but it was Kopitar's decision to stay in Sweden for his D+1 year, not the Kings'. Dave Taylor really wanted him to come over immediately because he was on the hot seat and wanted Anze to save his job . Alas, he was fired before Kopitar ever suited up for the Kings. This doesn't diminish your point that the extra year before coming to the NHL may've been beneficial for him, though.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

This is just a technicality, but it was Kopitar's decision to stay in Sweden for his D+1 year, not the Kings'. Dave Taylor really wanted him to come over immediately because he was on the hot seat and wanted Anze to save his job . Alas, he was fired before Kopitar ever suited up for the Kings. None of this diminishes your point that the extra year before coming to the NHL probably helped him, though.

Thankfully they didn’t have Kopitar get tainted by Jeremy Roenick, the diva.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I think it's a difference between can he play and will he play. The Kings, fortunately, have enough insulation that he doesn't need to. The question will be if he's better served in the NHL for the year or juniors for the year. I'm not so sure it's as cut and dry as people suggest, whether he's 'raw' or not. Much like the conversations they had re: Turcotte last year, they all said he CAN play right now, and I have no doubt he could put up seasons like other top picks (~50 points); its' just about whether it would be better for him to learn a little up here then go down and crush juniors. With Turcotte, they thought he was going to a program where he could learn a lot, but now prefer him close to hand learning from our dev staff. With Byfield or Stutzle, it will depend on what the non-NHL option is, or whether learning on-the-job with veterans like Kopitar and Doughty woudl be better.

I guess in short I'm not seeing this 2-3 years out of the NHL thing for Byfield and I think it's an overestimation of his 'raw'ness vs. ability to contribute and benefits of learning in the league.