- Aug 21, 2016
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C/LW Anton Lundell - IFK Helsinki, Liiga (2020 Draft)
- Thread starter ChicagoBullsFan
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1: he doesn’t score enough
2: his positioning is always great, hence him being in a good spot for the tap in. He just doesn’t show enough skill to impress me. Just doesn’t drive play at evens or on the PP from my limited live viewings.
I’m a tough grader.
Can he go top 10? Don’t doubt it in the least. The world is full of stupid people(at least that’s what Roger Clyne taught me.) Just because he can, it doesn’t mean he should.
Sebastian Aho Draft Year
Liiga
27 Games 4 Goals 7 Assists 11 Points
WJC-20
5 Games 0 points
Anton Lundell Draft Year
Liiga
44 Games 10 Goals 18 Assists 28 Points
WJC-20 (D-2 Season)
7 Games 1 Goal 3 Assist 4 Points
By all accounts Lundell is the better defensive player at this/that point in their careers and has amazing possession stats.
In saying that, I know that not all prospects develop in a linear fashion, but hes out produced a recent prospect whos had 2 basically ppg nhl seasons by 22 years old.
Liiga
27 Games 4 Goals 7 Assists 11 Points
WJC-20
5 Games 0 points
Anton Lundell Draft Year
Liiga
44 Games 10 Goals 18 Assists 28 Points
WJC-20 (D-2 Season)
7 Games 1 Goal 3 Assist 4 Points
By all accounts Lundell is the better defensive player at this/that point in their careers and has amazing possession stats.
In saying that, I know that not all prospects develop in a linear fashion, but hes out produced a recent prospect whos had 2 basically ppg nhl seasons by 22 years old.
Aho D+1 season when he was the same age as Lundell is in his draft year and when both were also in their second season in Liiga:
Liiga
regular season: 45 games 20 goals 25 assists 45 points, playoffs: 14 games 4 goals 11 assists 15 points
WJC-20
7 games 5 goals 9 assists 14 points
WC
10 games 3 goals 4 assists 7 points
Some context you might want to take in consideration.
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
It means that if you want to do a statistical comparison between the two, imo it would be more accurate to use Aho's u19 season (D+1), instead of his draft season. And that's because this was Lundell's u19 season and his second season in Liiga, which was also the case for Aho in his u19 season.
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
Migod, the more I hear about this guy, the more he seems to be a prototypical MN Wild player, with his ceiling being Mikko Koivu, and his floor, Eriksson-Ek(don't laugh, anemic box scores aside, is turning into an excellent, physical defensive middle six NHL C). Would not be surprised to see him picked at #11. His lack of advanced puck skills is worrying, as that is one thing that usually doesn't develop late.
DANOZ28
Registered User
Think Lundell is getting pretty underrated at this point. Best defensive forward in the draft and a natural center. Reminds me alot a Ryan O'Reilly, not the best skater but a very effective player with a good shot. I have him going top 7 and could push top 5.
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
Seems i'm not only who isn't high on Lundell.
Lets see with good amount of time ( 5 to 7 years ) who's wrong and who's right.
I respect anyones opinion on being high or low on a prospect regardless of how outlandish it may seem to me because the best way to improve as a scout is to see a player from every perspective, not just my own. That's why I don't hate the "Lundell isn't offensively talented" group as long as they make a legit argument for it. I personally think his ability to process the game offensively is as high as anyone's in the draft and will make up for the lack of "skill" people claim will hold him back.
That being said even if he agreed with me, I wouldn't back up my thoughts by quoting McCagg. He is not the best scout IMO and doesn't have the best track record. I don't believe he devotes enough time into a lot of his picks.
That being said while I disagree on Anton, I agree with his thoughts on Poirier (although for most likely a different reason than McCagg)
Guy had Vesailainen top 5. He clearly doesn't understand hockey sense.
One bad reach doesn't equate to being a bad scout no matter how bad at is. It's about a volume of work over time.
That being said, McCagg's volume is filled with bad reaches and being overly harsh on top prospects for the sake of being different. Almost everytime the reason is the same popular narrative regarding that players faults IE Lundell is has a mediocre ceiling offensively because he has a lack of top end skill. He seems to have a pack mentality and never really produces any original thoughts.
Just my opinion on the matter anyways.
Pavel Buchnevich
Drury and Laviolette Must Go
I completely agree. He’s the master of taking a popular narrative to a ridiculous extreme to form a crazy hot take. If a player might drop 10 spots, this guy will drop them 20 spots. If a player might rise 10 spots after a good tournament, this guy will have them rise 20 spots. It’s all for show, in my opinion. He wants to be discussed and get page views without letting the quality of his ideas do so.
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
I take this back, more views on him and his skating is going to be an issue, potential stopper. He may be one of the better players today but his upside is a lot lower than some other guys
LastWordArmy
Registered User
While there are some concerns on his skating, its not enough to knock Lundell out of our top 10. He is such a smart and skilled player at both ends of the ice, and in recent years we've seen the work that high-end skating coaches can do to improve NHL prospects. Below is our report.
Anton Lundell Scouting Report: 2020 NHL Draft #9 - Last Word on Hockey
Anton Lundell Scouting Report: 2020 NHL Draft #9 - Last Word on Hockey
CaptTennille
President of the Blair Betts Fan Club
I understand the concern around his skating, but to me it seems like Lundell has that Stepan/Pavelski thing where the stride is awkward and he doesn't seem to have great agility or explosiveness, but lo and behold, there he is lifting a guy's stick at the perfect moment to save a sure-fire tap in goal or suddenly he pops up right next to a yawning net to bury a loose puck - and you wonder how the hell he even got there as you didn't even notice him. You rewind the video back and discover that he didn't watch the play unfold and realize "I should be in that spot", he just innately floated there -he left early so he could be on time.
I actually think he has pretty good top end speed and wonder if his first-step can/will improve once he's done growing. Nevertheless, you can add me to the camp that doesn't think he will be an elite producer in the NHL, because I don't think that is his game - he isn't selfish enough and he doesn't possess any game breaking skills. That being said, I think he can quite reasonably become a top six forward who everyone thinks is good defensively and can produce respectably, but when you do a deep-dive into his numbers you realize "Hoooooly crap, this guy drives play and suppresses chances at an elite level."
How teams selecting in the first round value a player with that upside probably comes down to personal preference and I would imagine the lottery teams who are looking for franchise altering players will probably stay away, but the teams that feel they have offensively gifted young players but lack players that can settle down the entire flow of the game in their favor might value him much higher.
As a a Rangers fan, I'd easily take him if he was available with their first of their two 1st round picks and shoot for a risk/reward player who falls a bit with the other (Gunler/Lapierre/Perrault/Bourque etc.)
I actually think he has pretty good top end speed and wonder if his first-step can/will improve once he's done growing. Nevertheless, you can add me to the camp that doesn't think he will be an elite producer in the NHL, because I don't think that is his game - he isn't selfish enough and he doesn't possess any game breaking skills. That being said, I think he can quite reasonably become a top six forward who everyone thinks is good defensively and can produce respectably, but when you do a deep-dive into his numbers you realize "Hoooooly crap, this guy drives play and suppresses chances at an elite level."
How teams selecting in the first round value a player with that upside probably comes down to personal preference and I would imagine the lottery teams who are looking for franchise altering players will probably stay away, but the teams that feel they have offensively gifted young players but lack players that can settle down the entire flow of the game in their favor might value him much higher.
As a a Rangers fan, I'd easily take him if he was available with their first of their two 1st round picks and shoot for a risk/reward player who falls a bit with the other (Gunler/Lapierre/Perrault/Bourque etc.)
Alex Taxman
FSHockey
Full report on Lundell out now:
https://www.futurescopehockey.com/post/prospect-report-anton-lundell
https://www.futurescopehockey.com/post/prospect-report-anton-lundell
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