C Kirby Dach (2019, 3rd, CHI)

[sansabri]

I don’t think that’s a good decision either. They can always send him back at some point, but he’s exactly the type of 18 year old player I would not expect to be able to put together a full season at the NHL level. Most struggle with consistency as 18 year old rookies. Dach has struggled with it in junior hockey. It probably won’t get much better playing in the best league in the world.

So did Jordan Staal and Ryan Getzlaf

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

So did Jordan Staal and Ryan Getzlaf

You are missing the point. It's not that Dach won't be very good because he had consistency issues. He probably will be very good, it's that it's usually a good idea to let him become more consistent in lower leagues before you throw him into the best league in the world. Besides, Getzlaf didn't play in the NHL at 18, and while Staal did, I think you'd hope that he becomes a better player than Staal.

 

[landy92mack29]

Dach hasn't struggled with consistency in the WHL though....unless playing through a injury you shouldn't be playing through is struggling. I don't think it's smart to keep him more than 9 games this year and he'd be better off with 1 more development year but it's not because of his game in game out effort

 

[Rick C137]

I don’t know why people are so quick to fall back on preconceived notions that going back and dominating junior in your d+1 year is somehow better for your development. I’ve watched every single one of Dachs NHL shifts and the dude belongs. He keeps getting better every game he plays and has been one of the best hawks forwards the best couple games. He’s made some patient smart plays with the puck and isn’t hesitating or acting uncomforable with the puck. The biggest thing that’s keeping him in the NHL is his play away from the puck. He’s defending at an NHL level already. When strome was struggling he bumped him off center because Dach is already the superior defensive player. He commits down low and knows how to use his long reach.

I just don’t get how him going back and putting up 2 points a game in a league against boys where he’s physically dominant is going to be better for his development than playing in the best league in the world where he’s already proven he belongs.

 

[57special]

If he can compete physically and can handle the life mentally then sure, bring him up. If you have any doubts, wait. Most 18 yo's can't.

 

[landy92mack29]

I don’t know why people are so quick to fall back on preconceived notions that going back and dominating junior in your d+1 year is somehow better for your development. I’ve watched every single one of Dachs NHL shifts and the dude belongs. He keeps getting better every game he plays and has been one of the best hawks forwards the best couple games. He’s made some patient smart plays with the puck and isn’t hesitating or acting uncomforable with the puck. The biggest thing that’s keeping him in the NHL is his play away from the puck. He’s defending at an NHL level already. When strome was struggling he bumped him off center because Dach is already the superior defensive player. He commits down low and knows how to use his long reach.

I just don’t get how him going back and putting up 2 points a game in a league against boys where he’s physically dominant is going to be better for his development than playing in the best league in the world where he’s already proven he belongs.

It's better to go back to juniors because the player can focus on developing his game instead of just trying to stick in the lineup. A lot of players could stick in the nhl their draft+1 year in a sub 10 minute a night role but for their long term game it's better to go back and play 20-25 minutes a night. In Juniors they know they'll keep their big role even if they have a down game so they can focus all their time on improving their skating, hit the gym for strength and work for hours if they want on puck skills. NHL you can't do that(AHL as well). The AHL is the worst place possible to put a player in their draft+1 imo.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Dach hasn't struggled with consistency in the WHL though....unless playing through a injury you shouldn't be playing through is struggling. I don't think it's smart to keep him more than 9 games this year and he'd be better off with 1 more development year but it's not because of his game in game out effort

Let me get this straight.

He hasn't struggled, but he's struggled, although we can't count those struggles because he was playing injured, something that you must believe is never done by any other players.

You and I both know that a problem with Dach has long been that at times he can dominate a shift or even a game due to his size, skill, playmaking, goal-scoring and even his underrated skating and two way effort, but then there are games where he disappears and he doesn't look like the most talented player in the WHL, which he is. This is common for big playmaking centers. It usually takes time for their consistency to develop. Dach is no different. He was third on his own team last season in scoring, and was barely over 1PPG in the WHL.

He can keep up in the NHL right now, but he's better off going back to Saskatoon, and being the best player in the WHL. It'll be better for his long-term development. Playing 14 minutes a game in the NHL with an inconsistent role is not what you'd want a high ceiling-low floor player doing. It benefits no one. Chicago is going nowhere this season. It seems as if Bowman is so worried about trying to justify his surprising selection at #3 right away that he's willing to hurt Dach's development to do so.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I don’t know why people are so quick to fall back on preconceived notions that going back and dominating junior in your d+1 year is somehow better for your development. I’ve watched every single one of Dachs NHL shifts and the dude belongs. He keeps getting better every game he plays and has been one of the best hawks forwards the best couple games. He’s made some patient smart plays with the puck and isn’t hesitating or acting uncomforable with the puck. The biggest thing that’s keeping him in the NHL is his play away from the puck. He’s defending at an NHL level already. When strome was struggling he bumped him off center because Dach is already the superior defensive player. He commits down low and knows how to use his long reach.

I just don’t get how him going back and putting up 2 points a game in a league against boys where he’s physically dominant is going to be better for his development than playing in the best league in the world where he’s already proven he belongs.

And then in game 45, he's playing 6 minutes a game or is in and out of the lineup on the fourth line because he's completely lost at the NHL level, is a huge liability, and has hit the rookie wall.

This happens for the majority of rookies, let alone 18 year old rookies. Dach will likely be no exception, and he has the distinction of having a contract year burned past 9 NHL games. You can also only play him in the NHL, otherwise he goes back to junior. Yes, he can keep up in the NHL right now. You are saying nothing anyone didn't already know. He should be able to do that, if picked 3rd. And everyone knows he's a very talented hockey player, so it's not surprising. It's not as if he has any big physical barriers or huge deficiencies with skating or defense that would make him stand out in a negative way.

When you extend a player past 9 games, you better be sure that you aren't going to be asking in another two months whether the player belongs in the lineup. NHL teams will often not extend the stay of a player who can keep up at the time because they have concerns about whether the player can stick in the lineup in a big enough role for a full season. It takes a lot of consistency to do this. Most 18 year olds hit a rookie wall. Dach will likely hit it, as he's not even shown full season consistency in junior hockey.

 

[Half Clapper]

Dumb move by the Hawks. This guy would have had a good chance to win a mem cup with the Blades.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Draisaitl played 40 games, and had a year burned. He turned out just fine.

Just like the expansion draft, fans over value the whole elc thing.

GMs don't stress over 1 year of lost play if tgey have a chance to make their team better

 

[PAZ]

Dach will be NHL ready sooner than later and the Hawks aren't competing anytime soon with Toews, Keith, and Seabrooks contracts being anchors for the foreseeable future, so it's not a big deal burning a year in Dach's contract.

However, it'll be an absolute mistake if they keep him up the whole year if he hits a wall or is getting casted into a checking line role. Confidence is huge in development, it's the reason why so many highly-touted prospects have their peak early, and then eventually end up overseas. They'll have a great season in the AHL, have a decent call-up in the NHL, but can't take the next step to become a permanent NHLer. Next few seasons they get bounced around AHL teams putting up worse stats each year before heading to Europe.

 

[Dominance]

7:29 today? What kind of joke is this? Incredible that the kid is able to produce as well as he has, and for that matter, be able to stay awake as much as he has with these terrible minutes.

Average of less than 2:30 in a 20 minute (~30 minute, real time) period. That’s unbelievable.

 

[Zaddy]

I hope he gets sent down. No point for him to be in the NHL currently. He got a taste of the league, now let him develop properly in juniors and play big minutes and be a dominant player at that level.

 

[NuxFan09]

Yeah I notice he's on the 4th line now for the Blackhawks. That's no good for this kid. I hope he gets sent back down to junior.

Those are my thoughts as an outsider though. How do Blackhawks fans feel about it?

 

[greasysnapper]

Draisaitl played 40 games, and had a year burned. He turned out just fine.

Just like the expansion draft, fans over value the whole elc thing.

GMs don't stress over 1 year of lost play if tgey have a chance to make their team better

Totally disagree. You lose negotiating power on that first post-elc contract because it opens them up to offer sheets. I think it matters if you think a player could be special. And I think Dach could be one of those players in a year or two.

At the end of the day, regardless of the contract/business stuff, he's not ready. I really hope they send him back after 9, and the biggest reason for that is his body isn't ready, he still needs to grow into it.

 

[Dominance]

Seriously, how dumb do the Blackhawks have to be to publicly say that he’ll stay with the team. Just why.

Send the kid back, dumbasses. Yes, he’s ready. But playing less than a dozen minutes a night isn’t helping him, and the team isn’t anywhere near contending.

 

[Mrb1p]

I wish theyd send him back. Making the same mistake as the Habs did with Kotkaniemi... lets hope they play him big minutes at least.

 

[Havre]

Generally speaking I rather go "too slow" than "too fast" when it comes to bringing players up, but I would argue it is really not possible from the outside to say what would be best for his development. To me a lot of that comes down to his personality. Some need that experience to dominate among players the same age group as you to build that foundation to play the same kind of role at the NHL level - some don't.

Hopefully this is properly evaluated by the Blackhawks - or they are still evaluating it.

 

[Mrb1p]

Generally speaking I rather go "too slow" than "too fast" when it comes to bringing players up, but I would argue it is really not possible from the outside to say what would be best for his development. To me a lot of that comes down to his personality. Some need that experience to dominate among players the same age group as you to build that foundation to play the same kind of role at the NHL level - some don't.

Hopefully this is properly evaluated by the Blackhawks - or they are still evaluating it.

Thats fine and dandy if the player is actually challenged, letting him rot on a 3rd or 4th line isn't it.

 

[Havre]

Thats fine and dandy if the player is actually challenged, letting him rot on a 3rd or 4th line isn't it.

Early days as to him "rotting". I didn't watch the game, but he played 12mins+ with significant PP time against Anaheim.

I don't see an issue with playing a young high end player on the 3rd line for a season. Different story if he is asked to play purely in a defensive role on the 4th.

 

[Mrb1p]

Early days as to him "rotting". I didn't watch the game, but he played 12mins+ with significant PP time against Anaheim.

I don't see an issue with playing a young high end player on the 3rd line for a season. Different story if he is asked to play purely in a defensive role on the 4th.

Watch Kotkaniemi and tell me it was a good idea to keep him around last year. Let kids use their skills. Play kids in spots theyre going to play in their career.

You don't ask a mechanic to be a plumber for three years before becoming a mechanic.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Thats fine and dandy if the player is actually challenged, letting him rot on a 3rd or 4th line isn't it.

Svechnikov played on the 4th line alot last year. He turned out just fine it's looking like

 

[Havre]

Watch Kotkaniemi and tell me it was a good idea to keep him around last year. Let kids use their skills. Play kids in spots theyre going to play in their career.

You don't ask a mechanic to be a plumber for three years before becoming a mechanic.

Sample size of one with a player that is hardly a write off just yet.

As I started saying - I think taking it slow is generally speaking the best way to develop young players, but it doesn't mean there are exceptions.

Some learn better when they are asked to take that next step. Some get bored by playing with players that are clearly not up to their level etc.

I don't know what is the right way for Dach, but I don't think one can categorically say it is the wrong path for him.

 

[Mrb1p]

Svechnikov played on the 4th line alot last year. He turned out just fine it's looking like

He did and he got more and more playing time as the year went on, this is mostly fine. Kotkaniemi got 13 minutes and never got an opportunity to move up. If this is the case, keep Dach down.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Svechnikov played on the 4th line alot last year. He turned out just fine it's looking like

This isn't really accurate. Svech played mainly on the 3rd line with Wallmark and Martinook for a good portion of the season and Svech, Wallmark and Martinook ended the season 4th, 5th and 6th among forwards in 5v5 TOI on the season. Guys like Bishop and McKegg were the guys that centered the 4th line, and Svech barely played with those 2.

Svech played 3rd line and moved up the line-up later in the season and into the playoffs. Canes are doing the same with Necas this year where he is playing on the 3rd line in a more sheltered role.