C Joseph Veleno (2018, 30th, DET) II

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

So where's the hate on Jake Wise?

He's a good prospect.

 

[Shaman464]

Outside of his shot, I wouldnt say he has any serious weakness in him. Thats why he was a first round pick. If he had an elite shot, leading him to score a bunch of goals combined with his lack of other weaknesses he was probably a top 7 or 8 pick.

It is true that hes a well rounded player, making him a safe bet to be an NHLer, but it is also a reason to have him lower in the first as well. That is perfect justification for scouts having him lower.

You dont consistently score a lot without an elite shot or net front play in the NHL, you dont consistently dangle around NHL dmen with good but not great hands, you dont consistently put up 50 assists without elite vision. But with all of these skills being pretty good, you can be a well rounded, impact player that just isnt the very top of the league. You could havea few seasons where something really clicks and you produce at a first line level but its not as easy to continue without an elite skill to rely on.

Veleno has plenty of time to develop some of these aspects and I think he was drafted a bit lower than he should've been, but hes also not some stud, blue chip guaranteed top line center either

I can see him as a Jordan Staal, good for 35-50 points, good defense, and anchoring a third line that gives a good team a ton of scoring depth.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

All we can say is that he was very good at the Traverse City tournament. For my money, he was Detroit's best player. That's a good sign.

 

[newfy]

I can see him as a Jordan Staal, good for 35-50 points, good defense, and anchoring a third line that gives a good team a ton of scoring depth.

I dont know if style wise thats the best comparison but I think that he could have a similar impact to Jordan Staal. A guy who has some pretty solid offensive years but plays a really good all around game and can definitely bump up into the top 6 at times/be a second line center in some of his better years

All we can say is that he was very good at the Traverse City tournament. For my money, he was Detroit's best player. That's a good sign.

I would say that was Cholowski personally. Veleno had a great tourney and was pretty consistent though. Zadinas highs were higher but his last game was worse thananything Veleno did all torney. Rasmussen might've been better though, he was a bit more assertive I think which is expected for the older player

 

[ponder]

I’m not seeing the Jordan Staal comparisons. Staal is a lot bigger, not as good a skater, and more shoot-first. If I had to compare him to an NHLer, I’d say his upside is along the lines of ... a more pass first Adam Henrique? A more physical Filppula? Something like that.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I’m not seeing the Jordan Staal comparisons. Staal is a lot bigger, not as good a skater, and more shoot-first. If I had to compare him to an NHLer, I’d say his upside is along the lines of ... a more pass first Adam Henrique? A more physical Filppula? Something like that.

The Filppula one is something I can see. Both guys are also really good at zone entries in my opinion. When Filppula was more willing to get to the center of the ice he was a pretty dangerous player, he just didn't want to go there a ton. But this does make sense. The tough part here is Veleno's a really good skater though, to me he has an advantage over both those players by a decent margin in terms of his skating ability.

 

[Debrincat93]

naw anyone who said jordan staal is a fair comparison never saw veleno play. i mean it happens, you're probably basing it off an article but there's almost no similarities besides being hockey players.

 

[ottawah]

All we can say is that he was very good at the Traverse City tournament. For my money, he was Detroit's best player. That's a good sign.

Not for Detroit ....

 

[newfy]

I’m not seeing the Jordan Staal comparisons. Staal is a lot bigger, not as good a skater, and more shoot-first. If I had to compare him to an NHLer, I’d say his upside is along the lines of ... a more pass first Adam Henrique? A more physical Filppula? Something like that.

I think there was only one Jordan Staal comparison, I wanna make sure its obvious that I dont actually think he plays like that, just that he could be a similar value player. I think a more physical Filppula is pretty good though. Both are really good puck carriers and 2 way players and I dont think Filppula has a real "killer instinct" offensively. The guy will carry the puck, walk around a few guys but sometimes the points just dont represent his skill set. I would say Veleno is kinda like that right now, the skill set might be a bit better than his production but he at least still has time to improve there.

I do like that you mention more physical Filppula too. Thats a somewhat underrated part of Velenos game, he forechecks pretty hard and finishes a lot of his checks. Hes not Tom Wilson or anything but its worth noting that thats a valubale part of his game

 

[Frk It]

There’s not a perfect 1:1, but offensively he reminds me of Derrick Brassard.

Overall he kind of reminds me of Antoine Vermette a bit. Similar skaters and similar size.

 

[leafers]

Very good ? Second half ?

He was good for a dozen games, where he posted something like 20 points in 10ish games, and he was back to being PPG, like in SJ.

He also did nothing at the U18.

And this is not me statswatching, Ive actually commented on this live, during the U18, just check the habs board for my (And about a dozen other regular) comments about him, we all agreed he pretty much was a 30th or so prospect in value, and thats where he was picked, which is fine, just don't make him out to be something he isn't.

Velenos final draft ranking:

2018 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #10 by ISS Hockey
2018 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #14 by Future Considerations
2018 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #37 by Hockeyprospect.com
2018 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #10 by McKeen's Hockey
2018 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #14 by TSN/McKenzie
2018 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #8 by NHL Central Scouting

So 5 out of 6 had him going somewhere in that top 8-14 range.
And he fell all the way to #30, so that was a very good value pick, no denying that.

He's looked real good in the prospect tourney as well.
I think he will pan out as a solid 2 way center.

 

[ProspectsSTC]

Went around where I had him, Vermette was a good comparison that I saw above, Cogliano would be another one

 

[Christien]

Veleno doesn't look out of place at all in preseason. He's really impressed me a lot out there. Great puck skills, skating, hockey sense and pretty good in the faceoff circle as well. I'm expecting a bright future for this kid.

 

[Thebesthockey]

I will repeat
his nhl career will be longer than wahlstroms/hayton and farabees

 

[Dominance]

I will repeat
his nhl career will be longer than wahlstroms/hayton and farabees

Matt Cullen and Dainius Zubrus have played significantly longer than guys like Larmer, Federko, Mogilny, Stastny, and Kariya (even if his career was shortened mainly due to injury).

Don’t get me wrong, I love Veleno and I think he can prove to people that he should’ve gone top-10. But that’s just a weird statement to make.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Nice assist to Daley in today's game.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

There’s not a perfect 1:1, but offensively he reminds me of Derrick Brassard.

I don't see it. Brassard was a pretty decent goal scorer, despite being slightly more of an assist guy. He had a really good slap shot. Veleno is not much of a goal-scorer.

 

[Thebesthockey]

Matt Cullen and Dainius Zubrus have played significantly longer than guys like Larmer, Federko, Mogilny, Stastny, and Kariya (even if his career was shortened mainly due to injury).

Don’t get me wrong, I love Veleno and I think he can prove to people that he should’ve gone top-10. But that’s just a weird statement to make.

meant better

 

[HOPE]

Veleno will be the steal from the wings, not Zadina. people didn't believe. the hate on Veleno was so uncalled for, Only because he was not a shiny new toy for scouts and they had him on their radar since he was 14 year old!

 

[ProspectsFanatic]

It felt very strange how many on this board suddenly started hating on him and call out everything that could be perceived as wrong about his game, by the end of it, he somehow had no offensive skills that could translate to the NHL with bad IQ with no shot whatsoever, he was lucky if he could turn out into a third liner. BlackBook had him in the 2nd round and it seems to have spread around here, the BlackBook is quite respected here, with Mark Edwards posts explaining his reasoning why he was dropping Veleno.

 

[93LEAFS]

Veleno will be the steal from the wings, not Zadina. people didn't believe. the hate on Veleno was so uncalled for, Only because he was not a shiny new toy for scouts and they had him on their radar since he was 14 year old!

NHL scouts don't care about 14-year-olds or the expectations placed on them. Figuring out this years draft board for an NHL team is such a burden that they aren't really paying attention much past what is draft eligible. They'd actually be surprised talking to people here that we know about these kids. NHL scouts really don't give a shit about a prospect until he plays in Major Junior, and even then, that's minor until they are in their draft season.

 

[HOPE]

NHL scouts don't care about 14-year-olds or the expectations placed on them. Figuring out this years draft board for an NHL team is such a burden that they aren't really paying attention much past what is draft eligible. They'd actually be surprised talking to people here that we know about these kids. NHL scouts really don't give a **** about a prospect until he plays in Major Junior, and even then, that's minor until they are in their draft season.

i kind of want to disagree with this. Not that i think all scouts are good. i feel like the whole "behind the scene" in an organisation are getting old and washed up. this sports needs fresh new eyes, People who started watching the game in the new era. Some scouts/management are still in the past. These guys are constantly watching game from around the world. saying they don't know players like most geeks do here is kinda not true, are they better to evaluate them? thats hella arguable, being a scout is not something you study for, it's a mix of free hard work, connection, timing basicly all the stars lined up, so of course some casual people could be better at evaluating talent.

So i still stand by my point, i realy feel like Veleno has been on their radar for ever and since he didn't KILL everything like he was suppose to as a exeptional Q player, they got bored. it's crazy to say but people have been saying Veleno had a down year... If you take a look at his PPG on drummondville alone and put them at 57games (same numbers of game zadina played and posted 82pts) he does the EXACT same points. Veleno is the Center, he's a tier above Zadina defensive wise, has the way better all around game and translatable game. Yet Zadina had an AMAZING season. i feel like it's a bit ironic.

i got called crazy saying Veleno's floor was 55pts Two-way center after he got drafted. (yes floor, as in bare minimum)

 

[93LEAFS]

i kind of want to disagree with this. Not that i think all scouts are good. i feel like the whole "behind the scene" in an organisation are getting old and washed up. this sports needs fresh new eyes, People who started watching the game in the new era. Some scouts/management are still in the past. These guys are constantly watching game from around the world. saying they don't know players like most geeks do here is kinda not true, are they better to evaluate them? thats hella arguable, being a scout is not something you study for, it's a mix of free hard work, connection, timing basicly all the stars lined up, so of course some casual people could be better at evaluating talent.

So i still stand by my point, i realy feel like Veleno has been on the radar and since he didn't KILL everything like he was suppose to as a exeptional Q player, they got bored. it's crazy to say but people have been saying Veleno had a down year... If you take a look at his PPG on drummondville alone and put them at 57games (same numbers of game zadina played and posted 82pts) he does the EXACT same points. Veleno is the Center, he's a tier above Zadina defensive wise, has the way better all around game and translatable game. Yet Zadina had an AMAZING season. i feel like it's a bit ironic.

i got called crazy saying Veleno's floor was 55pts Two-way center after he got drafted. (yes floor, as in bare minimum)

It is a waste of time for NHL scouts to scout 14-year-olds. Unless we are talking guys who recently got NHL gigs after working on the major junior side, they simply don't care about a kid in bantam. There is no reason for them to rank them, or waste their time scouting them. Its better served being on the road. Your point was about NHL scouts and paying attention to 14 year olds. They don't. Its hard enough to keep track of the 100 or so draft eligible kids in your region before burdening yourself with someone in junior. These guys are trying to nail 7th round picks, not figure out who might go number 1 3 three years down the line.

Your floor is crazy. That isn't even the floor on most elite prospects. Veleno's floor is a non-NHLer, like almost every NHLer taken outside the top 3.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

The Red Wings kids have been very impressive. Far exceeded my expectations. Veleno, Cholowski, Sulak, Zadina, Rasmussen, Svechnikov. All having stand out camps, it's very good. Veleno has been exceptional. He looks almost ready for the big time.

 

[tfong]

^ dunno about you but Zadina hasn't surpassed my expectations at all lol. Maybe a "barely meets"?

Veleno has been decent as well, good energy and speed. But definitely holes in his game to work on. Needs more shot power for sure and a good deal more bulk/strength. Getting bounced around.