LeBrun: Buffalo Sabres have kicked tires on Jason Zucker.

[Bazeek]

I found one trade the last 4 years. If that only happens once in the last 4 years. That means second line wingers don't usually go for that price.

Zucker might get a Mid 1st. I wouldn't bet my money on it.

To summarize:
- You don't think he'll return a mid 1st, but he could.
- Many others think he could return a mid 1st, but don't necessarily think he will.

And somehow this argument has spanned multiple pages in two threads?

 

[Hellinator]

My thoughts exactly... Who? In all seriousness it’s a very very small sample size. He could be an awesome top 6 winger, maybe not. Bit early to say one way or the other...

I would normally say yes. He had missed the development camp because of injury but he had a really good Prospects Challenge tournament and training camp/pre-season before they sent him down to start the season. Which is why it baffled me that they waited so long to bring him back up. If he shows the same flashes as he did last year, he will be up from the start.

This one about his chemistry during prospects tourney
Dahlin bonds with fellow Sabres rookies Mittelstadt, Nylander

This one about his off season last year.
Amerks Nylander out to put finishing touches on AHL apprenticeship
Alexander Nylander did all he could to make the 2018-19 roster of the Buffalo Sabres.
He put the work in during the summer, eating right, living in the weight room.
He stood out during the Sabres’ prospects camp, then followed that up by leading the team in scoring during the preseason with one goal, five assists and an even plus-minus rating in three games.
He skated, he checked, he made things happened.
And then … got sent down to the Rochester Americans for a third time in three seasons, ever since the Sabres made the youngest son of longtime NHLer and former Amerk Michael Nylander the No. 8 overall pick in the 2016 NHL Draft.
Yes, life isn’t fair.
But Alex Nylander learned long ago it’s not about getting knocked down that matters, it’s about getting back up.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Nope, I did your job for you cause you couldn't handle doing proper research.

Lucic's last two seasons before he was traded to LA are almost identical to Zucker's last two seasons in Minnesota.

I mean, sure, if you pretend Lucic was only valued for his scoring.

 

[Digitalbooya]

If you are disagreeing, it your job to provide the examples and not me.

Come on, are you indicating right now that the 2015 Lucic has the same value as the 2019 Zucker. Are you serious?

If you put up 1st line number 3 out of previous 4 full seasons You earn the the right to be called a 1st line winger. Zucker one season of over 47 points in a 4 or 5 year stretch is not a 1st line winger.

Let me ask you this LA gave up so much for Lucic. Were they deciding to give up that much and used him on the 2nd line or the 1st line?

Let me answer that, there plan was to used him on the 1st line.

Since you don't know how to defend your argument. Go ahead and correct my spelling.

It is a fact if you like or norm second line wingers don't usually go for my mid 1st round pick

Wingers who went for a 1st in the 10-20 range in the past 10 years (bold had comparable previous two seasons) :
Perron
Lucic
Ryan
Pominville
Nash
Penner
Jokinen
Horton

You know what's hilarious about this who thing? Your team's leading scoring left winger couldn't break 10 goals or 35 points.

You know what else is hilarious? If you put the last three seasons together, a decent sample size since I know how Canucks fans get about sample size, and averaged them out, Zucker would be top 30 in scoring for left wingers. In the past three seasons, Zucker is #28 in goals scored for ALL forward positions.

Would that be 1st line production to you or no? Hmmm, think about what you say. "Normal second line winger."

I don't correct your spelling for any reason than you to gain knowledge broski. If you want to take that as not able to defend my argument you go right ahead.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I mean, sure, if you pretend Lucic was only valued for his scoring.

I'm sure Edmonton really loves his toughness. Scoring is way more important. It's one of the reasons I'm not a big Greenway fan. He needs to produce in order to be anything more than a third liner.

 

[tsujimoto74]

I'm sure Edmonton really loves his toughness. Scoring is way more important. It's one of the reasons I'm not a big Greenway fan. He needs to produce in order to be anything more than a third liner.

That's the thing, though, Lucic scored and was one of the meanest SOBs in hockey. Zucker is not that kind of player. Lucic obviously isn't that player anymore, but that's not really relevant to what his value was at the time.

 

[Dahlin 2 Eichel]

You should know. Buf traded a late 1st for Montour

Any other teams do this recently? Montour was a steal.

 

[Digitalbooya]

That's the thing, though, Lucic scored and was one of the meanest SOBs in hockey. Zucker is not that kind of player. Lucic obviously isn't that player anymore, but that's not really relevant to what his value was at the time.

So how does #28 amongst all forwards in terms of goals scored the past three years do for Zucker's value?

 

[57special]

Well, it appears that some don't value Zucker more than a late first. Others, such as the Avs, possibly the Coyotes, and PIT, are willing to give up mid 1sts, or a 1st line RW, albeit an aging, slightly controversial one. Zucker would be a complimentary piece to an ES offense that would have intelligent playmakers that would make use of his speed and ability to get to open ice.

Sounds like VAN fans aren't interested in ponying up, and neither are BUF fans, though it's hard to say WTH Alex Nylander is at this point. EDM would love to have a guy like Zucker, but any trade with them seems to bog down in details.

I'd love to trade for ARI's #14(should be a good forward prospect there), Avs #16(maybe a good forward pick if there is a run on D in the low teens.).Less excited about Kessel, not because he is a bad value for MN, but simply because MN is not a team that should be acquiring 30+ yo players. They aren't good enough to be investing in the present.

 

[JP Flow]

Is there a reason why it’s been reported that Kessel won’t waive to go to Minnesota? Isn’t he born/from an area not far from there?

I thought I heard on Russo’s podcast or maybe read in here that there were “multiple reasons” why Phil didn’t waive, but no further details provided.

A mutual acquaintance of mine is a sibling of a Minnesotan NHLer, and they told me that there’s a pressure and added hassle (tickets for old friends, extended family, etc.) in playing at home, and that it’s not entirely uncommon among Minnesotan players to want to play elsewhere because of it—Nate Schmidt signing for Washington as a college free agent when the Wild were pursuing him, for example. If I remember correctly, there were even guys with the Wild who’d cautioned Minnesotans about coming home.

I have no idea how prevalent this sentiment is—obviously the prospect of coming home is pretty appealing to a lot of Minnesotans, considering how many have done so with the Wild—or whether this even applies to Phil, but I thought I’d share as it’s not something I’ve read much about.

 

[57special]

I thought I heard on Russo’s podcast or maybe read in here that there were “multiple reasons” why Phil didn’t waive, but no further details provided.

A mutual acquaintance of mine is a sibling of a Minnesotan NHLer, and they told me that there’s a pressure and added hassle (tickets for old friends, extended family, etc.) in playing at home, and that it’s not entirely uncommon among Minnesotan players to want to play elsewhere because of it—Nate Schmidt signing for Washington as a college free agent when the Wild were pursuing him, for example. If I remember correctly, there were even guys with the Wild who’d cautioned Minnesotans about coming home.

I have no idea how prevalent this sentiment is—obviously the prospect of coming home is pretty appealing to a lot of Minnesotans, considering how many have done so with the Wild—or whether this even applies to Phil, but I thought I’d share as it’s not something I’ve read much about.

Yeah, Russo mentioned more than one reason, but who knows what they are. Maybe he doesn't like Boudreau, Fenton, St. Paul... who knows? I did hear scuttlebutt that he wasn't the most beloved Gopher(by other players) when he was here, but that was a long time ago. Maybe he just doesn't want the cold weather, or likes the warm weather.

I've noticed that a lot of Minnesotans do like to come back, especially if they are family men. Having said that, Kessel is a Sconnie...different breed.

 

[JP Flow]

Yeah, Russo mentioned more than one reason, but who knows what they are. Maybe he doesn't like Boudreau, Fenton, St. Paul... who knows? I did hear scuttlebutt that he wasn't the most beloved Gopher(by other players) when he was here, but that was a long time ago. Maybe he just doesn't want the cold weather, or likes the warm weather.

I've noticed that a lot of Minnesotans do like to come back, especially if they are family men. Having said that, Kessel is a Sconnie...different breed.

All entirely possible. And yeah, the scenario applies less to Kessel than others, but thought it could be something of a factor. At least worth mentioning.

 

[FrodoBeggins]

I did not watch all the posts, but from the fact that I saw your offers for Zucker the worst compared to those that rumored to offer other clubs. Nylander and other bast leave yourself.

 

[Springfield Isotopes]

Decisions, decisions....

Sam Bennett
Christian Fischer
Jake Virtanen
Alex Nylander
Daniel Sprong?
Jack Roslovic?

PHIL KESSEL

Alex Nylander for Mickey Macleod and 3rd

 

[Empoleon8771]

Is there a reason why it’s been reported that Kessel won’t waive to go to Minnesota? Isn’t he born/from an area not far from there?

He wanted the Penguins to try to work out a deal with someone on his trade list or with someone who he wanted to play for more than Minnesota. It doesn't sound like he said no to Minnesota yet, rather it was more of a "go see what else you can find". Based on comments I've heard from LeBrun, McKenzie and Yohe, I'm inclined to believe that he'd ultimately say yes to Minnesota if nothing else would come together.

 

[Bettman Returnz]

He wanted the Penguins to try to work out a deal with someone on his trade list or with someone who he wanted to play for more than Minnesota. It doesn't sound like he said no to Minnesota yet, rather it was more of a "go see what else you can find". Based on comments I've heard from LeBrun, McKenzie and Yohe, I'm inclined to believe that he'd ultimately say yes to Minnesota if nothing else would come together.

Interesting

 

[57special]

I rather doubt that at this point.

If you ask a girl to prom and she says no because she wants to see if any better guys ask her, do you still want to go to prom with her?

How hot is this girl, is she righthanded, and can she be the shooter on a PP?

 

[Shnooks]

If Botterill trades Mittelstadt for a 28 year old, 45-point player making $5.5M for the next four years...he should be fired.

I wouldn't trade Asplund for him either.

Eichel - Mittelstadt - Asplund should be the Sabres' trio of centers for the next 15 years, starting in 2020-2021. (With Pekar taking the 4C a year or two after that.)

 

[Fjordy]

If Botterill trades Mittelstadt for a 28 year old, 45-point player making $5.5M for the next four years...he should be fired.

I wouldn't trade Asplund for him either.

Eichel - Mittelstadt - Asplund should be the Sabres' trio of centers for the next 15 years, starting in 2020-2021. (With Pekar taking the 4C a year or two after that.)

I do not believe, rather he will exchange Reinhart somewhere, than touches Casey.

 

[Shnooks]

I'd go Nylander, 2019 4th round pick, 2020 2nd round pick and a 2021 4th round pick*...for Zucker.

*If Zucker puts up 30 goals and 60 points in one of the first two seasons...the 2021 4th round pick becomes a 2021 2nd round pick.**

**If Zucker scores 40 goals once, or 30 goals twice, or the Sabres make the playoffs...the 2021 4th round pick becomes a 2021 1st round pick.

(If the Wild take Scandella back for a year, we'll take Foligno and the two 4th round picks become 3rd round picks.)

 

[AKL]

I'd go Nylander, 2019 4th round pick, 2020 2nd round pick and a 2021 4th round pick*...for Zucker.

*If Zucker puts up 30 goals and 60 points in one of the first two seasons...the 2021 4th round pick becomes a 2021 2nd round pick.**

**If Zucker scores 40 goals once, or 30 goals twice, or the Sabres make the playoffs...the 2021 4th round pick becomes a 2021 1st round pick.

(If the Wild take Scandella back for a year, we'll take Foligno and the two 4th round picks become 3rd round picks.)

That’s extremely underwhelming

And we’re not interested in exchanging Foligno for Scandella.

 

[Shnooks]

I do not believe, rather he will exchange Reinhart somewhere, than touches Casey.

Eichel, Dahlin, Reinhart, Mittelstadt and Luukkonen should be untouchable...that is who this team should be built around. (And obviously Skinner now.)

Borgen, Samuelsson and Laaksonen are close to that group too.

Skinner - Eichel - ?
? - Mittelstadt - Reinhart
? - ? - ?
? - ? - ?

Dahlin - Borgen
Samuelsson - Laaksonen
? - ?

Luukkonen
?

That should be the template for which this team is built around for the long-term...but, that's just my opinion.

 

[Shnooks]

That’s extremely underwhelming

And we’re not interested in exchanging Foligno for Scandella.

You act like Jason Zucker is Taylor Hall...or even Jeff Skinner, and look what Skinner went for last summer.

And I don't know how Nylander, a 2nd round pick, two 3rd round picks and one year of Scandella, for Zucker and Foligno is "extremely underwhelming"...it's actually quite fair.

 

[AKL]

You act like Jason Zucker is Taylor Hall...or even Jeff Skinner, and look what Skinner went for last summer.

Oh? When did I act like that?

 

[Dickie Dunn]

Love this HF bizarro world where A. Nylander is being shopped as an asset because he didn’t embarrass himself off the ice (this time) for 12 games.