Bruins Problem Children

[BruinLVGA]

pretty much sums it up here...

"When I got traded to the Stars after only three seasons in Boston, there were a lot of articles and rumors about how I was pushed off the Bruins because I was some kind of immature, unfocused party animal. Looking back, based on the way the Bruins were situated at the center position and the realities of a salary cap system, it’s clear that the business side of hockey played a big part in why the trade happened. But that doesn’t make for a very interesting headline or Tweet."

Exactly.

So you're trying to tell me droping Seguin 5,75M contract to bring Loui 4,25M was the 1,5M that change everyghing. Bruins could NOT have found any other way to save that 1,5M? Really?

Seguin was a winger here, so stop with the 3 #1 center non sense. And how in the world Seguin being a winger was a waste? A waste of what? Every of Seguin forte work perfectly fine at wing and every of Seguin downfall are magnify at center. There is litteraly no waste.

Edit: Nobody in there right mind can think a speedy winger good for 35 goals and 70 pts at 5,75M per year wouldn't fit good with Krejci or Bergeron on the Bruins. He was even signed for 6 more years. There was zero incertitude with his contract or how to fit they could fit him in, the grey zone was about his performance. They had to gamble. If Seguin return to his 19yo form than it's a eluva bargain, if he stay on his 20yo form, we don't want that at that price. Now he still has alot of value despite one meh season + playoff, but if they wait a couple more year to see if he rebound and he dones't, then other team too will have seen the exact same thing and his value would have drop. They took a chance, they lost.

Look at the post above. I assume that quote was from a Seguin interview. So you have it straight from the horses mouth.

Re bolded... It wasn't just a one dimensional situation...
1) for starters, at the time of the trade: Tyler Seguin 5.75m, Rich Peverley $3.25m, Ryan Button $0.636m... Loui Eriksson 4.25m, Reilly Smith $0.900, Joe Morrow, $0.894m, Matt Fraser $0.585. Net saving for the Bruins: $9.636m - $6.629= $3.007m. Not $1.5m.
2) Tyler Seguin: signed till 2018/19. Loui Eriksson: signed till 2015/16 = less commitment with Loui = more flexibility.
3) Three young players (Smith, Morrow, Fraser) making close to salary minimum are assets that can be easily used in many ways = more flexibility, helps with the prospect pool.

Seguin was always a center and was drafted as a center. He was used as a winger because we had already two #1C and Julien has notorious problems in trusting young players, especially at an important position like center.
A waste of what? Have you failed to notice his performance as the #1 CENTER of the Dallas Stars?
And talking about "nonsense", sure Lindy Ruff is making a huge mistake playing Seguin at center, he should listen to you and play him at wing.

 

[BruinsFTW]

A lot of people forget the Bruins had Savard right after Thornton....Savard/Kessel was deadly until Matt Cooke effectively ended his career..

We had Bergeron/Savard/Krejci which was amazing down the middle....but 2011 Savard went down for good

 

[SanDogBrewin]

I don't understand why they traded Thornton either, guy was a good player for them, their return in that deal certainly didn't help either.

MOC was ordered to make the trade.

Gotta love all the short sightedness

First of all, Thornton was traded away because Jacobs wanted to, not because management thought it was the right move; Jacobs also apparently insisted he be traded to California because that was as far away from Boston as possible. Without that move, the Bruins never get Chara and without Chara that team doesn't go anywhere.

Spot on

 

[Beukeboom Fan]

Lucic - Thornton - Seguin
Colborne - Wheeler - Kessel
Smith - Sobotka - Boyes

Wideman - Hamilton

Jones

Including half those names just waters down your argument IMO. And Jones was on the Bruin's roster for like 72 hours, and that was still a good trade because he'd be geting 20 games behind Rask.

 

[KasperTheGrittyGhost]

i also forgot about Colborne(has turned into a good young player), Sobotka(traded in early 20's), Dennis Wideman(was 26 at trade), and Brad Boyes(24 when traded.. put up high points)

basically if you are good young player not named Bergeron, you may be traded by the time you are 26ish!!!

David Krejci would look awfully good with centering Mantha in Detroit next year

 

[Teufelsdreck]

I can't explain why the Bruins missed the last two playoffs. Can anyone provide the basics? The only thing I can come up with was a weakened D.

 

[Mione134]

I can't explain why the Bruins missed the last two playoffs. Can anyone provide the basics? The only thing I can come up with was a weakened D.

Lack of leadership. D being weak and slow. Coaching issues. No sense of urgency or fight.

 

[Atas2000]

One thing we know for sure: one of their rejects will lift the cup this year.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

I can't explain why the Bruins missed the last two playoffs. Can anyone provide the basics? The only thing I can come up with was a weakened D.

Lack of talent, and nothing else.

 

[b in vancouver]

I can't explain why the Bruins missed the last two playoffs. Can anyone provide the basics? The only thing I can come up with was a weakened D.

Just an o.k. year from Rask. An aging Chara and Seidenberg couldn't make up for defensive shortcomings. Lots of young players.
A lack of secondary scoring really hurt them down the stretch. Bergeron, Marchand, Eriksson and Krejci carried the team all year and if they weren't lighting it up then Boston would lose.
Also the power play sputtered the last 15 games after being excellent all year.

 

[Fire Sweeney]

I can't explain why the Bruins missed the last two playoffs. Can anyone provide the basics? The only thing I can come up with was a weakened D.

Bad coaching, bad trades, bad signings. And it won't get better with the bad drafting on top of it.

 

[Number8]

Also one of the worst trades in history.

Blake Wheeler as "one of the worst trades in history"?...... No

one of the biggest overstatements in the history of HF Boards?......... Maybe.

Hard to tell. Ridiculous? Yes, absolutely. However, HF has had some truly Planet Mars comments over the years, so the bar is very very high. Regardless -- a truly excellent attempt though.

 

[BBB24]

One thing we know for sure: one of their rejects will lift the cup this year.

Same can be said for many players on both teams, they are not loaded with their own drafted players.

 

[Nucker101]

This is depressing to read as a Canucks fan. Jim Benning likely was all aboard the Seguin trade and I bet he'd take it one step further and would have traded Marchand as well if he was GM and didn't have Chiarelli and Neely above him.

 

[izzy]

Dallas in the finals next year

 

[Frank Drebin]

Tim Thomas singlehandedly winning the Bruins a Cup has seemingly validated this idiotic method of management.

But it's still idiotic. The fans of Bruins' rivals can take a lot of solace in the Niemi-like mirage winning the Cup in 2011 created for the Bruins.

How many goals did the Bruins score in the SCF? Must have been 4.

 

[HarryLime]

We can all make fun of these deals but Boston is the only team to win a cup. SJ/TOR/DAL/CGY haven't won. All 4 teams are in better shape moving forward than the Bruins though you could argue.

I understand all of the trades besides the Thornton deal tbh. Erikson was a great player and they got back other assets in the Seggy trade. It obviously is 1 sided now but compared to the Thornton deal..... I will never understand that one. I have read this thread and seen Boston ppl say it was cause Joe wasn't who they wanted to build around. Ok... That doesn't change anything. People don't criticize Boston so much for trading him, it's what they got in return that has everyone mystified 10 years later.


Also idk what the guy on page 1/2 was trolling about.... Boston was the best team in the east from 08-14 arguably. They had really good teams and could have won a 2nd cup easily if a few bounces go the other way.



As a Leafs fan the Kessel trade will always be part of out lore. I personally love Phil and enjoyed watching him play here. I am rooting for him to win a cup. The only way I can justify the deal is the same way I guess Boston fans can justify the Thoronton deal. They used Thornton's money to sign Chara. The Leafs used the Kessel trade to cement their rebuild and wouldn't have Auston Matthews had they not made the deal. Obviously both trades were bad but in a weird way they might have helped in the big picture? I really can't say.

 

[VanIsle]

Has to be the worst managed great team in a long time.

A yes or no on a HF poll would have managed this team better than current management and a lot of people wouldnt argue with that, it has been that bad.

Trades, picks, coaches, all bad.

What happened honestly?

 

[b in vancouver]

We can all make fun of these deals but Boston is the only team to win a cup. SJ/TOR/DAL/CGY haven't won. All 4 teams are in better shape moving forward than the Bruins though you could argue.

I understand all of the trades besides the Thornton deal tbh. Erikson was a great player and they got back other assets in the Seggy trade. It obviously is 1 sided now but compared to the Thornton deal..... I will never understand that one. I have read this thread and seen Boston ppl say it was cause Joe wasn't who they wanted to build around. Ok... That doesn't change anything. People don't criticize Boston so much for trading him, it's what they got in return that has everyone mystified 10 years later.


Also idk what the guy on page 1/2 was trolling about.... Boston was the best team in the east from 08-14 arguably. They had really good teams and could have won a 2nd cup easily if a few bounces go the other way.



As a Leafs fan the Kessel trade will always be part of out lore. I personally love Phil and enjoyed watching him play here. I am rooting for him to win a cup. The only way I can justify the deal is the same way I guess Boston fans can justify the Thoronton deal. They used Thornton's money to sign Chara. The Leafs used the Kessel trade to cement their rebuild and wouldn't have Auston Matthews had they not made the deal. Obviously both trades were bad but in a weird way they might have helped in the big picture? I really can't say.

That goes for most of us. And O'Connell lost his job that year.
The context though - Boston was thought to be a pretty good team that year (as was San Jose) but both teams sucked for the first few months and Thornton seemed to be coasting - or at least couldn't elevate his team. At the time there was still a lot of expectations that Brad Stuart would develop into a #1 d-man. Boston's d wasn't good at the time - and I still think OC thought he could turn the season around at the time of the trade. He did for San Jose at least. The most frustrating thing about the trade was W. Primeau. Not a bad depth player but you'd think if you're trading Thornton that along with Stuart and Sturm, you'd get a 1st and solid prospect or something.
Same issue with dealing Seguin and Peverley. Eriksson, R. Smith and J. Morrow is a solid return - but instead of M. Fraser you needed a 1st round pick or something akin.

 

[HarryLime]

That goes for most of us. And O'Connell lost his job that year.
The context though - Boston was thought to be a pretty good team that year (as was San Jose) but both teams sucked for the first few months and Thornton seemed to be coasting - or at least couldn't elevate his team. At the time there was still a lot of expectations that Brad Stuart would develop into a #1 d-man. Boston's d wasn't good at the time - and I still think OC thought he could turn the season around at the time of the trade. He did for San Jose at least. The most frustrating thing about the trade was W. Primeau. Not a bad depth player but you'd think if you're trading Thornton that along with Stuart and Sturm, you'd get a 1st and solid prospect or something.
Same issue with dealing Seguin and Peverley. Eriksson, R. Smith and J. Morrow is a solid return - but instead of M. Fraser you needed a 1st round pick or something akin.

I wonder how many teams he talked with.

 

[b in vancouver]

I wonder how many teams he talked with.

The consensus was - Not Many.
And that he was told to send him out west.
Right afterwards there were two GMs (forget whom) publicly stated they hadn't heard anything. Which might just be GM speak for 'I knew but didn't want to pay the price but have to look good in public opinion polls' or OC was just enamoured with the return of Stuart, Sturm and Primeau and couldn't imagine any team beating that offer so jumped on it before they could change their minds...
But it was a head-scratching trade for sure.

The other trades I understand. Disappointing Eriksson got concussed and that they never got better secondary pieces but I didn't mind the trade at the time so it'd be a bit hypocritical of me to slag it now in hindsight. Boston was a very very good win now team coming out of the Sequin trade - just had a crushing loss to the Habs (goalposts and Price) in the play-offs. It sucked.

The Sequin trade is exactly the kind of trade I've long thought the Oilers should do. If you have a few solid core players then trade a dollar for 4 quarters and create some depth and build an actual team.

 

[CDJ]

I can't explain why the Bruins missed the last two playoffs. Can anyone provide the basics? The only thing I can come up with was a weakened D.

Basically what you came up with. I'd use "terrible" instead of weakened though, that's just my personal preference to describe it.