Bruins Problem Children

[BruinLVGA]

They should definetly have traded Krejci. Everyone knew it back then aswell. Older, higher cap hit etc. Seguin centering the second line behind Bergeron would be the perfect thing for Boston the next 10 years. Krejci is a very good player and has had 2 great playoff runs but everyone knew Seguin would be a superstar. It came down to Bruins management disliking Seguin because he acted like a kid which we still was and because they LOVE "dirty" and "hard" grinding players like Lucic, Chara and Marchand who also have skill. Seguin didnt fit that at all, he is all speed and skill.

...says the dude in summer 2016...

Reality is that at the end of the shortened 2012-13 season, the Bruins had reached yet again the finals and Krejci, for the SECOND time in only THREE seasons, had led the whole league in playoffs points with 26 points in 22 games. And Seguin? In 22 games, he had 8 points and he was pretty much a non factor.

Factor into this that Krejci was soon due for an extension himself (he signed it in September of 2014) and the Bruins' management had a hard choice to make in the summer of 2013.
Go with a veteran center who was a top notch playoffs performer or go in a different, more uncertain direction (because Seguin had played a grand total of ONE game at center till then)? They looked at the core's age, thought that the time was NOW, knew they would get a big haul for Seguin that would strengthen that core and went for keeping the known playoffs performer. The intense partying of Seguin was just an excuse, IMO.

So, yeah, in 2016 they should have traded Krejci. Problem is that time machines have not been invented yet. In 2013, it wasn't such a surefire decision.

 

[LeafFever]

...says the dude in summer 2016...

Reality is that at the end of the shortened 2012-13 season, the Bruins had reached yet again the finals and Krejci, for the SECOND time in only THREE seasons, had led the whole league in playoffs points with 26 points in 22 games. And Seguin? In 22 games, he had 8 points and he was pretty much a non factor.

Factor into this that Krejci was soon due for an extension himself (he signed it in September of 2014) and the Bruins' management had a hard choice to make in the summer of 2013.
Go with a veteran center who was a top notch playoffs performer or go in a different, more uncertain direction (because Seguin had played a grand total of ONE game at center till then)? They looked at the core's age, thought that the time was NOW, knew they would get a big haul for Seguin that would strengthen that core and went for keeping the known playoffs performer. The intense partying of Seguin was just an excuse, IMO.

So, yeah, in 2016 they should have traded Krejci. Problem is that time machines have not been invented yet. In 2013, it wasn't such a surefire decision.

I often criticize people who have the power of hindsight. That said, in this situation, you should never trade a 21 year-old #2 overall pick who was a C. And it's not like he was a bust, he recorded 69 points at ages 19/20 in his second year. You never give up on guys like that and I think many people thought of it at the time.

 

[BruinsBtn]

I often criticize people who have the power of hindsight. That said, in this situation, you should never trade a 21 year-old #2 overall pick who was a C. And it's not like he was a bust, he recorded 69 points at ages 19/20 in his second year. You never give up on guys like that and I think many people thought of it at the time.

Meh.

Eric Staal won the Cup at the same age as Seguin and did a heck of a lot more in the regular season and playoffs. He was also a #2 pick and a centre.

They read the messageboard-genius advice to 'never give up on guys like that' and lost him for next-to-nothing.

With those magic powers of hindsight they should have traded him long ago rather than missing the playoffs in 9 of 10 years and holding on as he faded.

Hindsight is dumb. Rules are dumb.

End of the day, the Bruins parlayed the #5 pick in the 2006 draft into:
3 years of Kessel on an ELC, 3 years of Seguin on an ELC, 3 years of Hamilton on an ELC, 3 years of Loui Eriksson on a cheap contract, a 1st and two 2nds in 2015 and a few other pieces.

That's how you get a Cup, a finals appearance, and a President's trophy in a cap world.

 

[Shockmaster]

...says the dude in summer 2016...

Reality is that at the end of the shortened 2012-13 season, the Bruins had reached yet again the finals and Krejci, for the SECOND time in only THREE seasons, had led the whole league in playoffs points with 26 points in 22 games. And Seguin? In 22 games, he had 8 points and he was pretty much a non factor.

Factor into this that Krejci was soon due for an extension himself (he signed it in September of 2014) and the Bruins' management had a hard choice to make in the summer of 2013.
Go with a veteran center who was a top notch playoffs performer or go in a different, more uncertain direction (because Seguin had played a grand total of ONE game at center till then)? They looked at the core's age, thought that the time was NOW, knew they would get a big haul for Seguin that would strengthen that core and went for keeping the known playoffs performer. The intense partying of Seguin was just an excuse, IMO.

So, yeah, in 2016 they should have traded Krejci. Problem is that time machines have not been invented yet. In 2013, it wasn't such a surefire decision.

Also keep in mind that during much of the Bruins 2013 playoff run that Seguin wasn't exactly put in a position to succeed. He was the third line RW. If they wanted more out of him, they should have put him on the top line.

It also seems that Neely is a guy who wants to be right more than he wants to win.

 

[BruinsBtn]

Also keep in mind that during much of the Bruins 2013 playoff run that Seguin wasn't exactly put in a position to succeed. He was the third line RW. If they wanted more out of him, they should have put him on the top line.

It also seems that Neely is a guy who wants to be right more than he wants to win.

You're wrong. He was on a line with Bergeron and Marchand, same one he was on all year. He sucked, partied in the playoffs and got demoted but don't let that get in the way if your fantasy.

Plus, I don't care what line you're on: 1 goal in 22 games is horrid.

 

[Six Assets]

I mean the moves were bad, but the Bruins did win the cup and the Sharks/Leafs/Jets/Flames/Stars haven't, so the Bruins are technically the winners. Maybe they don't win the cup had they kept Thornton/Kessel/Wheeler.

The Seguin trade, however, can be criticized as Boston has only won one playoff round since.

 

[tony d]

I don't understand why they traded Thornton either, guy was a good player for them, their return in that deal certainly didn't help either.

 

[Gordon Lightfoot]

I don't understand why they traded Thornton either, guy was a good player for them, their return in that deal certainly didn't help either.

It's been said that they decided he was not a guy to build around, and that they built around Bergeron instead. Good decision IMO but the return was not good enough.

 

[BruinLVGA]

I often criticize people who have the power of hindsight. That said, in this situation, you should never trade a 21 year-old #2 overall pick who was a C. And it's not like he was a bust, he recorded 69 points at ages 19/20 in his second year. You never give up on guys like that and I think many people thought of it at the time.

Look at it this way: what if the Bruins had traded Krejci and Seguin had continued to regress, while Krejci would have kept up with dominant performance in the playoffs for someone else, while the Bruins wasted the last top years of their core? You bet that there would be a thread in here called "What were the Bruins thinking in trading Krejci and retaining Seguin who was already showing clear signs of regression?" or something similar...

The Seguin trade IS a classic case of hindsight is 20/20. The problem that caused all this was simple: you can't have three #1 centers in the cap era. The Bruins mmanagement's hand was forced by the fact that Krejci was in the time frame of an extension. That was what precipitated this trade, unfortunately.

The age and good performance early isn't always a perfect indicator of things to come. Example: the Oilers have been hanging onto Yakupov and his horrible production for many seasons now. I have a feeling that they have done that because... 1) he was a 1st OA...and... 2) he had that first season where he had good production and was on pace for 30 goals. That hasn't paid off AT ALL.

Also keep in mind that during much of the Bruins 2013 playoff run that Seguin wasn't exactly put in a position to succeed. He was the third line RW. If they wanted more out of him, they should have put him on the top line.

It also seems that Neely is a guy who wants to be right more than he wants to win.

Seguin was on the Marchand-Bergeron line. You are talking about a temporary demotion for off the ice problems.
At the end of the day, a 22 games playoffs run that results in 8 points, -2, it's abysmal for a top player. If Seguin had performed even remotely close to his regular season performances, that Cup wouldn't have been Chicago's.

 

[nbwingsfan]

They should definetly have traded Krejci. Everyone knew it back then aswell. Older, higher cap hit etc. Seguin centering the second line behind Bergeron would be the perfect thing for Boston the next 10 years. Krejci is a very good player and has had 2 great playoff runs but everyone knew Seguin would be a superstar. It came down to Bruins management disliking Seguin because he acted like a kid which we still was and because they LOVE "dirty" and "hard" grinding players like Lucic, Chara and Marchand who also have skill. Seguin didnt fit that at all, he is all speed and skill.

Everyone did not know it back then. Krejci just finished leading the playoffs in scoring again while Seguin had one goal. ONE.

Coupled with a very average regular season and some clear attitude issues and it made sense for them to pick Krejci instead considering they were in their cup window.

They should have found a way to keep both of them though.

 

[reffree]

There was just absolutely NO reason for that Krejci or Seguin ... It has always only be speculated by fans. Seguin never said anywhere he hated playing on the wing of Bergeron and his best buddy Marchand. Seguin could have devenitely stay as a winger, Bruins had the money to do it too. That Seguin or Krejci is just ******** by the fan.

Some of the Bruins brass didn't thought Seguin played like a Bruins should play, end of the story. For him they even got one of the best two way player in the league, someone who play like a Bruins "should".

Ironically enough, the Bruins had the best team in the league in 2014 and could have win it all and that's in spit of Seguins return being a shadow of himself after those 2 concussion. If the 2014 Eriksson play like the 2015/2016 Eriksson they could have really win it all.

But to the point, moving Seguin was a choice the organisation made because he had regress that 3rd season, the money they gave him for his excellent play in his 2nd season was about to kick in. They got scared and deal it. It's never been a choice between Krejci and Seguin. The barely millions the save between Eriksson and Seguin didn't made THAT MUCH of a difference in the end ...

And if saving 1 million was THAT MUCH important for them ... well I can see some other way to play this than trade Seguin

 

[VanIsle]

Back to the future what can one say???

Any player from any time if they play enough years will be in the finals.

Funny thing Thornton vs Kessel.

On the main board it will be Bruins are dumb and we have to take it, sadly it is what it is.

What can you say other than oh well, it happens.

 

[DonskoiDonscored]

Fans were sick of Reilly (Smith). If he wasn't scoring he was useless in every way (not unlike Hayes) and the ultimate passenger on the Bergeron line. He's turned it around in Florida.

Hayes is soft as butter for a 6-5 guy. Boston went out looking for a Lucic replacement and it hasn't worked out for them so far.

Smith of this year played like the Smith that first arrived in Boston. Patience is needed, and a lack of it ultimately ended up burning the Bruins.

There is no way that trade was "great"

 

[BruinLVGA]

There was just absolutely NO reason for that Krejci or Seguin ... It has always only be speculated by fans. Seguin never said anywhere he hated playing on the wing of Bergeron and his best buddy Marchand. Seguin could have devenitely stay as a winger, Bruins had the money to do it too. That Seguin or Krejci is just ******** by the fan.

Some of the Bruins brass didn't thought Seguin played like a Bruins should play, end of the story. For him they even got one of the best two way player in the league, someone who play like a Bruins "should".

Ironically enough, the Bruins had the best team in the league in 2014 and could have win it all and that's in spit of Seguins return being a shadow of himself after those 2 concussion. If the 2014 Eriksson play like the 2015/2016 Eriksson they could have really win it all.

But to the point, moving Seguin was a choice the organisation made because he had regress that 3rd season, the money they gave him for his excellent play in his 2nd season was about to kick in. They got scared and deal it. It's never been a choice between Krejci and Seguin. The barely millions the save between Eriksson and Seguin didn't made THAT MUCH of a difference in the end ...

And if saving 1 million was THAT MUCH important for them ... well I can see some other way to play this than trade Seguin

Maybe your memory is a bit short. We were in cap hell (or thereabouts) around that time frame, that was why Boychuk and Lucic were traded within 1-2 seasons... There's no way in hell to be able to run with three #1 centers in the cap era, that's all there is to it. Seguin staying at wing forever would have been a waste and they knew that, so that wasn't an option.
The off the ice problems with Seguin were just a cosmetic thing, to make the trade decision more palatable to the masses.

 

[varano]

i wouldn't really call thornton a problem child

the bruins just decided to build around bergeron. still one of the worst trades in NHL history though

i still don't understand why they traded seguin. don't think i ever will

Exact same reason. They wanted to build around bergeron and krejci. Go read sequins players tribune article... Its pretty honest.

 

[varano]

Maybe your memory is a bit short. We were in cap hell (or thereabouts) around that time frame, that was why Boychuk and Lucic were traded within 1-2 seasons... There's no way in hell to be able to run with three #1 centers in the cap era, that's all there is to it. Seguin staying at wing forever would have been a waste and they knew that, so that wasn't an option.
The off the ice problems with Seguin were just a cosmetic thing, to make the trade decision more palatable to the masses.

pretty much sums it up here...

"When I got traded to the Stars after only three seasons in Boston, there were a lot of articles and rumors about how I was pushed off the Bruins because I was some kind of immature, unfocused party animal. Looking back, based on the way the Bruins were situated at the center position and the realities of a salary cap system, it’s clear that the business side of hockey played a big part in why the trade happened. But that doesn’t make for a very interesting headline or Tweet."

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Gotta love all the short sightedness

First of all, Thornton was traded away because Jacobs wanted to, not because management thought it was the right move; Jacobs also apparently insisted he be traded to California because that was as far away from Boston as possible. Without that move, the Bruins never get Chara and without Chara that team doesn't go anywhere.

 

[reffree]

Maybe your memory is a bit short. We were in cap hell (or thereabouts) around that time frame, that was why Boychuk and Lucic were traded within 1-2 seasons... There's no way in hell to be able to run with three #1 centers in the cap era, that's all there is to it. Seguin staying at wing forever would have been a waste and they knew that, so that wasn't an option.
The off the ice problems with Seguin were just a cosmetic thing, to make the trade decision more palatable to the masses.

So you're trying to tell me droping Seguin 5,75M contract to bring Loui 4,25M was the 1,5M that change everyghing. Bruins could NOT have found any other way to save that 1,5M? Really?

Seguin was a winger here, so stop with the 3 #1 center non sense. And how in the world Seguin being a winger was a waste? A waste of what? Every of Seguin forte work perfectly fine at wing and every of Seguin downfall are magnify at center. There is litteraly no waste.

Edit: Nobody in there right mind can think a speedy winger good for 35 goals and 70 pts at 5,75M per year wouldn't fit good with Krejci or Bergeron on the Bruins. He was even signed for 6 more years. There was zero incertitude with his contract or how to fit they could fit him in, the grey zone was about his performance. They had to gamble. If Seguin return to his 19yo form than it's a eluva bargain, if he stay on his 20yo form, we don't want that at that price. Now he still has alot of value despite one meh season + playoff, but if they wait a couple more year to see if he rebound and he dones't, then other team too will have seen the exact same thing and his value would have drop. They took a chance, they lost.

 

[beowulf]

Meh.

Eric Staal won the Cup at the same age as Seguin and did a heck of a lot more in the regular season and playoffs. He was also a #2 pick and a centre.

They read the messageboard-genius advice to 'never give up on guys like that' and lost him for next-to-nothing.

With those magic powers of hindsight they should have traded him long ago rather than missing the playoffs in 9 of 10 years and holding on as he faded.

Hindsight is dumb. Rules are dumb.

End of the day, the Bruins parlayed the #5 pick in the 2006 draft into:
3 years of Kessel on an ELC, 3 years of Seguin on an ELC, 3 years of Hamilton on an ELC, 3 years of Loui Eriksson on a cheap contract, a 1st and two 2nds in 2015 and a few other pieces.

That's how you get a Cup, a finals appearance, and a President's trophy in a cap world.

Or that's how you make money for your owner...considering Jacobs is know to want as large a profit as possible.

 

[BruinsBtn]

Or that's how you make money for your owner...considering Jacobs is know to want as large a profit as possible.

Dumb post.

The Bruins have spent to the cap in every year it has existed.

 

[PB37]

Or that's how you make money for your owner...considering Jacobs is know to want as large a profit as possible.

As business owners do.

 

[b in vancouver]

Boston's simply had a lot of great talent over the past decade and hasn't been shy about trading so it's not surprising some of them meet in the Finals.
If it was Florida vs. LA we could talk about R. Smith vs. Lucic.
Or NYI vs. Dallas we could talk about Boychuk vs. Sequin.
Maybe next year we can see a Calgary vs. Winnipeg WCF and talk about Hamilton vs. Wheeler

That's what happens when you have a very good roster and make lots of trades. The league should just be happy there's a salary cap, retirement and injuries because the Bruins have lost Savard, Thomas, Horton, Iginla, Sequin, Hamilton, Jagr, R. Smith, Boychuk, Lucic, Wheeler, Kessel, Peverley, Recchi, Soderberg, Kaberle, etc. leave the team for one reason or another and still remain competitive. Most teams haven't had that much talent on their rosters the past few years, never mind that much leave.

Boston fans have been able to watch some of the best hockey the league has produced over the past decade so I don't think they're crying in their soup.

 

[b in vancouver]

As business owners do.

I always find it funny that people are angry that Jacobs makes money.
Don't people have jobs? Because I'm pretty sure the owner of the company you work for either makes money or you'll be looking for a new job soon.

 

[PB37]

They should definetly have traded Krejci. Everyone knew it back then aswell. Older, higher cap hit etc. Seguin centering the second line behind Bergeron would be the perfect thing for Boston the next 10 years. Krejci is a very good player and has had 2 great playoff runs but everyone knew Seguin would be a superstar. It came down to Bruins management disliking Seguin because he acted like a kid which we still was and because they LOVE "dirty" and "hard" grinding players like Lucic, Chara and Marchand who also have skill. Seguin didnt fit that at all, he is all speed and skill.

Krejci was just 27 years old, in the prime of his career, and coming off his second year of leading the league in playoff points as well as being a 65 point two way player who can play in all situations. A perfect 1B center to Bergeron's 1A. It's not as easy of a decision as you think. He's been a model Bruin.

When you look at the trades the Bruins have made, IMO it's less about the reason and more about the returns. There's valid arguments that can be made that some of the returns have been underwhelming but I think the decisions to trade Thornton ( underwhelming return ), Kessel ( lopsided return ), Seguin ( not as bad as people think but it's still leaning towards Dallas ), and Hamilton ( TBD ) all had merit and should have been done.

 

[b in vancouver]

Krejci was just 27 years old, in the prime of his career, and coming off his second year of leading the league in playoff points as well as being a 65 point two way player who can play in all situations. A perfect 1B center to Bergeron's 1A. It's not as easy of a decision as you think. He's been a model Bruin.

When you look at the trades the Bruins have made, IMO it's less about the reason and more about the returns. There's valid arguments that can be made that some of the returns have been underwhelming but I think the decisions to trade Thornton ( underwhelming return ), Kessel ( lopsided return ), Seguin ( not as bad as people think but it's still leaning towards Dallas ), and Hamilton ( TBD ) all had merit and should have been done.

People see the names and get all worked up. Boston didn't have a great year or two, but there's a lot more to icing a successful team than who makes the TSN highlights. I definitely would've liked a better return for both Seguin and Thornton but considering they won the Presidents Trophy (not all exciting but shows how good of a team they still were) after trading Sequin and losing the key piece of Eriksson to a concussion, I can't get on them too much. They had Iginla, R. Smith and Eriksson down the right side for about a $1.5M more than Sequin (whom has a great contract)
Disappointing they lost to the Habs and then these past two years.

But just because the Bruins approach to team building doesn't mesh with people's fantasy team EA sports whatever doesn't mean it's not good - because the proof's in the pudding. They've been one of the best teams in the NHL for the past decade.