News Article: Brooks speaks with Dolan.

[Off Sides]

Not sure I 100% agree here. Messier was not the most talented player. He was, however, one of the hardest workers and one willing to do ANYTHING to win. He was surrounded by far more talented players than he was. But his will drove him and the team. Which is not to say he was a talent-less player. He was just relentless.

He was super talented, maybe not in the way that he was going to juke player out of their skates, but hard work does not take a lesser talented player and put him like 8th on the all time scoring list.

 

[Hire Sather]

It's almost hard to believe this guy owns the Knicks too.

Well thought out statements that make perfect sense and gives every fan confidence moving forward.

 

[Fitzy]

Messier wouldn't last the year as coach, and neither would most of you, considering the kind of personnel/line making decisions he'd be likely to make.

 

[True Blue]

Messier wouldn't last the year as coach, and neither would most of you, considering the kind of personnel/line making decisions he'd be likely to make.

You do not know what decisions he would make. No one does. But again, no one is touting for him to be coach. This discussion started with his ability to "captain"

 

[nevesis]

You claim to be a Rangers fan, but you just called the greatest captain we've ever had (and maybe in the history of pro sports) a "cancer". This is the most insane thing I've ever read on these boards. Crazy actually. The guy delivered what we all crave. He is THE MAN period. One of the greatest players of all time and a New York Icon......and you call him a cancer. Hahahahahahahahahahah no one can/will/has ever taken you seriously but wow!!!

It’s hard to believe anyone could actually refer to Mark Messier as a cancer to the New York Rangers lockerroom.

Let alone someone who was an actual baby during the cup run.

Definitely crazy for sure.

 

[Hire Sather]

Well there are tons of reports that he was a problem in Vancouver.

 

[Nopuckluck]

I get a kick out of old school fans getting up in arms whenever someone says something about their precious Messier.

You shouldn't "get a kick out of it"!! Without Messier your team you claim to be a fan of would be the biggest laughing stock in the entire league. He is as untouchable an athlete when it comes to criticism,as there ever has been in the history of NYC and the league.

 

[Nopuckluck]

He was super talented, maybe not in the way that he was going to juke player out of their skates, but hard work does not take a lesser talented player and put him like 8th on the all time scoring list.

Try 3rd all time!!!!

 

[Off Sides]

Try 3rd all time!!!!

Yeah I was thinking goals, but all the same the point was he was pretty talented.

 

[Riche16]

Avs been the same for his entire tenure. Was McD a bad captain when he led us to the presidents trophy and am ecf berth on 1 leg? Was he a bad captain for all those deep playoff runs?

I dunno. Maybe he was. My entire point is that none of us know... you can make ANY inferences you'd like but I just disagree that anyone can be sure.

I think ppl like to badmouth players when they leave. Owners coaches everyone. I just never saw anything from McD other than being a heck of a player who always owned up and talked to the media. I saw the longest run of success for this club in my lifetine. Everything that has led to today to me isn't on McD or the leadership group as a whole..it comes down to real tangible hockey. Our system sucks. It's always sucked. Henrik Lindquist just wasn't able to God us to another deep playoff run.

I think he was a bad captain through all of that.

Now that isn’t to say that he was or is the reason those teams came up short. Nor is it to say that our system didn’t suck. Those two things aren’t mutually exclusive.

As I said, as a player McD was really really good. Maybe great. Don’t need to mince words here.

My only contention is the leadership group from AV down through the captains and alternates left something to be desired. My contention is it showed in their attitudes and on ice performance and push back. Most certainly in their lack thereof

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Don't wanna get off the rails but the evidence supporting evolution is in this thread.

It is a thing and I'm not saying don't have captains. But 1) let's not make that the problem when this team has had the worst defense for three years and 2) I don't want cancers like Messier in this room. Not as a coach or a leader. Leave him in the ground where dinosaurs belong.

Are . . . you thinking of Messier's problems in Vancouver? Because that doesn't really describe him in New York.

 

[Nopuckluck]

Are . . . you thinking of Messier's problems in Vancouver? Because that doesn't really describe him in New York.

Funny......Machinehead thinking that is!!!

 

[haveandare]

Not sure if they were totally accurate but there were wide spread reports that he was really unhappy he didn't get the coaching job instead of AV. That rubbed a lot of people the wrong way, myself included. This isn't your kid's travel team, you don't get to coach because of personal connections when you have absolutely no experience of any kind.

Having said that, yeah there's no doubt he was a tremendous player and captain for us in his time.

 

[Roo Returns]

Not sure if they were totally accurate but there were wide spread reports that he was really unhappy he didn't get the coaching job instead of AV. That rubbed a lot of people the wrong way, myself included. This isn't your kid's travel team, you don't get to coach because of personal connections when you have absolutely no experience of any kind.

Having said that, yeah there's no doubt he was a tremendous player and captain for us in his time.

This is exactly what I heard from my 5th hand sources (basically people loosely connected with the team I run into at Weddings, Briss', Christenings once every 3-4 years lol).

Love the guy for what he did as a player, but the days of teams being handed to a guy because of his career with no experience are long gone.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Not sure if they were totally accurate but there were wide spread reports that he was really unhappy he didn't get the coaching job instead of AV. That rubbed a lot of people the wrong way, myself included. This isn't your kid's travel team, you don't get to coach because of personal connections when you have absolutely no experience of any kind.

Having said that, yeah there's no doubt he was a tremendous player and captain for us in his time.

He probably was. Still doesn't explain the "cancer in the lockeroom" thing.

 

[Captain Lindy]

I get a kick out of old school fans getting up in arms whenever someone says something about their precious Messier.

Are you friggin kidding me?????? Were you even born in 1994?

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Messier wouldn't last the year as coach, and neither would most of you, considering the kind of personnel/line making decisions he'd be likely to make.

We need Iron Mike back to make Buch stay on the ice for the entire period as punishment.

 

[McRanger]

Messier is reviled in Vancouver. And rightly so, his time there was a disaster.

 

[Mac n Gs]

We need Iron Mike back to make Buch stay on the ice for the entire period as punishment.

Deep down, we all know Kovalev loved every second of that

 

[Edge]

He was super talented, maybe not in the way that he was going to juke player out of their skates, but hard work does not take a lesser talented player and put him like 8th on the all time scoring list.

It's funny, on most of his teams, I'm not sure Messier ranked higher than third in terms of natural talent or skill. He was a very good skater, but there was always guys who were more naturally gifted than him.

Even on the Rangers, you could point to guys like Leetch or Kovalev and others.

Obviously, he wasn't some slob off the street, but Messier's focus and determination was unlike almost anything I'd ever seen.

I think with time we almost tend to forget just how influential he was. IMO guys like Leetch, Richter, Amonte, Graves, etc. don't become who they are without Messier. I think they've even said as much. If Leetch is the greatest Ranger of alltime, I'd probably argue that Messier is one of, if not the most influential --- at least in the past 50 years.

 

[Machinehead]

You claim to be a Rangers fan, but you just called the greatest captain we've ever had (and maybe in the history of pro sports) a "cancer". This is the most insane thing I've ever read on these boards. Crazy actually. The guy delivered what we all crave. He is THE MAN period. One of the greatest players of all time and a New York Icon......and you call him a cancer. Hahahahahahahahahahah no one can/will/has ever taken you seriously but wow!!!

You left your bold on, caveman.

 

[Edge]

I know we try to avoid the whole "age" thing around here, but can we consider some time of self-regulating approach in which we don't comment about things that happened when we were toddlers as if we have an actual recollection of them happening?

It's one thing if we chime in from a general historical perspective, but I also see people on here who literally were learning to talk during certain time periods and are now commenting on it like they had a front row seat.

I mean I get the whole opinion thing, and sometimes we agree to disagree. But it's always interesting when it's not even based on actual experiences.

 

[Machinehead]

Are . . . you thinking of Messier's problems in Vancouver? Because that doesn't really describe him in New York.

There's first hand accounts that he would dictate what the Rangers ate, what movies they watched, and that he would physically confront them.

We all know what he did in Vancouver. We all know how personality. Does this sound like a guy that wouldn't do it in New York? Does this sound like a guy who's ever not a sociopath?

Maybe he had his place at one point. Thanks for the Cup. Don't want a personality like that in the room today. And I don't want management and ownership talking about leadership when there's five other problems to fix on the ice.

 

[Machinehead]

I know we try to avoid the whole "age" thing around here, but can we consider some time of self-regulating approach in which we don't comment about things that happened when we were toddlers as if we have an actual recollection of them happening?

It's one thing if we chime in from a general historical perspective, but I also see people on here who literally were learning to talk during certain time periods and are now commenting on it like they had a front row seat.

I mean I get the whole opinion thing, and sometimes we agree to disagree. But it's always interesting when it's not even based on actual experiences.

My opinions on Messier are based on first-hand accounts from players who played with him.

And those very actions are not denied by anyone in here. They're praised.

 

[Edge]

My opinions on Messier are based on first-hand accounts from players who played with him.

And those very actions are not denied by anyone in here. They're praised.

And I think you selectively present a very one-sided approach.

And that's coming from someone who worked with the man, and many of his teammates, over a number of years.