Post-Game Talk: Boston Leap Frogs over Us No More Wild Card Spot for Buds- 6-2 Loss to Washington

[Leviathan899]

Gardiner and Rielly both were horrible this game, didn't deserve more ice time.

 

[Gary Batman]

In a game where the winger he started with ended up with a goal and was +1, Kessel came up with -2.

Especially given what happened in past 3 days with Carlyle firing and media questioning his attitude, I thought maybe he'd give a bit more damn than usual. But nope, same old same old.

Oh well.

Polak said "We have too many guys that just want to plat offense." Why am I not surprised that the team is simply emulating it's supposedly best player and most paid one?

P.S.: Don't reply with "+/- are very unreliable stats" because his advanced stats against are downright worst in the entire NHL. Yes, even worse than the worst defenders out there.

 

[HellasLEAF]

This can't be real.

It just can't.

Clarkson should, for the team's good, decline the ice time.

"nono, that's plenty. I'm not that good".

 

[Nithoniniel]

This thread is a great example of how posters on this board chose an opinion and then try to find some arguments that fit their agenda, while not listening to a single counter-argument. Some of the posts and discussions in here are cringe-worthy, especially when the posters involved don't see it themselves.

As for the game itself, it was closer than the score indicates quite easily. I also like that we outshot them and had some periods with really good possession. I don't agree with Hory that we outchanced them though, thought the quality of chances were in their favor.

A slightly positive step. Main takeaway is the continued sub-par performances by our core group for example. Any kind of success hinges on these guys, and them not stepping up says more for the future than the decreased shots against in my opinion.

A lot of comments about JVR. I think he didn't get going offensively tonight but he battled for pucks, hustled and played better defensively than he's done on average this season. It was interesting to see all that go away the second the usual first line was put together again.

 

[X66]

Dumb mistakes, but build off of outshooting an opponent 32-22 at even strength. No one said it was going to be an easy fix, but just keep outshooting opponents and limiting their even strength shots.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

I wonder how many teams we can catch?
Below us, I mean.

If we are McTanking, it will be tough to catch teams like Edmonton & Carolina.

 

[Wami]

Positive Corsi relates to long term success. If they continue to keep shots against low, I will have hope for our team. There is a silver lining here.

 

[crump]

Reward the only players with heart with a 3 month vacation somewhere warm. Increase certain players ice time, where are are McLaren and Orr? Call them up. i believe this team can reach that lottery spot.

 

[Cor]

Heh. No Longer in a playoff spot.

 

[YOYOTCROSTER*]

Folks when you get 6 goals scored against you by Washington there are many many problems to fix. Media seems fixated on the core now. Stupid media. The main issues with Leafs are lack of NHL quality defensive defencemen. Polak is all they got. Phaneuf is nhl average folks at best. Overall Phaneuf is a 3 or 4 defence because he brings some offence but pure defence play he is at best average. The rest of defence should be in the AHL at best. Franson can't keep up to nhl speed. Rielly is too small constantly knocked off puck in his own end and physical play non existent. Gardiner has no idea what he is doing wrt hockey sense and physical play non existent. Robidas is strictly a positional skater who never was a good defence in nhl at his best. Holzer is ahl player but he gives it all he has. With that group there is not a snow balls chance in hell of making the playoffs. I do not care if GOD coached that group it will NEVER happen.

 

[ldnk]

Folks when you get 6 goals scored against you by Washington there are many many problems to fix. Media seems fixated on the core now. Stupid media. The main issues with Leafs are lack of NHL quality defensive defencemen. Polak is all they got. Phaneuf is nhl average folks at best. Overall Phaneuf is a 3 or 4 defence because he brings some offence but pure defence play he is at best average. The rest of defence should be in the AHL at best. Franson can't keep up to nhl speed. Rielly is too small constantly knocked off puck in his own end and physical play non existent. Gardiner has no idea what he is doing wrt hockey sense and physical play non existent. Robidas is strictly a positional skater who never was a good defence in nhl at his best. Holzer is ahl player but he gives it all he has. With that group there is not a snow balls chance in hell of making the playoffs. I do not care if GOD coached that group it will NEVER happen.

Polak is NOT a better defensive player than Phaneuf. Being physical does not equate to being good defensively.

 

[FerrisRox]

With the ample criticism I've seen Kessel getting lately, and even Phaneuf to an extent. I've barely seen Bozak mentioned whatsoever, he's been TERRIBLE for awhile now.

6 points in his last 16 games and -8 (probably putrid corsi as per usual as well) while getting all of the premium offensive minutes including top-line PP and the works.

Look on the bright side, at least his recent funk has killed off embarrassing threads like the one where some fans here argued he should be at the All Star game.

 

[Mess]

This can't be real.

It just can't.

Clarkson should, for the team's good, decline the ice time.

"nono, that's plenty. I'm not that good".

David Clarkson only got 15 shifts and 11:08 TOI/6 which was the 3rd lowest on the team, with only Sam Carrick 2:53 and David Booth 10:17 getting less.

 

[Erdinger]

David Clarkson only got 15 shifts and 11:08 TOI/6 which was the 3rd lowest on the team, with only Sam Carrick 2:53 and David Booth 10:17 getting less.

I thought Clarkson was very noticeable when he was on the ice. For all the wrong reasons as usual.

 

[SprDaVE]

I don't think the score should have been that bad. We played decently, but there were a lot of bad turnovers which led directly to goals. I don't think we played good enough to win though in the end.

Playing Carrick under 4 minutes is just completely idiotic and pathetic. I expected better from Spott and Horachek, but more importantly from Staois as the player development guy.

 

[Mess]

Positive Corsi relates to long term success. If they continue to keep shots against low, I will have hope for our team. There is a silver lining here.

Leafs did win he shot clock battle in this one.

In terms of YTD Corsi CF% there was also a slight improvement, as they began the evening tied with Calgary at 44.5 possession @29th overall, and finished the evening in 28th spot tied with Colorado with 44.8 CF%.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/teamstats.php?disp=1&db=201415&sit=5v5&sort=CFPCT&sortdir=DESC

As they say baby steps but as long as your trending in a positive direction then improvement is being shown. They kept the shot against totals below 30 when they average 35 on a regular night. They are still in 29th overall in that category but Rome wasn't built in a day either.






.

 

[zoA]

Folks when you get 6 goals scored against you by Washington there are many many problems to fix. Media seems fixated on the core now. Stupid media. The main issues with Leafs are lack of NHL quality defensive defencemen. Polak is all they got. Phaneuf is nhl average folks at best. Overall Phaneuf is a 3 or 4 defence because he brings some offence but pure defence play he is at best average. The rest of defence should be in the AHL at best. Franson can't keep up to nhl speed. Rielly is too small constantly knocked off puck in his own end and physical play non existent. Gardiner has no idea what he is doing wrt hockey sense and physical play non existent. Robidas is strictly a positional skater who never was a good defence in nhl at his best. Holzer is ahl player but he gives it all he has. With that group there is not a snow balls chance in hell of making the playoffs. I do not care if GOD coached that group it will NEVER happen.

Folks, it's time to listen to this guy. Let me just tell you folks, Phaneuf is clearly a 3 or 4, alright folks. Give me a second to explain my reasoning folks. Polak is tough as nails and he hits everything, he's one of the good folks. Starting to understand now folks? Folks? Folks folks folks?

Can we save posts like this for radio show call-in hours?

I saw a lot of positives in the game, but the idea of work ethic in the defensive zone still alludes many of our players. We have the talent to make the playoffs, but the work ethic and drive definitely seem to be lacking. I understand when a particular style of play is deceiving -- Sundin never looked like he was going balls to the wall, but he was a horse -- but many of our players look like they're conserving energy on a nightly basis.

 

[Standardly]

Kessel could have had a conn smyth and a cup ring, however, Boston felt he was expendable- which tells you something. Anyhow, the comparison between the 2 players is ridiculous. It's so typical of leaf fans to glorify their players. Kane has done it. You can only dream when it comes to kessel.

Also, there's benefits of being the lone-standing big scorer on a team. When there's lots of depth, pp time gets spread around etc. look at L.A and boston. They never have players with massive production.

Lastly, imagine Kane playing loosey goosey pond hockey vs eastern conference competition. I seriously think he'd finish the season as the art ross winner or runner up

 

[Trapper]

Leafs did win he shot clock battle in this one.

In terms of YTD Corsi CF% there was also a slight improvement, as they began the evening tied with Calgary at 44.5 possession @29th overall, and finished the evening in 28th spot tied with Colorado with 44.8 CF%.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/teamstats.php?disp=1&db=201415&sit=5v5&sort=CFPCT&sortdir=DESC

As they say baby steps but as long as your trending in a positive direction then improvement is being shown. They kept the shot against totals below 30 when they average 35 on a regular night. They are still in 29th overall in that category but Rome wasn't built in a day either.






.

I believe the advanced stats will improve (how could they not) under Horachek but in terms of the other things that advanced stats don't measure, compete, attention to details, commit to defense, consistency, well I don't see it with this core.
I've watched them to long to know if they improve one way, they will find another way to let it slip away. We just haven't got to what that is yet.
You can't win every games but there are certain games you can't lose.
You can't score (or be on) every night in 82 games but there are certain games that the core has to carry the team. It doesn't happen. As a team, I still believe we need to purge the Burke core.
Unless people think this core can with the Cup someday.
If a new coach and Polak coming back from a puck in the face didn't inspire certain players to go through the wall, nothing wil.

 

[Mess]

Folks when you get 6 goals scored against you by Washington there are many many problems to fix. Media seems fixated on the core now. Stupid media. The main issues with Leafs are lack of NHL quality defensive defencemen. Polak is all they got. Phaneuf is nhl average folks at best. Overall Phaneuf is a 3 or 4 defence because he brings some offence but pure defence play he is at best average. The rest of defence should be in the AHL at best. Franson can't keep up to nhl speed. Rielly is too small constantly knocked off puck in his own end and physical play non existent. Gardiner has no idea what he is doing wrt hockey sense and physical play non existent. Robidas is strictly a positional skater who never was a good defence in nhl at his best. Holzer is ahl player but he gives it all he has. With that group there is not a snow balls chance in hell of making the playoffs. I do not care if GOD coached that group it will NEVER happen.

Folks, it's time to listen to this guy. Let me just tell you folks, Phaneuf is clearly a 3 or 4, alright folks. Give me a second to explain my reasoning folks. Polak is tough as nails and he hits everything, he's one of the good folks. Starting to understand now folks? Folks? Folks folks folks?

FYI

If you take the 187 NHL dmen that are regulars in the NHL (300 minutes played) and sort them by goals against for 60 minutes (GA60) then Roman Polak ends up 8th (worst) of 187 players giving up 3.27 goals against at 5v5 even strength.

Only 7 NHL Dmen are on the ice for more goals against / 60 minutes this year than Roman.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...300&teamid=0&type=goals&sort=A60&sortdir=DESC

PS. Cody Franson (17th) and Jake Gardiner (18th) are also in the top 20 overall with most goals against at ES 5v5. 3 Dmen in the top 20 is not good.

Rielly (39th) and Phaneuf (54) are not too far behind.

 

[ironhorse384]

Kessel could have had a conn smyth and a cup ring, however, Boston felt he was expendable- which tells you something. Anyhow, the comparison between the 2 players is ridiculous. It's so typical of leaf fans to glorify their players. Kane has done it. You can only dream when it comes to kessel.

Also, there's benefits of being the lone-standing big scorer on a team. When there's lots of depth, pp time gets spread around etc. look at L.A and boston. They never have players with massive production.

Lastly, imagine Kane playing loosey goosey pond hockey vs eastern conference competition. I seriously think he'd finish the season as the art ross winner or runner up

The bruins wanted to resign Kessel but they were up against the cap so the leaf deal helped them immensely by guaranteeing future prospects. The leafs being a bottom feeding team Chiarelli had to figure that the odds were good that the picks would be high. Burke gambled that the leafs would be a playoff team and the picks would be low.

 

[ACC1224]

Ignoring that one of those goals is a empty net goal?

and wasn't the other a result of Reilly's brain dead play?

 

[ACC1224]

Been to about 200 games the last 15 years, have had season tickets for the last 3 seasons and I've never been to a more subdued crowd at a sporting event as saw this evening. I was at the Nashville collapse, it was almost comical and the fans almost started to enjoy it because it was the beginning of the end of this season, or so it felt like.

I was at the Boston game 7 collapse and it was more shock and awe than anything else.

Tonight my wife and I went in to the game and right from the pre games and National anthems something was really off with the people here tonight. Even Max Domi after the biggest win of his young career looks like he did not give a ****, hands in his pockets.

I cannot describe the atmosphere as anything other than subdued, to say it was dead would be incorrect as people we talking to each other and not paying attention to the game.

After the first period, we went for a coffee and then as we made it back for the second period we were waiting in the tunnel and my wife looked at me and asked of I wanted to go to Longos then leave as it just did not feel right to be there, it felt so "off" it was cringe worthy. I sit in section 110 row 10 and it was so quiet i could hear Phaneuf talking with his inside voice to Kessel before a face-off as if he was right beside me.

We left 1 minute into the 2nd period, I will always be a life long fan, ive got 30 years invested in this team but its just so disappointing to be stuck on this treadmill.

sorry for the formatting sent this from my phone.

Have to admit, it was certainly one of the quieter nights in the building.
I sit 2nd last row up top(row 17) and I can hear lots of talk on the ice. Combination of quiet building and good acoustics.

It seemed to me the place was ready to get into it twice after Leaf goals but then they gave it right back, was really deflating espiecially the short handed goal.

 

[Rogie]

While I saw some of the same old same old bad habits, I take some positive from the advanced stat line.

We outcorsided them overall and 5on5 overall. We outcorsied them when the game was within 1 goal. We didn't outcorsie them 5on5 close though - it was 25 to 20 for the Caps for 5on5Close. But, still, the Caps have played very strong possession hockey of late and to have even these numbers was a big improvement.

Further, look at Kessel, Bozak, and JVR. All 3 of them were +Corsis in most of the score situations AND maybe more importantly, they were all closer to the better Corsi players on the team than the worst Corsi players; which is what they have often been. Komarov I think had the worst Corsi in most situations and he's kind of the last player for me worry about in terms of his Corsi.

As to why Coach put that line back together at the end was puzzling. Maybe, it was to have a record for Dubas and Shanahan (maybe this was his instruction), and so there is something to compare. All the fancy charts and graphs are going to show, see, when you guys were split up you all were having plus shot differentials and here you are back together in the 3rd and your shot differential drops way down again. Maybe there was some other reason, but, that one occurs to me - maybe I"m stretching.

Anyways, when I saw Winnick/Kadri/Kessel together I thought - OKAY, now we are doing something DIFFERENT!!!!!!

I also agreed with most of what Coach said in his presser, there were some tough goals - really - the one off of Franson's stick was just bad luck. I do think think the game was closer than the score. Take away the empty netter and that goal and it's really more indicative of the game - imo.

Mess mentioned in the post game they would have some extra adrenaline from new coach and all that's gone on and I thought about that and (for the prediction thread) and went with the idea that for some reason they were going to play nervous and it seemed like it wasn't quite the right kind of nervous energy or else they couldn't channel it.

I still think that those Caps are a good team and while, again, I saw some bad habits (yeah, the line change etc), but, still, all in all, I saw some hope there as well.

 

[wmark]

David Clarkson only got 15 shifts and 11:08 TOI/6 which was the 3rd lowest on the team, with only Sam Carrick 2:53 and David Booth 10:17 getting less.

11 mins is too much for Clarkson.

I'd like to see him in the press box.