GDT: Blues vs. Sharks| 7pm, FSMW| First Home Game in 10 Months

[Majorityof1]

Yes our D are absolutely roaming too far in the defensive zone. If you see me use the term squirrel to describe any of them, that is essentially what I mean. Scandella, Faulk, Krug and Dunn have all been guilty of doing that with some frequency so far. It is opening seems all across the front of the net / the Royal Road. This is one of the last things I want to see from a defensive unit.

Thanks for affirming that. I have even seen Parayko doing this, so I think it may be a coaching thing. Parayko is less likely to get burned doing so though because of his mobility and reach. Krug honestly has also done a decent job clearing the net to cover on times he didn't. I completely agree though, it is one of the last things I want to see from any of our D, especially on the PK.

 

[KirkOut]

Put me in the camp of being super worried about our D. They have not inspired confidence at all in our own end. I have a feeling this is gonna be an ugly year for our goalies' GAA

 

[Blueston]

You do realize he played hockey before the Blues, right? I've watched Faulk in a 100 games. My best friend lives in Carolina. We go to games when I visit, and I watch them whenever I get the chance. But because you think he has been good the past 3 games (since the bubble), I should completely reevaluate my opinion? No thanks. I'll stick to what I think based on seeing a whole heck of a lot more than you seem to have.

I am completely capable of changing my mind if someone shows me something worth changing it for. I was pretty hard on Kyrou when he was in juniors but I have admitted to being wrong in this very thread. So why would I be willing to change my mind on one player but be so adamant on Faulk? Maybe I just still do not like what I see.

Makes one question what you are doing when you are at the games because you don't appear to understand what you saw.

 

[GoldenSeal]

So is Kyrou the real deal? 3 games and 2 GWG? Still too small of a sample size to say for certain but he's got my hopes up..

He has skills, speed, is hungry and determined. He just has to stay in that mindset and if he does, yes. Yes he is.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Makes one question what you are doing when you are at the games because you don't appear to understand what you saw.

I wish I had kept a list over the years of even just Blues prospects who looked fantastic for the Blues for 3 games and people went nuts raving about them, and by season's end those opinions had swung to the opposite side of the pendulum. Hell, I kind of want to go find the Chicago thread from a couple years back where Schmaltz had a (one) assist and people were ready to ink him into at least the 2nd PP unit for seasons to come.

[I really wish I had a list of all the Blues prospects who were handed top-9 / top-4 spots by people before playing their first NHL game, or in some cases even before playing their first pro game, and who proceeded to show why such acclimations were wildly overdone. Want a perfect example? Brett Sonne, the 20-year old who won WHL Player of the Year honors and untold numbers of people had him in the top-6 on this team for the next 15 years, including a couple people I can distinctly recall who were ready to put him on the 2nd line straight out of the WHL for the 2009-10 season.]

Faulk has looked good for 3 games. Awesome. The fact is, 3 games this season doesn't erase the stink of last season. Not yet. There's a lot more good play needed to erase that stink. Let's see if he can keep this up. If he can, people will recognize it and admit it. If he can't, these first 3 games will be a distant memory.

 

[Blueston]

I wish I had kept a list over the years of even just Blues prospects who looked fantastic for the Blues for 3 games and people went nuts raving about them, and by season's end those opinions had swung to the opposite side of the pendulum. Hell, I kind of want to go find the Chicago thread from a couple years back where Schmaltz had a (one) assist and people were ready to ink him into at least the 2nd PP unit for seasons to come.

[I really wish I had a list of all the Blues prospects who were handed top-9 / top-4 spots by people before playing their first NHL game, or in some cases even before playing their first pro game, and who proceeded to show why such acclimations were wildly overdone. Want a perfect example? Brett Sonne, the 20-year old who won WHL Player of the Year honors and untold numbers of people had him in the top-6 on this team for the next 15 years, including a couple people I can distinctly recall who were ready to put him on the 2nd line straight out of the WHL for the 2009-10 season.]

Faulk has looked good for 3 games. Awesome. The fact is, 3 games this season doesn't erase the stink of last season. Not yet. There's a lot more good play needed to erase that stink. Let's see if he can keep this up. If he can, people will recognize it and admit it. If he can't, these first 3 games will be a distant memory.

It’s not the 3 games. Point is last season was aberration. New system, no defined role, he never got comfortable. This year is much more like how he has played his entire career. But many of y’all already made your minds up and refuse to admit that he is actually good.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

If Faulk is solid this season, I couldn’t really care less about what he’s done historically. He struggled to adapt last season, and we’ve dissected reasons for that exhaustively. A good start to the season for him is a GOOD THING. Time will tell if it’s an aberration or a better baseline.

That goal just after the penalty expired last night sure was pretty.

 

[Stealth JD]

It's almost like Faulk was (fairly) criticized last year because he stunk; and he's been (fairly) applauded for playing much better this season. Maybe instead of wondering where the 'haters' went, it's possible to correlate the temperature of the fan-base with a guy's performance and realize that he's been treated appropriately all along. If he continues to improve, the bashing will diminish further. And if he starts playing like trash again, the criticism will return. The narrative that a certain portion of the fanbase hates the guy for no reason is absurd.

...but he's got a long way to go to prove that the first 60-games of his Blues career were the exception and not the norm.

 

[Reality Czech]

It's 3 games, and already there's a lot of hot takes that will probably be revised in about 25 or so games. Here's my $0.02 on last night:

* The fact that we came out supposedly pissed off about Friday night in Colorado and largely slept through the 1st period and went into the break down 2-0 (meaning across the prior 3 periods we'd been outscored 10-0), ... disconcerting. An elite-caliber team cannot have that kind of lack of effort, even if it's against a supposedly-lousy team like San Jose. That was inexcusable.
* The PK ... well, it's beating a dead horse and yes I know we're missing the 3 guys who were with this team all of last year that had the most PK time + Pietrangelo who was 7th, but JFC guys it's like some of them have never PK'd a day in their life. Yeah, this is partly "every mistake is ending up in the back of the net" but this is also partly just lack of awareness. No, I don't expect our PK to churn along at 42.9% all year but at this rate getting to 75% for the season would feel like a major accomplishment.
* ES, we can be a beast. Will that keep up? Until special teams kick in, it's going to have to. Even so, through 3 games we're +4.
* We need the Binnington from 2019 back. The sooner, the better. Yeah, a swath of goals he's given up aren't on him - but those are goals he still found ways to make saves on in the past.
* Thomas needs guys to finish his passes.
* Kyrou's speed is undeniable. At some point, teams are going to start keying on him; what does he do then to get himself into position to make plays and score goals? Don't need an answer here, but something to think about.
* Dunn. Go sit in the press box and think about it for a game.

Bottom line: I don't know a 5-4 win like we did it last night is necessarily a cause for celebration, but we got 2 points so that's a plus. Lots to work on, we need 2 from the next game as well - and ideally, a hotter fire in guys bellies from the very start.

Good points, although I agree with Blueston that we did come out pretty strong at the beginning. We were controlling the game and had plenty of chances, but couldn't cash in. Then you could almost feel the Sharks first goal coming, which was one of their first scoring chances of the game. So I won't knock them for effort, and at least they responded well after going down 2-0. It was a sloppy win and we will dominate teams like SJ if we can tighten up the PK and overall defensive play.

I don't have much to add to the other points. It's great to see Kyrou put it all together. He's playing a lot more asserively and clearly isn't afraid to shoot. Chief is still limiting his ice time as we'd expect, but he looks a lot better than he did last year. And he's bailed out our veteran scorers, who have had trouble finding the net so far.

Binnington has just looked average so far, and yes we will need him to step it up if we have any hopes of going to the Finals again. But after re-watching the highlights I can't fault him for any of the goals from last night. There was one deflection, two goals from guys left wide open and then the Couture bank-in. If the team performs as well as it can defensively then I bet Binner will start looking a lot better as well.

The main question going forward is which top 9 combination will stick. Do they leave Thomas on the 3rd line with Hoffman and Bozak? In theory last night's lineup might be the most balanced way to do it, but I also want to maximize Thomas' abilities. He wasn't as noticeable in last night's game as he was on opening night.

I agree, let Dunn sit for a game and let's see what Mikkola can do.

 

[BlueMed]

You do realize he played hockey before the Blues, right? I've watched Faulk in a 100 games. My best friend lives in Carolina. We go to games when I visit, and I watch them whenever I get the chance. But because you think he has been good the past 3 games (since the bubble), I should completely reevaluate my opinion? No thanks. I'll stick to what I think based on seeing a whole heck of a lot more than you seem to have.

I am completely capable of changing my mind if someone shows me something worth changing it for. I was pretty hard on Kyrou when he was in juniors but I have admitted to being wrong in this very thread. So why would I be willing to change my mind on one player but be so adamant on Faulk? Maybe I just still do not like what I see.

Chill, dude. Faulk is a second pairing D man for us...

 

[KirkOut]

Chill, dude. Faulk is a second pairing D man for us...

well then why did we pay him 1st pairing money

 

[Ranksu]

You do realize he played hockey before the Blues, right? I've watched Faulk in a 100 games. My best friend lives in Carolina. We go to games when I visit, and I watch them whenever I get the chance. But because you think he has been good the past 3 games (since the bubble), I should completely reevaluate my opinion? No thanks. I'll stick to what I think based on seeing a whole heck of a lot more than you seem to have.

I am completely capable of changing my mind if someone shows me something worth changing it for. I was pretty hard on Kyrou when he was in juniors but I have admitted to being wrong in this very thread. So why would I be willing to change my mind on one player but be so adamant on Faulk? Maybe I just still do not like what I see.

Makes one question what you are doing when you are at the games because you don't appear to understand what you saw.

 

[Falco Lombardi]

I kinda feel like results like last night should be expected. We chose to sacrifice defense to add offense this offseason.

Granted the penalty kill is worse than anyone could have expected

 

[BlueMed]

well then why did we pay him 1st pairing money

Because he provides good offense from the backend. He's a 3 time all star for a reason.

 

[rumrokh]

It's 3 games, and already there's a lot of hot takes that will probably be revised in about 25 or so games. Here's my $0.02 on last night:

* The fact that we came out supposedly pissed off about Friday night in Colorado and largely slept through the 1st period and went into the break down 2-0 (meaning across the prior 3 periods we'd been outscored 10-0), ... disconcerting. An elite-caliber team cannot have that kind of lack of effort, even if it's against a supposedly-lousy team like San Jose. That was inexcusable.
* The PK ... well, it's beating a dead horse and yes I know we're missing the 3 guys who were with this team all of last year that had the most PK time + Pietrangelo who was 7th, but JFC guys it's like some of them have never PK'd a day in their life. Yeah, this is partly "every mistake is ending up in the back of the net" but this is also partly just lack of awareness. No, I don't expect our PK to churn along at 42.9% all year but at this rate getting to 75% for the season would feel like a major accomplishment.
* ES, we can be a beast. Will that keep up? Until special teams kick in, it's going to have to. Even so, through 3 games we're +4.
* We need the Binnington from 2019 back. The sooner, the better. Yeah, a swath of goals he's given up aren't on him - but those are goals he still found ways to make saves on in the past.
* Thomas needs guys to finish his passes.
* Kyrou's speed is undeniable. At some point, teams are going to start keying on him; what does he do then to get himself into position to make plays and score goals? Don't need an answer here, but something to think about.
* Dunn. Go sit in the press box and think about it for a game.

Bottom line: I don't know a 5-4 win like we did it last night is necessarily a cause for celebration, but we got 2 points so that's a plus. Lots to work on, we need 2 from the next game as well - and ideally, a hotter fire in guys bellies from the very start.

The Blues dominated play in the first period, the difference was special teams. In fact, they dominated play through the entire game. No surprise, the Sharks are bad, but they got a lot of shots from the slot and the Sharks got approximately zero. "Cause for celebration" is relative, but when the Blues play inside and the other team cannot, that's a good thing.

It was sloppier than we're used to seeing when the Blues are on, but the overall performance was better than a 5-4 result. If they can get the special teams back on track, we'll see scores more representative of that.

 

[Majorityof1]

Because he provides good offense from the backend. He's a 3 time all star for a reason.

He's a 3 time all star because the NHL used to try to get a player from every team on the All-star roster, and he was the only option for Carolina.

Makes one question what you are doing when you are at the games because you don't appear to understand what you saw.

I am so happy you think so. It's when the people I respect the least start to agree with me that I will question myself.

 

[Brian39]

I was keeping up with the first 10 or so pages of this GDT last night before I remembered why I usually avoid them and just post the next day. Yikes.

I strongly disagree with the notion that the 1st period was a bad response after Friday's embarrassment. We dominated the 1st period at even strength. We were above 60% in every possession/quality metric. We did come out firing on all cylinders, but we couldn't solve Dubnyk. Our special teams were awful again in the 1st period (0/2 on the PP and allowed a goal on our only kill), but special teams isn't at all a measure of heart, determination, resiliency, etc. You can get moments of those things on a PK, but the overall structure of a PK has nothing to do with those things. And our structure is garbage. We were down 2-0 on a PP goal and a deflection in the high slot that drastically changed direction. However, shots were 12-5 at 5 on 5, high danger chances were 6-0 at 5 on 5 and scoring chances were 11-6 at 5 on 5. And it isn't like we were just burying chances into Dubnyk's chest. He made a number of very good saves on shots that were labeled.

The PK has been garbage. It obviously won't be this bad all year (43% is pretty much the definition of unsustainable), but the eye test is really bad. The PK was my greatest concern this year and I'm more worried today than I was a week ago. Faulk has been our 2nd best penalty killer this year and while I have been happy with his play so far this year, that is a huge issue.

We were once again dominant at 5 on 5:

Given the construction of our blue line, this might be the Blues this year: dominate possession and chances, but have 5 or so catastrophic breakdowns that hang Binner completely out to dry. I'm not making my mind up 3 games into the year, but so far we haven't done anything to ease my mind on my 3 biggest pre-season concerns (PK, in-zone defending and Binner's ability to be more than a "get square and stop the first shot" goalie). The upside is that so far we have been able to outscore our problems in 2 of 3 games. That appeared to be the formula given the roster construction, so you have to acknowledge that scoring 4+ in two of three games is a great start to that.

 

[Blueston]

I am so happy you think so. It's when the people I respect the least start to agree with me that I will question myself.

Glad to hear that. If someone with such consistently bad takes thought highly of me I would be worried.

 

[DatDude44]

I was keeping up with the first 10 or so pages of this GDT last night before I remembered why I usually avoid them and just post the next day. Yikes.

I strongly disagree with the notion that the 1st period was a bad response after Friday's embarrassment. We dominated the 1st period at even strength. We were above 60% in every possession/quality metric. We did come out firing on all cylinders, but we couldn't solve Dubnyk. Our special teams were awful again in the 1st period (0/2 on the PP and allowed a goal on our only kill), but special teams isn't at all a measure of heart, determination, resiliency, etc. You can get moments of those things on a PK, but the overall structure of a PK has nothing to do with those things. And our structure is garbage. We were down 2-0 on a PP goal and a deflection in the high slot that drastically changed direction. However, shots were 12-5 at 5 on 5, high danger chances were 6-0 at 5 on 5 and scoring chances were 11-6 at 5 on 5. And it isn't like we were just burying chances into Dubnyk's chest. He made a number of very good saves on shots that were labeled.

The PK has been garbage. It obviously won't be this bad all year (43% is pretty much the definition of unsustainable), but the eye test is really bad. The PK was my greatest concern this year and I'm more worried today than I was a week ago. Faulk has been our 2nd best penalty killer this year and while I have been happy with his play so far this year, that is a huge issue.

We were once again dominant at 5 on 5:

Given the construction of our blue line, this might be the Blues this year: dominate possession and chances, but have 5 or so catastrophic breakdowns that hang Binner completely out to dry. I'm not making my mind up 3 games into the year, but so far we haven't done anything to ease my mind on my 3 biggest pre-season concerns (PK, in-zone defending and Binner's ability to be more than a "get square and stop the first shot" goalie). The upside is that so far we have been able to outscore our problems in 2 of 3 games. That appeared to be the formula given the roster construction, so you have to acknowledge that scoring 4+ in two of three games is a great start to that.

Thank you for posting this, my eye test and our structure told me we were dominant at 5v5, they had a lucky deflection that ROR probably wishes he had stepped and picked up labancs stick on, they had a nice PPG, a lucky PPG off on entry when our wedge(F1) did a terrible job of angling on our 1-3 Neutral zone forecheck and then the late bounce couture scored on, otherwise i thought we were by far the better team and dominant at 5v5. Kyrou and faulks play so far gets me excited as I though faulk was an embarassement last year and I still question his hockey IQ a bit but he's looked 10X better so far this year and comfortable on his right side. Thomas has looked good at times and i'm excited to see what a goal scorer like hoffman can do once he gets goin a bit. (hated his decision making on the PP so far)

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

He's a 3 time all star because the NHL used to try to get a player from every team on the All-star roster, and he was the only option for Carolina.



I am so happy you think so. It's when the people I respect the least start to agree with me that I will question myself.

I applaud this approach. Couldn't agree more.

 

[GoldenSeal]

It's almost like Faulk was (fairly) criticized last year because he stunk; and he's been (fairly) applauded for playing much better this season. Maybe instead of wondering where the 'haters' went, it's possible to correlate the temperature of the fan-base with a guy's performance and realize that he's been treated appropriately all along. If he continues to improve, the bashing will diminish further. And if he starts playing like trash again, the criticism will return. The narrative that a certain portion of the fanbase hates the guy for no reason is absurd.

...but he's got a long way to go to prove that the first 60-games of his Blues career were the exception and not the norm.

Thank you.

 

[Brian39]

I don't want to belabor the Faulk point too much, but here are my general thoughts on Faulk (and the general consensus around him)

No current Blues D man has played better than Faulk since the playoff bubble began. That is a damn small sample size and I'm about 95% sure Parayko had COVID in the summer so his mediocre playoffs is of zero long-term concern to me. Parayko has been better in the 3 games so far this season, but I'd put Faulk as our 2nd best D man over those 3 games. I don't believe that will continue, but if he continues his currently level of play than he will be pretty far down my list of concerns.

It seems that the people who don't like Faulk are interpreting conversation about his strong play as people saying that he has for sure turned a corner, will be worth the money for all 7 years and should absolutely be protected from Seattle. It also seems like there are a number of people that seem to think that the last 10-15 games of his are who he truly is and that everything else doesn't need to be considered. This forum is going to be a dumpster fire for the next 4 months if the current vitriol around Faulk doesn't cool off.

I read posts blaming him on goal #1 because he screened Binner. The reality of that goal is that Faulk did not plant in front of Binner. He moved in front of Binner's sight line in the process of bodying out a SJ player who was planting in front of Binner. This happened well after the release of the initial shot and I'm really not sure what you would want Faulk to have done here. Additionally, Binner tracked the initial shot and was beaten not from a screen but because a deflection. When the shot is taken, Binner is looking to the right of the Sharks' player and Faulk is on that player's left side:

Faulk crosses Binner's line of site to clear the Sharks player out of the way, but to put that goal on Faulk for a screen is an large nitpick. It was a great tip on a very well-delivered point shot through traffic. It doesn't have to be anyone's fault and I'm not sure what any D man would have done differently. This place would be losing their minds if Faulk just allowed the Sharks player to screen Binner instead of making a play to clear him out.

On their 3rd goal, Faulk steps up to deliver a hit just inside our blue line on a zone entry while we are short. He stays on his feet and this is the position of everyone on the ice a second or so later:

Gunnar then inexplicably leaves the slot to go toward the corner and make a non-committal play towards a puck carrier who is largely still covered by Faulk.

The pass gets through Gunnar and Burns is wide open in front.

We're blaming Faulk for that? He was a step behind Kane, but was close enough that he had forced Kane into the very corner of the ice. He had clear body position to take the body on Kane if he drove to the net, so the only consequence of his hit near the blue line is that a SJ player had possession below the goal line.

These are absolutely ridiculous critiques to claim that his defensive gaffes almost negated his 2 goals, 8 shots and +2 rating for the night. Faulk was no defensive stud last night and his tendency to chase guys to the boards and subsequently lose a board battle is irritating. But if these are the types of plays we are bringing up to demonstrate how terrible he is, then we are judging a player for his contract and/or reputation.

 

[Mike Liut]

Kyrou could have had 5-6 goals last night.

Breakaway in the 2nd where he was poke checked by Doob
The one where Doob tackled him
Hit the post
Wide open and he drop passed to Faulk
2 on 1 with Schenn and was wide open
Another breakaway and Doob made a pad save
His goal

He was all over the place

 

[Stelmacki]

Put me in the camp of being super worried about our D. They have not inspired confidence at all in our own end. I have a feeling this is gonna be an ugly year for our goalies' GAA

I would be in the same boat, but I’m going to keep reminding myself that there was no preseason for next 3-4 games.

 

[Falco Lombardi]

I was keeping up with the first 10 or so pages of this GDT last night before I remembered why I usually avoid them and just post the next day. Yikes.

I strongly disagree with the notion that the 1st period was a bad response after Friday's embarrassment. We dominated the 1st period at even strength. We were above 60% in every possession/quality metric. We did come out firing on all cylinders, but we couldn't solve Dubnyk. Our special teams were awful again in the 1st period (0/2 on the PP and allowed a goal on our only kill), but special teams isn't at all a measure of heart, determination, resiliency, etc. You can get moments of those things on a PK, but the overall structure of a PK has nothing to do with those things. And our structure is garbage. We were down 2-0 on a PP goal and a deflection in the high slot that drastically changed direction. However, shots were 12-5 at 5 on 5, high danger chances were 6-0 at 5 on 5 and scoring chances were 11-6 at 5 on 5. And it isn't like we were just burying chances into Dubnyk's chest. He made a number of very good saves on shots that were labeled.

The PK has been garbage. It obviously won't be this bad all year (43% is pretty much the definition of unsustainable), but the eye test is really bad. The PK was my greatest concern this year and I'm more worried today than I was a week ago. Faulk has been our 2nd best penalty killer this year and while I have been happy with his play so far this year, that is a huge issue.

We were once again dominant at 5 on 5:

Given the construction of our blue line, this might be the Blues this year: dominate possession and chances, but have 5 or so catastrophic breakdowns that hang Binner completely out to dry. I'm not making my mind up 3 games into the year, but so far we haven't done anything to ease my mind on my 3 biggest pre-season concerns (PK, in-zone defending and Binner's ability to be more than a "get square and stop the first shot" goalie). The upside is that so far we have been able to outscore our problems in 2 of 3 games. That appeared to be the formula given the roster construction, so you have to acknowledge that scoring 4+ in two of three games is a great start to that.

To further back this point up, NST (Natural Stat Trick) had even strength chances at 28-8.