Value of: Blackhawks moving on from Kane/Toews

[dwright5314]

What would it have to take for the Blackhawks to consider moving on from one of these 2? Obviously they'd have to retain a considerable amount of salary in any deal. However, it's not like either of them are 35 years old. They still have some pretty good years left and the return could really accelerate a rebuild.

It seems like due to the 3 cups, they are almost bound to be lifetime Blackhawks unless one of them goes to management and asks for a change of scenery.

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[AvatarAang]

they could trade kane/toews for younger versions of themselves and still not win the cup the way management is building the rest of the roster. undoing the saad/panarin trade would have this team fighting for a playoff spot.

 

[Baksfamous112]

The Hawks could find suitors without retention in the off season (with cap dumps coming the other way).

Moving these two along with Keith in the off season would catapult the Hawks into a small rebuild. The assets they would get for these three (along with their recent 1st rounders and 2019 1st) would save them years of mediocrity and allow them to be competitive again within 3-4 years

 

[Flames Fanatic]

The Hawks could find suitors without retention in the off season (with cap dumps coming the other way).

Moving these two along with Keith in the off season would catapult the Hawks into a small rebuild. The assets they would get for these three (along with their recent 1st rounders and 2019 1st) would save them years of mediocrity and allow them to be competitive again within 3-4 years

I agree, though even a little retention likely opens up the market a bit.

Gotta imagine Keith would still drum up interest especially at his cap hit.

That being said, I fully expect all three of them to remain Hawks unless they request otherwise.

 

[qqaz]

What would it have to take for the Blackhawks to consider moving on from one of these 2? Obviously they'd have to retain a considerable amount of salary in any deal. However, it's not like either of them are 35 years old. They still have some pretty good years left and the return could really accelerate a rebuild.

It seems like due to the 3 cups, they are almost bound to be lifetime Blackhawks unless one of them goes to management and asks for a change of scenery.

It would take an entirely new management team. You'd have to fire the GM, all his assistants, and some of the guys with ambiguous job titles like "president" "advisor" and "VP hockey ops". Because the current ownership and management has no desire, whatsoever, to move on from Toews and Kane.

 

[rocketdan9]

Hawks won't do it

they are playing pond hockey right now in order to tank for Hughes

 

[Baksfamous112]

I agree, though even a little retention likely opens up the market a bit.

Gotta imagine Keith would still drum up interest especially at his cap hit.

That being said, I fully expect all three of them to remain Hawks unless they request otherwise.

I don't think they will be moved too but you never know. There's still a slim chance it ever happens and just for fun I'm going to put up an offer from Montreal for Toews:

To Chicago:

Karl Alzner (4.65M for this year + 3 more)
Andrew Shaw (3.9M for this year + 3 more)
Ryan Poehling (Unsigned - 19 years old)
2019 Habs 1st round pick (unprotected)
2019 CLB 2nd round pick
Conditional 2020 Montreal 2nd round pick (Montreal advance to the 3rd round in either 2019 or 2020 - Otherwise it turns into a 2020 4th)
Michael McCarron (RFA at the end of the year)

To Montreal:

Jonathan Toews (10.5M - this year + 4 more)


Montreal money out: 8.55M
Chicago money out: 10.5M

The two key pieces for Chicago are Poehling and Montreal's 1st. Poehling is already in his D+2 so he's further down on his development and is considered to be a lock to become an NHL C - Probably a middle 6 two-way C. With Chicago 2019 1st (and the likelihood that they draft a top C) and Poehling, Chicago will be well taken care of down the middle. The extra 1st, mostly a mid 1st round pick, let me pick another solid asset.

I included Alzner and Shaw for money reasons as Montreal can't take on 10.5M without something going back. Shaw can be sold later on for value as well.

 

[Extra Texture]

Kane would get them a ton. It's an offseason market rich in wingers, but few of his calibre. That said, I think he's the least likely of them all to be traded. Keith would surely be a big get for a young-ish playoff contender that could use his experience and blueline play, but the issue is any team that fits that definition can't take on another 4 seasons of his salary at that number. Not without major changes.

It still blows my mind that of all their big names, Seabrook's contract has the longest still to run.

 

[dwright5314]

I don't think they will be moved too but you never know. There's still a slim chance it ever happens and just for fun I'm going to put up an offer from Montreal for Toews:

To Chicago:

Karl Alzner (4.65M for this year + 3 more)
Andrew Shaw (3.9M for this year + 3 more)
Ryan Poehling (Unsigned - 19 years old)
2019 Habs 1st round pick (unprotected)
2019 CLB 2nd round pick
Conditional 2020 Montreal 2nd round pick (Montreal advance to the 3rd round in either 2019 or 2020 - Otherwise it turns into a 2020 4th)
Michael McCarron (RFA at the end of the year)

To Montreal:

Jonathan Toews (10.5M - this year + 4 more)


Montreal money out: 8.55M
Chicago money out: 10.5M

The two key pieces for Chicago are Poehling and Montreal's 1st. Poehling is already in his D+2 so he's further down on his development and is considered to be a lock to become an NHL C - Probably a middle 6 two-way C. With Chicago 2019 1st (and the likelihood that they draft a top C) and Poehling, Chicago will be well taken care of down the middle. The extra 1st, mostly a mid 1st round pick, let me pick another solid asset.

I included Alzner and Shaw for money reasons as Montreal can't take on 10.5M without something going back. Shaw can be sold later on for value as well.

It just feels like the Blackhawks could do better than Poehling and a 1st for Toews, who still has a few quality years left. But with that contract, maybe this is a realistic evaluation, hmmm.

 

[GaryU]

Hawks won't do it

they are playing pond hockey right now in order to tank for Hughes

As a lifelong Hawks fan, they are not tanking. They really are this bad...All those extra games the last 9 years have taken a toll especially on Keith (playing upper 20's minutes for that long). Seabrook, just slowing down badly. The rest of the D-men haven't learned how yet...Team D is so bad, Toews is going to the wrong place, chasing the puck...While Panarin woulda helped scoring wise, the D is awful, and actually Saad's been better this year. The really sad part is them keeping Bowman as GM, when he created this mess.

 

[Mrfenn92]

I don't think they will be moved too but you never know. There's still a slim chance it ever happens and just for
fun I'm going to put up an offer from Montreal for Toews:
To Chicago:

Karl Alzner (4.65M for this year + 3 more)
Andrew Shaw (3.9M for this year + 3
more)
Ryan Poehling (Unsigned - 19 years old)
2019 Habs 1st round pick (unprotected)
2019 CLB 2nd round pick
Conditional 2020 Montreal 2nd round pick (Montreal advance to the 3rd round in either 2019 or 2020 - Otherwise it turns into a 2020 4th)
Michael McCarron (RFA at the end of
the year)

To Montreal:

Jonathan Toews (10.5M - this year + 4 more)
Montreal money out: 8.55M
Chicago money out: 10.5M

The two key pieces for Chicago are Poehling and Montreal's 1st. Poehling is already in his D+2 so he's further down on his development and is considered to be a lock to become
an NHL C - Probably a middle 6 two-way C. With Chicago 2019 1st (and the likelihood that they draft a top C) and Poehling, Chicago will be well taken care of down the middle. The
extra 1st, mostly a mid 1st round pick, let me pick another solid asset.

I included Alzner and Shaw for money reasons as Montreal can't take on 10.5M without something going back. Shaw can be sold later on for value as well.

I'll say yes just for the sake of saying yes but you have to take back Chris kunitz and Brandon manning. (we retain half) then for me a done deal.

 

[rocketdan9]

As a lifelong Hawks fan, they are not tanking. They really are this bad...All those extra games the last 9 years have taken a toll especially on Keith (playing upper 20's minutes for that long). Seabrook, just slowing down badly. The rest of the D-men haven't learned how yet...Team D is so bad, Toews is going to the wrong place, chasing the puck...While Panarin woulda helped scoring wise, the D is awful, and actually Saad's been better this year. The really sad part is them keeping Bowman as GM, when he created this mess.

So again they are playing pond hockey

Team is not trying as a group

Toews doesnt make mistakes like that... its just lack of team support imo

Seabrook is definitely slowing down

Not sure also what is going on with Keith

Sure if the Hawks want to have a firesale... there will have a lineup of interest. But the owner/gm wont let in happen

Hawks at this rate is on their way to have a shot at Hughes

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

I didn't see this thread, but I think we're seeing the start on the Blackhawks tanking. But I do see them having a few odd playoff appearances before the full rebuild happens.

If they're going to trade Toews and Kane they either have to send them to a team with cap space, retain, or let them retire with the Chicago Blackhawks. I do imagine if they retain and decide to on the full rebuild they have a chance of seeing the glory days once again.

 

[Baksfamous112]

I'll say yes just for the sake of saying yes but you have to take back Chris kunitz and Brandon manning. (we retain half) then for me a done deal.

Yeah, I guess it doesn’t really matter to Montreal at this point. We can waive/bury them in the minor

 

[generalshepherd141]

So again they are playing pond hockey

Team is not trying as a group

Toews doesnt make mistakes like that... its just lack of team support imo

Seabrook is definitely slowing down

Not sure also what is going on with Keith

Sure if the Hawks want to have a firesale... there will have a lineup of interest. But the owner/gm wont let in happen

Hawks at this rate is on their way to have a shot at Hughes

He's old and washed up. Sadly he is still not as bad as Seabrook.

 

[rocketdan9]

He's old and washed up. Sadly he is still not as bad as Seabrook.

Bruins will take Keith

 

[member 157595]

As a lifelong Hawks fan, they are not tanking. They really are this bad...All those extra games the last 9 years have taken a toll especially on Keith (playing upper 20's minutes for that long). Seabrook, just slowing down badly. The rest of the D-men haven't learned how yet...Team D is so bad, Toews is going to the wrong place, chasing the puck...While Panarin woulda helped scoring wise, the D is awful, and actually Saad's been better this year. The really sad part is them keeping Bowman as GM, when he created this mess.

There is absolutely no shame in rebuilding a team through the draft. Toews, Kane, Keith, Seabrook and Corey Crawford were core players on Cup teams and all were drafted by the Hawks.

Chicago doesn't need to apologize for a damn thing. Move out expiring contracts, collect draft picks, scout well and take the BPA on draft day. Start the foundation now for the next series of core players.

 

[JesusNPucks]

J. Toews ($2.5 M retained)
C. Kunitz
5th 2019
5th 2020

For

M. Hanzal ($4.75M - UFA in 2020)
M. Methot ($4.9M - pending UFA)
R. Faksa ($2.2M - RFA in 2020)
R. Hintz
1st 2019

 

[Once]

No way they move Kane or Toews. Find a way to unload Seabrook before anything else.

I hope the Hawks get a top 3 pick this year and slowly rebuild the backend through Boqvist + Mitchell. If they land Jack Hughes that will suddenly changes the makeup of the Blackhawks.

 

[Baksfamous112]

J. Toews ($2.5 M retained)
C. Kunitz
5th 2019
5th 2020

For

M. Hanzal ($4.75M - UFA in 2020)
M. Methot ($4.9M - pending UFA)
R. Faksa ($2.2M - RFA in 2020)
R. Hintz
1st 2019

That’s a shitty offer

 

[Spectra]

The Chicago Blackhawks would not have to retain salary if they were to trade Patrick Kane. He is one of the top ice hockey players in the world and is being paid accordingly.

Offers start at multiple top prospects and 1st round picks, with the ability for the Hawks to take a cap dump in any deal. I advocated for trading Kane before last season while his value was still very high. His value has decreased since then, so I imagine he will now float around without a purpose for the remainder of his contract, unfortunately.

Toews has borderline negative value and will also play out his contract in Chicago.

 

[PromisedLand]

at the cap hits both have, term left and their production I see some teams may be interested in Kane; Toews on the other hand is a terrible contract right now

 

[Kamiccolo]

It's a fantasy. Same as these posts saying the kings should move their guys. They won them their cups, they got their payday. They'll retire as members of the Hawks.

You don't trade guys like those in the NHL it just doesn't happen. Not to mention they still sell tons of Jersey's and provide a lot of off ice value just having that experience and resume.

 

[Sweetpotato]

Kane to Buffalo just so I can watch Skinner-Eichel-Kane. I want that as a hockey fan thanks.

Toews to a team that needs a center and either has cap space or has a large dump to send back.(no idea, Minny? Colorado?)

Keith to a team that he doesn't need to be the guy but will be a good compliment and good leadership.(MTL, St.Louis, Florida, Dallas)

Toews is the only one that really requires mental gymnastics.

 

[Hookslide]

Krug ,Donato, Zobril, For Kane, Keith .....Retain 50% of Keith salary last two years. Really prefer not to take keith but would help salary cap for Black hawks and gets them started on their rebuild............