Player Discussion Bigger Bust- McIlrath or Jessiman?

[kovazub94]

Jessiman by a mile. They literally could have made a blind pick and get someone who would have make a difference.

McI was picked when Del Zotto was still highly regarded and there was a need for a physical, crease clearing defenseman. They went all wrong about it, and a change in a direction for the whole league didn’t help the matter either.

 

[Machinehead]

Very similar.

Both are guys who were taken 10 spots higher than projected because they're #Big.

I wanna say McIlrath was actually the worse pick. I say that because Jessiman had a ceiling if he panned out. He was projected to be a superstar if the project worked. What was McIlrath's ceiling? A #4 defenseman? Jessiman was a huge risk for a chance at a huge reward. McIlrath was a huge risk for a reward that can be signed in UFA for $3-4 million.

That said, when you say "bust," you're talking about expectations. Jessiman definitely had higher expectations, so he was the bigger bust.

 

[Machinehead]

Oh, and even though everyone always talks about these two, neither one is our worst blunder in the first round. Not even close.

That dishonor goes to the 1999 draft. First, we draft Pavel Brendl 4th overall, and then we trade Marc Savard to move up two -yes, two...TWO- spots and take Jamie Lundmark.

 

[Machinehead]

Both are similar, yet their own unique brand of brutal, but 2003 really sticks out to me to this day.

This team hasn't had a True #1 Center in 20 years, and I always wonder what the team would've looked like if they took Ryan Getzlaf.

Or didn't trade Marc Savard

 

[Idlerlee]

Jessiman without question. But McIlrath is a more recent reminder that the picks we are so sure are going to make us content in 2-3 years. They are nowhere near a sure thing.

 

[nyr2k2]

I was lucky enough to play against Jessiman, who was an absolute beast on the ice. He fell to NYR, whereas McIlrath was a reach pick who I saw in some mock drafts going as late as the third round.

Hugh was probably the bigger bust, but McIlrath was by far the dumber pick considering what our roster needed at the time. Fowler was a no brainer there.

But wouldn't it be dumb to have made either of those picks based on what the roster needed at the time? Given that both were project-type picks. I mean unless you're presented with a Tavares or Hedman situation, you shouldn't be picking based on what your team needs since these guys are generally a few years away and things change so much in that time.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Hugh Jessiman and this is NOT even close.

Hard for me to call someone who had such a major injury in his PRIME developmental period such a colossal bust.

Jessiman's ankle injury was devastating to his development as a player.

The sad thing for him is that ankle injuries followed him for his entire career after that: Hugh Jessiman's Story - HSS Back in the Game

 

[patnyrnyg]

I would say Jessiman simply because of all the great players to be selected after him. I would have to look it up to double-check, but wasn't McIlrath's draft class a pretty big dud, overall?

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Bobby sanguinetti.

I don't think he belongs in this conversation. He was a late first round pick in what I believe was a weak draft. And if I remember correctly he was considered a good pick at the time. Plus we got a nice haul for him. I believe that we got the pick that turned in Fast for him. Fast at that spot I that draft would probably been a solid pick.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Very similar.

Both are guys who were taken 10 spots higher than projected because they're #Big.

I wanna say McIlrath was actually the worse pick. I say that because Jessiman had a ceiling if he panned out. He was projected to be a superstar if the project worked. What was McIlrath's ceiling? A #4 defenseman? Jessiman was a huge risk for a chance at a huge reward. McIlrath was a huge risk for a reward that can be signed in UFA for $3-4 million.

That said, when you say "bust," you're talking about expectations. Jessiman definitely had higher expectations, so he was the bigger bust.

This is exactly what I meant. Jessiman was a pick where it seemed they were banking on greatness. Sure you can blame them for misreading his potential, but at least the intentions were good. With McIlrath the intentions were always absurd. This is my #1 gripe. At least with the Jessiman pick they "tried".

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Oh, and even though everyone always talks about these two, neither one is our worst blunder in the first round. Not even close.

That dishonor goes to the 1999 draft. First, we draft Pavel Brendl 4th overall, and then we trade Marc Savard to move up two -yes, two...TWO- spots and take Jamie Lundmark.

That's a bit before my time. I started following the Rangers closely during the 2000-2001 season. I know about it but it doesn't quite hit home.

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

I still think mcilraith is an NHL regular if he didn’t blow up his knee

 

[Inferno]

I don't think he belongs in this conversation. He was a late first round pick in what I believe was a weak draft. And if I remember correctly he was considered a good pick at the time. Plus we got a nice haul for him. I believe that we got the pick that turned in Fast for him. Fast at that spot I that draft would probably been a solid pick.

Joke
-
Your head

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Joke
-
Your head

I mean Sanguinetti WAS a bust, so not sure what the joke was.

 

[Inferno]

I mean Sanguinetti WAS a bust, so not sure what the joke was.

That he's even in the same realm as the other 2.

 

[patnyrnyg]

Oh, and even though everyone always talks about these two, neither one is our worst blunder in the first round. Not even close.

That dishonor goes to the 1999 draft. First, we draft Pavel Brendl 4th overall, and then we trade Marc Savard to move up two -yes, two...TWO- spots and take Jamie Lundmark.

Thought it was Savard and their first in 2000 for the 4th pick? Then, something like Cloutier to move up to take Lundmark? I could be wrong, but that is what I remember.

Edit: Nevermind, you are correct. from Savard's page on hockeydb.com: 1999-Jun-26 Traded from New York Rangers with round 1 pick in the 1999 draft (Oleg Saprykin) to Calgary Flames for Jan Hlavac, round 1 pick in the 1999 draft (Jamie Lundmark) and round 3 pick in the 1999 draft (Craig Anderson)

Cloutier: June 26, 1999: Traded to Tampa Bay by NY Rangers with Niklas Sundstrom and NY Rangers' 1st (Nikita Alexeev) and 3rd (later traded to San Jose - later traded to Chicago - Chicago selected Igor Radulov) round choices in 2000 Entry Draft for Chicago's 1st round choice (previously acquired, NY Rangers selected Pavel Brendl) in 1999 Entry Draft.

 

[Edge]

Jessiman.

That 2003 draft was absolutely STACKED, especially the first round. The Rangers passed on A LOT of talent.

To me, Jessiman never really looked like an NHL player and I was very vocal in my opposition to him being the pick long before they ever called his name.

With McIlrath, I see a little more context, even if it was a miss. The game was changing very quickly and he was one of several defenseman who never materialized after being a higher pick. I also McIlrath could've been an NHL player in a different time --- it just wasn't the time period he was selected. Not that it makes his selection any less disastrous, but I feel like the depth and the context rank it below Jessiman by a pretty good margin.

 

[Synergy27]

Jessiman without question. But McIlrath is a more recent reminder that the picks we are so sure are going to make us content in 2-3 years. They are nowhere near a sure thing.

McIlrath is a terrible example of that. This board collectively panicked after that pick because we knew it was a mistake. Very few, if any, had expectations for him like they do now for LA and Chytil.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I still think mcilraith is an NHL regular if he didn’t blow up his knee

Jessiman is, at the minimum, a second line power forward for a decade if he doesn't blow up his ankle (something that would follow him for years) during a crucial developmental period.

 

[Edge]

Thought it was Savard and their first in 2000 for the 4th pick? Then, something like Cloutier to move up to take Lundmark? I could be wrong, but that is what I remember.

Edit: Nevermind, you are correct. from Savard's page on hockeydb.com: 1999-Jun-26 Traded from New York Rangers with round 1 pick in the 1999 draft (Oleg Saprykin) to Calgary Flames for Jan Hlavac, round 1 pick in the 1999 draft (Jamie Lundmark) and round 3 pick in the 1999 draft (Craig Anderson)

Cloutier: June 26, 1999: Traded to Tampa Bay by NY Rangers with Niklas Sundstrom and NY Rangers' 1st (Nikita Alexeev) and 3rd (later traded to San Jose - later traded to Chicago - Chicago selected Igor Radulov) round choices in 2000 Entry Draft for Chicago's 1st round choice (previously acquired, NY Rangers selected Pavel Brendl) in 1999 Entry Draft.

I think Jessiman stands out more for a couple of reasons.

1. The depth of that 2003 draft was insane.

2. It was the low point of the Rangers futility.

3. A lot of people knew Jessiman was a suspect pick BEFORE he was selected. So it wasn't so much about hindsight as it was something people saw from a mile away.

4. He was part of that first couple of prospect waves where people could SEE and track a player in relative real-time. That put everything under a bigger microscope than it was even just 4 years prior.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Jessiman.

That 2003 draft was absolutely STACKED, especially the first round. The Rangers passed on A LOT of talent.

To me, Jessiman never really looked like an NHL player and I was very vocal in my opposition to him being the pick long before they ever called his name.

With McIlrath, I see a little more context, even if it was a miss. The game was changing very quickly and he was one of several defenseman who never materialized after being a higher pick. I also McIlrath could've been an NHL player in a different time --- it just wasn't the time period he was selected. Not that it makes his selection any less disastrous, but I feel like the depth and the context rank it below Jessiman by a pretty good margin.

It's interesting since we converge in a lot of areas on our analysis and always have. We always disagreed re: Jessiman, though. I look at him and still cringe about his ankle and what it did to his career arc.

 

[Edge]

It's interesting since we converge in a lot of areas on our analysis and always have. We always disagreed re: Jessiman, though. I look at him and still cringe about his ankle and what it did to his career arc.

Yeah and I'm the first to admit, I wanted nothing to do with Jessiman in the months leading up to the draft. I was Getzlaf's hype man. Big time.

 

[Mandar]

Oh, and even though everyone always talks about these two, neither one is our worst blunder in the first round. Not even close.

That dishonor goes to the 1999 draft. First, we draft Pavel Brendl 4th overall, and then we trade Marc Savard to move up two -yes, two...TWO- spots and take Jamie Lundmark.

Neither of those picks were considered a reach at the time....in the weeks leading up to the draft that year, some were saying that Brendl could actually go 1st overall. There was no one saying that either of those picks were a reach at the time....in fact, IIRC the Rangers were complimented in what they did in the draft.

Of course, the results didn't match the hype.....but there have been many of those over the years (Michael Stewart, Jeff Brown, Peter Ferraro, etc.). However....not sure you can call those 2 picks "blunders", unless you give lots of credence to Monday morning quarterbacking.

 

[Edge]

Lundmark is arguably my biggest miss in the 25 years I've really paid attention to the draft and prospects.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Lundmark is arguably my biggest miss in the 25 years I've really paid attention to the draft and prospects.

Brendl mine for sure, lol.