Best all around Defensemen in the NHL (Current Players)?

[fiveonfive]

Its just not true, I will never understand the unwillingness of Karlsson fans to accept that he is just the best offensive dman, there is nothing wrong with that. But as a Blues fans if you offered Karlsson for Petro I would turn it down, the upgrade of offense and down grade of defense would be bad for my team. But if you were offer Doughty or Keith ...... I might pack his bags for him, and I am a big Petro fan.

Why do Ottawa fans have to accept anything that they don’t think is true? If I said, why can’t Blues fans accept that Pietro is actually just a second pairing dman at best and there is nothing wrong with that, would you accept it?

Also, if you are actually saying that you wouldn’t take a 1 for 1 swap between Karl and Pie, I’m extremely glad you aren’t the GM of my team.

 

[Dbrownss]

Its just not true, I will never understand the unwillingness of Karlsson fans to accept that he is just the best offensive dman, there is nothing wrong with that. But as a Blues fans if you offered Karlsson for Petro I would turn it down, the upgrade of offense and down grade of defense would be bad for my team. But if you were offer Doughty or Keith ...... I might pack his bags for him, and I am a big Petro fan.

Id take Karlsson for Pietrangelo, quite easily. The offensive gape is huge. Pietrangelo doesn't usually receive the recognition he deserves...except in this thread. Ive seen quite a bit of Pie love. I love to rag on Karlsson as much as most, but almost anyone would take EK

 

[HarrisonFord]

1. Doughty
2. Karlsson
3. Keith
4. Hedman

 

[snu22fint]

Its just not true, I will never understand the unwillingness of Karlsson fans to accept that he is just the best offensive dman, there is nothing wrong with that. But as a Blues fans if you offered Karlsson for Petro I would turn it down, the upgrade of offense and down grade of defense would be bad for my team. But if you were offer Doughty or Keith ...... I might pack his bags for him, and I am a big Petro fan.

Only a homer would turn down Karlsson for Pietriagelo. Blues GM would probably throw Pietriagelo under a buss to sniff Karlssons skates for 2 minutes.

I donno. Even if your team badly needed defense rather than offense, turning down what is considered a top 3 most valuable asset for what is not even in the top 15 according to HFboards (see link below) might not be the wisest desision.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2107013

last 3 seasons Karlssons production is at 0.9 ppg and Pietri has 0.53 ppg. How much better do Pietri have to be at defending to close that gap?

 

[TheBluePenguin]

Only a homer would turn down Karlsson for Pietriagelo. Blues GM would probably throw Pietriagelo under a buss to sniff Karlssons skates for 2 minutes.

I donno. Even if your team badly needed defense rather than offense, turning down what is considered a top 3 most valuable asset for what is not even in the top 15 according to HFboards (see link below) might not be the wisest desision.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2107013

last 3 seasons Karlssons production is at 0.9 ppg and Pietri has 0.53 ppg. How much better do Pietri have to be at defending to close that gap?

If you look at my post I said that it would be bad for the Blues, and our current state. Of course Karlsson has more value than Petro. I do not care what that poll states he is not the third most valuable player in the league and if you would swap out the two the Blues would not be better. They maybe fun to watch but their record would be worse. Karlsson is better offensively than Nicklas Lidstrom but that does not mean hes better. That is all I am saying, and this is what I mentioned you are not allowed to have a single negative opinion about Karlsson without people going ape *****. Why can't he just be really really good. Why do people have so much invested that hes gods gift to defense. I stand by my opinion that the Blues would be worse with Karlsson.

 

[fiveonfive]

If you look at my post I said that it would be bad for the Blues, and our current state. Of course Karlsson has more value than Petro. I do not care what that poll states he is not the third most valuable player in the league and if you would swap out the two the Blues would not be better. They maybe fun to watch but their record would be worse. Karlsson is better offensively than Nicklas Lidstrom but that does not mean hes better. That is all I am saying, and this is what I mentioned you are not allowed to have a single negative opinion about Karlsson without people going ape *****. Why can't he just be really really good. Why do people have so much invested that hes gods gift to defense. I stand by my opinion that the Blues would be worse with Karlsson.

This a message board where people share opinions, and people are sharing their opinions, but you can’t seem to understand them. You shared your opinion and people now have the right to criticize it as well. That’s generally how these things work.

And I think that if Ottawa would be a much worse team with Pie instead of Karlsson, why the blues would probably improve. Karlsson feeding Tarasenko would probably be pretty cool to see

 

[Caps8112]

With the current group of Defenseman seen as the top 10 its all preference imo. Can totally see why people would want Karlsson for his offensive ability and from what Im hearing on here lately an improvement to his Def. For me, Id take doughty, weber, suter, Pietro, over Karlsson. Rather have the great def and let the forwards worry about scoring and get a slightly smaller offensive contribution from the D corp. Caps had Mike Green for years and he played very similar to EK with breaking out of the caps zone and setting it up in the o zone. The trade off in the playoffs was that green couldnt play D. Go back and watch the caps pens in 09. Everytime Crosby and Malkin are celebrating you will see Mike Green Standing there looking down after getting embarrassed. Obviously EK is on another level then green but their contributions to their teams could be comparable.

 

[fiveonfive]

With the current group of Defenseman seen as the top 10 its all preference imo. Can totally see why people would want Karlsson for his offensive ability and from what Im hearing on here lately an improvement to his Def. For me, Id take doughty, weber, suter, Pietro, over Karlsson. Rather have the great def and let the forwards worry about scoring and get a slightly smaller offensive contribution from the D corp. Caps had Mike Green for years and he played very similar to EK with breaking out of the caps zone and setting it up in the o zone. The trade off in the playoffs was that green couldnt play D. Go back and watch the caps pens in 09. Everytime Crosby and Malkin are celebrating you will see Mike Green Standing there looking down after getting embarrassed. Obviously EK is on another level then green but their contributions to their teams could be comparable.

I agree with you that a lot of people will comment based on preference rather than any objective measurement of worth. But I would also want to say that every time their team does lose in the playoffs to a better team every single one of doughty, weber, suter, Pietro have stood on the with their head down after plenty of opposition goals. And Letang and Burns did not have a problem leading their teams to the Stanley cup finals last year by being offensively geared defensemen either.

 

[MessierII]

Doughty is the best

 

[Korpse]

With the current group of Defenseman seen as the top 10 its all preference imo. Can totally see why people would want Karlsson for his offensive ability and from what Im hearing on here lately an improvement to his Def. For me, Id take doughty, weber, suter, Pietro, over Karlsson. Rather have the great def and let the forwards worry about scoring and get a slightly smaller offensive contribution from the D corp. Caps had Mike Green for years and he played very similar to EK with breaking out of the caps zone and setting it up in the o zone. The trade off in the playoffs was that green couldnt play D. Go back and watch the caps pens in 09. Everytime Crosby and Malkin are celebrating you will see Mike Green Standing there looking down after getting embarrassed. Obviously EK is on another level then green but their contributions to their teams could be comparable.

Their contributions to their teams are not comparability at all. Karlsson leads the senators offensively while playing a top pairing role. Green did neither.

I don't have a problem with people pointing Karlsson can play a risky brand of hockey and some may relieve that isn't a recipe for playoff success. What I don't get is the questioning of his abilities defending. As a defender he may not be as well rounded as Doughty but he certainly is among the best in defensively ability. Where Karlsson gets in trouble is when he takes risks, he has gotten better though over the years at managing his risks. Also hasn't helped that Ottawa hasn't had good teams over the years so he has had to take more risks than you'd like. I don't buy that he wouldn't be able to play in a defensive system. A player with his skill and hockey sense rarely have trouble adapting.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Only a homer would turn down Karlsson for Pietriagelo. Blues GM would probably throw Pietriagelo under a buss to sniff Karlssons skates for 2 minutes.

Also, yea, Pie's defense in the playoffs have really helped the Blues muster post season success... oh wait, lmao.

With the current group of Defenseman seen as the top 10 its all preference imo. Can totally see why people would want Karlsson for his offensive ability and from what Im hearing on here lately an improvement to his Def. For me, Id take doughty, weber, suter, Pietro, over Karlsson. Rather have the great def and let the forwards worry about scoring and get a slightly smaller offensive contribution from the D corp. Caps had Mike Green for years and he played very similar to EK with breaking out of the caps zone and setting it up in the o zone. The trade off in the playoffs was that green couldnt play D. Go back and watch the caps pens in 09. Everytime Crosby and Malkin are celebrating you will see Mike Green Standing there looking down after getting embarrassed. Obviously EK is on another level then green but their contributions to their teams could be comparable.

You failed after you tried to compare Green to EK.

Green is the definition of an elite offensive defense man. But that's all he was.

Karlsson is the definition of a puck-possession defense man. Enormous difference, one is ***** at defense, your beloved Green, the other is much better defensively, and for large stretches entirely avoids playing defense, cause he has the puck all the time.

 

[RSeen]

Most complete dmen = Vlasic, Weber, Doughty, OEL, Hedman

Lol no.

 

[playasRus]

I don't understand the "I'll take Pie over Karlsson on my team because despite the Offensive gap, my team needs more defence" argument. It's like saying you wouldn't trade Pavelski/Bergeon for Ovechkin because I want a more rounded player. One guy is a game breaker. He'll win games on his own even if he's not the "elite" defensively.

 

[Korpse]

I don't understand the "I'll take Pie over Karlsson on my team because despite the Offensive gap, my team needs more defence" argument. It's like saying you wouldn't trade Pavelski/Bergeon for Ovechkin because I want a more rounded player. One guy is a game breaker. He'll win games on his own even if he's not the "elite" defensively.

Forwards score, defensemen defend or something.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Id take Karlsson for Pietrangelo, quite easily. The offensive gape is huge. Pietrangelo doesn't usually receive the recognition he deserves...except in this thread. Ive seen quite a bit of Pie love. I love to rag on Karlsson as much as most, but almost anyone would take EK

I would easily take Karlsson over Pietrangelo and i think Pietrangelo is great! I just think EK is the best twoway defensemen in the league!

 

[gorangers0525]

Lol, I'd take Karlsson well, well above Pietrangelo...defensively.

 

[Mass]

Also, yea, Pie's defense in the playoffs have really helped the Blues muster post season success... oh wait, lmao.



You failed after you tried to compare Green to EK.

Green is the definition of an elite offensive defense man. But that's all he was.

Karlsson is the definition of a puck-possession defense man. Enormous difference, one is ***** at defense, your beloved Green, the other is much better defensively, and for large stretches entirely avoids playing defense, cause he has the puck all the time.

This description fits no player in the NHL, and likely never will.

 

[strictlyrandy]

Ok.

Karlsson
Doughty
Keith
Hedman
Subban

Nailed it for me.

 

[PensandCaps]

Doughty is the best

nope, Letang is.

 

[Al Lagoon]

I know I know!! EZ!

My personal favorite, either for my team, or the team I hate's rival.

 

[Caps8112]

Also, yea, Pie's defense in the playoffs have really helped the Blues muster post season success... oh wait, lmao.



You failed after you tried to compare Green to EK.

Green is the definition of an elite offensive defense man. But that's all he was.

Karlsson is the definition of a puck-possession defense man. Enormous difference, one is ***** at defense, your beloved Green, the other is much better defensively, and for large stretches entirely avoids playing defense, cause he has the puck all the time.

So I said that it really comes down to matter of preference and that mine didnt include Karlson but acknowledged he is viewed in the top 10 with the other interchangeable D but somehow Sens fan takes offense or its some conspiracy to hate EK. I would also not view what I said about Green as me having a positive opinion of him. So your basically saying what makes EK great at Def is that he gathers the puck, maintaining possession out of his zone and either up the ice into the O zone or makes a great pass. Thats exactly what green did for the caps. He was the one man breakout for many seasons.

 

[Habs Halifax]

What about B Burns? Top 5 or not? I have him top 3

 

[EveryDay]

Its Keith for me.

Keith
Doughty
Karlsson
Weber/Suter

 

[sjsharks92]

Doughty is the clear #1 in my opinion.

Then I'd have some order of Karlsson, Weber, Vlasic, Keith, Hedman, OEL, Burns.

 

[jacks*]

So I said that it really comes down to matter of preference and that mine didnt include Karlson but acknowledged he is viewed in the top 10 with the other interchangeable D but somehow Sens fan takes offense or its some conspiracy to hate EK. I would also not view what I said about Green as me having a positive opinion of him. So your basically saying what makes EK great at Def is that he gathers the puck, maintaining possession out of his zone and either up the ice into the O zone or makes a great pass. Thats exactly what green did for the caps. He was the one man breakout for many seasons.

Exactly.You nailed it.Both are super offensive D-man. While one may be better than the other defensively ,neither are that good defensively to write home about.