BCHL votes to separate from Hockey Canada
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MMC
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Yukon Joe
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So their stated reason is that so they can recruit players from other provinces.
bc.ctvnews.ca
Not exactly the most noble of reasons.
BCHL breaks away from Hockey Canada, says move gives U18 players more options
The British Columbia Hockey League is breaking away from Hockey Canada, a move the league says will provide more options for players under 18 years old that are looking to compete in college hockey in the United States.
Not exactly the most noble of reasons.
MeHateHe
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An exciting new era in which a super league consisting of a half-dozen very wealthy teams runs roughshod over everyone else forever, and not just a coupe of teams for a few years. Because major recruits are definitely going to come from Europe and the Eastern States to play in Merritt, right?
I get that this is going to mean the BCHL will be a pay-to-play league, and they'll probably institute some kind of draft system to keep the playing field level, but turning the league into a WHL-lite is only going to exacerbate the difference between the haves and the have-nots. Places with limited fanbases - including, I think, Prince George and Victoria (the former's showhome lottery notwithstanding) - are just never going to be able to compete in terms of overall budget with the super clubs.
This is going to be pretty bad for hockey in BC, too, as suddenly a whole boatload of quality referees will be asked to choose between the BCHL and the rest of the above-minor program - junior B, senior, college and university.
At the end of the day, this is a handful of rich dudes who think their poop don't stink messing around with a system that was pretty good, that will benefit them a little at the expense of the rest of the league and of amateur hockey in BC in general.
DoyleG
Reality sucks, Princesses!
BCHL pulls out of Hockey Canada, becomes an independent league
The 18-team B.C. Hockey League believes the move will help it recruit players and produce a better product. Find out more.
vancouversun.com
- No indication of how the vote turned out.
- Must hire their own officials (good luck on that)
- Must now have its own insurance policy (good luck in BC)
Yukon Joe
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So I'm far from an expert, but it helps set national standards for, well, hockey. Sets out standards for coaching, for who can play for what team. It sets out insurance for hockey players and any on-ice risks.
It's also responsible for national/international play. So I do suspect that anyone playing for the BCHL won't be able to play for Team Canada (wouldn't happen anyways) or team BC (more likely an issue).
joestevens29
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Why would it be hard to hire officials? Where exactly are all the current officials that are coaching in the BCHL going to go?BCHL pulls out of Hockey Canada, becomes an independent league
The 18-team B.C. Hockey League believes the move will help it recruit players and produce a better product. Find out more.
- No indication of how the vote turned out.
- Must hire their own officials (good luck on that)
- Must now have its own insurance policy (good luck in BC)
As for insurance, one would think they would've looked into that before pulling out.
MeHateHe
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A lot will depend on how pissy Hockey Canada and BC Hockey get. Hockey Canada's insurer does get a little squirrelly about prominent players/officials participating in its leagues while also participating in 'independent' leagues, to the extent that they have warned players/officials that if they participate in one game in one of those non-HC-sanctioned leagues, they cannot participate in any Hockey Canada activities for the rest of the season.
Now, the challenge will be that Hockey Canada will want some of those players to take part in world junior and world U18 tournaments, so being too heavy handed in this instance will not be to Hockey Canada's advantage. But if they tell officials they can't do both BCHL and everything else - my gut says that's 50-50 and will depend on what kind of agreement they land on - then there are a lot of officials who will balk at giving up skating Junior B, college, university, and high level minor hockey for the right to work for three or four BCHL games a month. You're basically giving up 20 games to get 5 and as much as those guys like the prestige, they also need to get high level game action.
Again, it's possible Hockey Canada doesn't go that route with this new BCHL structure, but maybe.
On the insurance part, I don't doubt they looked into it. I suspect that the rich owners of the high-budget clubs are fine with the additional costs, and the other clubs were left with little option. I think some of the smaller market teams will not survive. Costs are going to skyrocket - insurance and recruiting, especially - and some teams will never get be able to find the revenue to match.
This has been a pipe dream for a handful of owners for more than a decade, and it's been the smaller clubs who have been saying no. I would love to know what the vote was.
joestevens29
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One has to think that there is going to be some sort of revenue sharing. The BCHL can't be stupid enough to think some of these teams that get 500-700 will be able to survive.
The hockey canada thing will be interesting. As I mentioned maybe in the other thread I can see Hockey Canada pulling a Russia and still taking the star players, but giving guys that are still apart of the Hockey Canada umbrella the edge to make the roster when it comes down to the more fringe spots.
I guess I don't know what to make on the officials side of thing, but the BCHL must have some sort of plan. They can't be that stupid and not be planning for some of these hurdles.
On a complete side note I wonder what happens in say 10 years from now if the BCHL can't sustain themselves. Hockey Canada going to let them back in?
WarriorofTime
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If it were "pretty good", it's unlikely they breakaway. Most of Canadian Junior A is a joke, but this League is pretty high-level, so it kinda makes sense they'd go their own way. Clearly they are doing something right and Hockey Canada was likely taking more than it was giving.
MeHateHe
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In reality, there are a bunch of teams that will do just fine, and a bunch that cannot survive. It's an open secret that the rich teams would be thrilled to get rid of some of the smaller markets. That's what's going to happen. It's an 18-team league now. In four years, maybe it's a 10-12 team league, and I think that's really what some of these guys want.
Are you even from BC? Or are you just talking out your ass?
The league got to the place it is as a result of the system that was in place. Hockey Canada has a mandate to provide options for Canadians to play hockey at a high level, and the mindset that some of the guys in the BCHL are operating under is intended to beggar hockey in other provinces, primarily, and frankly, not provide options for British Columbia's players - the expectation is that teams will have a minimum of 5 guys from BC on their rosters, and given the likelihood that teams will not be able to affiliate with Junior B teams, that could mean 5 guys on the taxi squad.
This is going to benefit a handful of teams currently at the top of the BCHL at the expense of the rest of their league, at the expense of development in other areas of the country.
WarriorofTime
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You are the one talking out your ass. Maybe because you’re so far up Hockey Canada’s. Maybe your old boys club-adjacent. The goal is to make the BCHL the premiere ncaa feeder league in Canada. The goal shouldn’t be to protect marginal players that can’t hang. Those players should go play in leagues that measure up to their skill set. Attracting international players and players from other provinces will only improve the quality of play. It’s great news for players as a whole. You keep saying only a couple teams will benefit, but then why did the measure pass? That’s the question you can’t seem to answer. Only reason to take such an ardent anti-player stance is if you only care about Hockey Canada, the organization’s, interests and not those of the player and those of the league as a whole.
MeHateHe
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As I expected, you're not from BC. You read the press releases from the league and think you know what's happening.
WarriorofTime
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You can try and gatekeep all you want but you’ve refuted nothing and just keep repeating Hockey Canada talking points.
DoyleG
Reality sucks, Princesses!
THE FOLLOWING POST IS A PUBLIC SERVICE TO COUNTER DISINFORMATION AND BIASES
As its reported, the vote was apparently 14-2 with 2 teams abstaining from the vote. BC Hockey’s response is that they are looking to set up a new Junior A league and looking at the Junior B system as the basis for new teams.
As for the wants of Crocker and the BCHL, they leave because they wanted to recruit 16- and 17-year-old players without any restrictions. Movements like that aren’t allowed under Hockey Canada rules with Provincial leagues having a limit to how many 16-year-olds can be signed.
Hockey Alberta Guidelines (which the AJHL follows)
https://www.hockeyalberta.ca/uploads/source/Players/Junior_Male_Regulations.pdf
In the MJHL
In the MJHL System
Even when you get past the restrictions, the only real requirement is that the player is a resident in the province. The BCHL’s problems seem to be far more economic concerns than there is about the rules.
As its reported, the vote was apparently 14-2 with 2 teams abstaining from the vote. BC Hockey’s response is that they are looking to set up a new Junior A league and looking at the Junior B system as the basis for new teams.
As for the wants of Crocker and the BCHL, they leave because they wanted to recruit 16- and 17-year-old players without any restrictions. Movements like that aren’t allowed under Hockey Canada rules with Provincial leagues having a limit to how many 16-year-olds can be signed.
Hockey Alberta Guidelines (which the AJHL follows)
https://www.hockeyalberta.ca/uploads/source/Players/Junior_Male_Regulations.pdf
In the MJHL
In the MJHL System
Even when you get past the restrictions, the only real requirement is that the player is a resident in the province. The BCHL’s problems seem to be far more economic concerns than there is about the rules.
Tom ServoMST3K
In search of a Steinbach Hero
This had been rumored for a while.
I'm not sure the juice will be worth the squeeze for them, but I'm not in a great position to make that determination.
I'm not sure the juice will be worth the squeeze for them, but I'm not in a great position to make that determination.
MeHateHe
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A useful, if short, thread from folks who follow the BCHL.
Unofficial BCHL Messageboard-League Vote to Leave Hockey Canada
What exactly is the positive information ? It looks like it is all on a hope and prayer that BC Hockey and Hockey Canada will work with them to get so
www.tapatalk.com
It's fine to argue that the restrictions on movement for 16- and 17-year-old players somehow hurts a handful of high-quality players because they can't play in the BCHL. I'd be willing to see some examples of players whose development was actually harmed because they had to play an additional year in the OJHL or the SJHL instead of going to play in Penticton on Salmon Arm. Moreover, one of the big problems major junior has to address is that they bring in a bunch of kids at that age, fill their heads with grand ideas, and then fail to live up to it. Most of those kids turn into moderately successful junior hockey players who get some scholarship money for Canadian university and don't develop further. The BCHL wants to emulate that model, where players chase a dream that is pretty speculative. So for the very few Alex Newhooks, there are 15 others who are going to be encouraged to move 2,000 miles away from home and stability - away from parents, friends and normal school life - and maybe not get anything out of it. AND, that takes away from hockey in Miramichi or Smiths Falls or one of a dozen other places outside of BC.
The discussion around exceptional status is a recognition that at essence 15-year-olds are children, and it's responsible for any sports federation to take into account the needs of the person as much as the needs of the hockey player. Yeah, sure, parents have to take responsibility for that, but that doesn't eliminate the responsibility Hockey Canada has.
16 of the 18 BCHL teams are for-profit businesses, and the ones who are most successful are run by guys with lots of money. They're not doing this out of the goodness of their hearts; they need to maximize the interest in their teams for local fans, and if that means bringing in a kid from Newfoundland to do so, the idea that they're doing so for the sake of that kid, that's pretty naive. If the kid benefits - and Newhook was an exception for sure, who did - that's an ancillary benefit, not the primary motivation for the teams.
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MeHateHe
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A few additional tidbits on this.
First, from Gregg Drinnan, whose sources on junior hockey especially in western Canada, are pretty solid.
greggdrinnan.com
Also, a memo sent out from the CEO of BC Hockey on the matter:
Spoiler: it doesn't say much, although it doesn't link to an explainer about their policy on independent leagues, and it does look like they are going to be pretty firm about preventing their officials from skating in an independent BCHL. As I said earlier, that's going to be hugely problematic. I don't know where they're going to get the bodies. Some will be attracted by bigger dollars and that's going to hurt officiating in the three Junior B leagues especially, and it's going to be hard on those guys who only skate BCHL because they're not going to get enough games. It's not good for anyone.
And then there's BC Hockey's plans to promote a new Junior A league, presumably by promoting some Junior B clubs.
First, from Gregg Drinnan, whose sources on junior hockey especially in western Canada, are pretty solid.
TAKING NOTE
Welcome to a site where we will provide food for thought, some of it involving hockey and some of it on renal-related topics. We also do some Scattershooting from time to time. Enjoy!.
greggdrinnan.com
Also, a memo sent out from the CEO of BC Hockey on the matter:
BC HOCKEY MEMORANDUM
NOTE FOR MEMBERS - MAY 3, 2023 BC HOCKEY MEMORANDUM May 3, 2023 TO: BC HOCKEY MEMBERSHIP FROM: CAMERON HOPE - CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER SUBJECT: NOTE FOR MEMBERS - MAY 3, 2023 The withdrawal of the BCHL
myemail.constantcontact.com
Spoiler: it doesn't say much, although it doesn't link to an explainer about their policy on independent leagues, and it does look like they are going to be pretty firm about preventing their officials from skating in an independent BCHL. As I said earlier, that's going to be hugely problematic. I don't know where they're going to get the bodies. Some will be attracted by bigger dollars and that's going to hurt officiating in the three Junior B leagues especially, and it's going to be hard on those guys who only skate BCHL because they're not going to get enough games. It's not good for anyone.
And then there's BC Hockey's plans to promote a new Junior A league, presumably by promoting some Junior B clubs.
Tom ServoMST3K
In search of a Steinbach Hero
The GMHL was sniffing around some BC markets to make an unsanctioned junior b league in conjunction with Alberta in 2021.
Hockey Canada pointed to the official policy, where league organizers said it wouldn't be followed in practice.
Ultimately, the regions I was familiar with said no to the proposal.
www.wltribune.com
Hockey Canada pointed to the official policy, where league organizers said it wouldn't be followed in practice.
Ultimately, the regions I was familiar with said no to the proposal.
B.C. Transit hike unnecessary: Douglas Street businesses
www.wltribune.com
MMC
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oldunclehue
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This could potentially be devastating for the other leagues around Canada, especially MJ, AJ and SJHL. Top players from those teams can now leave without getting a release and go play in the premier league for NCAA recruitment in the country.
Agents/Player Advisors will be pushing for this as the further their players go, the more money comes in.
Also the top 16-17 year olds in all those provinces will be recruited and again....the proofs in the pudding. If you have a far higher chance at a scholarship in BC....why wouldn't you consider going.
Agents/Player Advisors will be pushing for this as the further their players go, the more money comes in.
Also the top 16-17 year olds in all those provinces will be recruited and again....the proofs in the pudding. If you have a far higher chance at a scholarship in BC....why wouldn't you consider going.
Tom ServoMST3K
In search of a Steinbach Hero
There are only going to be so many spots for those players. How many 16/17 year Olds per team do you think there will be per team?
3?
So like 50 players? At most?
that would be like 25 per age-year from across the country?
And that will make spots available to older players from BC to those other leagues too who might have ncaa potential as a 18 or 19 year old.
