Sportsnet: Babcock not happy with refs

[Gallagbi]

What better way to send a message to Naz than to stop giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Refs are people, just like any one else, they take people trying to manipulate them in a personal way, they take pride in getting their calls right. After every game the NHL will send a"pack" of bad and good calls to the refs for them to review before their next game.

If your constantly seeing the same guy over and over again in the embellishment category, when that guy falls to the ice you will be less likely to give him the benefit of the doubt. the old saying about you made your bed now sleep in it is apt for Naz in this circumstance.

Naz needs to rebuild the trust of the refs if he wishes to get those calls again. Lets see in our next game if Babs calling out the refs has any impact.

This line of thinking is bizarre. The refs take pride in getting the call right so they are purposely missing calls to prove s point.

It's not about giving people the benefit of the doubt or "being human", it's about doing their job properly.

Babcock makes a great point. If it's a dive, call it.

 

[SprDaVE]

Good. That's what a coach does. That game against Boston was awful.

 

[Bluelines]

Since "we see it all the time" can you give us some examples? Or are you just blindly hating on Kadri again like 90% of your other posts?

Seems kind of irrational for a player to intentionally try and cause serious injury to themselves don't you think?

Your suggesting Kadri is putting his own health in jeopardy to get a call...think about that for a second. It doesn't seem to me that you're too concerned with Kadri since it's obvious you don't like him, get a grip man.

Page 138 third line from the bottom of the page...

.... "or allowing someone to slam me headfirst into the boards, I'd do it. Because in the playoffs you do what it takes to win."


Competitive players will do what ever it takes to gain an advantage, legal, borderline legal or other. I lost a lot of respect for Tie when I read that part in his book.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=tI...dmits to going head first into boards&f=false

 

[Bluelines]

This line of thinking is bizarre. The refs take pride in getting the call right so they are purposely missing calls to prove s point.

It's not about giving people the benefit of the doubt or "being human", it's about doing their job properly.

Babcock makes a great point. If it's a dive, call it.

Not purposely missing calls, just the rfs adjustign to Naz's "embilshemnt" they are now thinking since Naz has clearly a long history of "embellishment" and he is so good at it, you start to assume that anything that looks like a belly flop is an embellishment. So refs now purposely don't give a guy, who has a history of trying to manipulate the rules, the benefit of the doubt. Not bizarre at all, what would be bizarre is if refs knowingly let a known embellisher to continue cheat the system with out doing something to counterbalance the cheating.

 

[Gallagbi]

Not purposely missing calls, just the rfs adjustign to Naz's "embilshemnt" they are now thinking since Naz has clearly a long history of "embellishment" and he is so good at it, you start to assume that anything that looks like a belly flop is an embellishment. So refs now purposely don't give a guy, who has a history of trying to manipulate the rules, the benefit of the doubt. Not bizarre at all, what would be bizarre is if refs knowingly let a known embellisher to continue cheat the system with out doing something to counterbalance the cheating.

You're missing the issue.

Calls are being blown. If what you say is true, their bias is causing them to do their job poorly.

That's not okay or excusable. Referees need to be able to make the appropriate call, that's their job. Mistakes happen, but you aren't outlining a mistake.

 

[Ash35]

What better way to send a message to Naz than to stop giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Refs are people, just like any one else, they take people trying to manipulate them in a personal way, they take pride in getting their calls right. After every game the NHL will send a"pack" of bad and good calls to the refs for them to review before their next game.

If your constantly seeing the same guy over and over again in the embellishment category, when that guy falls to the ice you will be less likely to give him the benefit of the doubt. the old saying about you made your bed now sleep in it is apt for Naz in this circumstance.

Naz needs to rebuild the trust of the refs if he wishes to get those calls again. Lets see in our next game if Babs calling out the refs has any impact.

I'm still not convinced Kadri Dives or embellishes more than any other player. Do you not watch him play? The guy looses his balance and wipes out all the times on his own without any players around him. That's just the way he skates. Yes this has been a benifit to us because it doesn't take much contact for him to loose his balance but it doesn't mean he's diving. If a ref sees him diving then yes call a penalty but it doesn't mean you are aloud to stop following the rule book when you feel like it. If they want to make it personal then we need to replace them with robots.

 

[William Hylander]

The actual cross checking is the penalty, not making the player fall. He didn't get boarded.

It should have been a penalty, the ref was right there. This isn't like tripping where the act of falling is a penalty. He was crosschecked and it should have been a penalty. This isn't 1995, where a spear is considered a good play.

 

[Pookie]

You're missing the issue.

Calls are being blown. If what you say is true, their bias is causing them to do their job poorly.

That's not okay or excusable. Referees need to be able to make the appropriate call, that's their job. Mistakes happen, but you aren't outlining a mistake.

So then am I to assume that you don't agree with the calls that were in the Leafs favour in which embellishment occurred?

 

[Bluelines]

You're missing the issue.

Calls are being blown. If what you say is true, their bias is causing them to do their job poorly.

That's not okay or excusable. Referees need to be able to make the appropriate call, that's their job. Mistakes happen, but you aren't outlining a mistake.

No you are missing the point, if the refs call a penailty that is not a penality ,is that not blowing the call also? If a guy who is known to make a play look like a penality when it is not, as a ref do you ask yourself is he faking again or is it legit?
The refs are saying hey Kadri we know you are a sneaky cheat and for that reason you no longer get the benefit of the doubt. Fool me once ...

What you are asking for is for the refs to give a guy who is a known embilsher the benefit of the doubt, something I doubt you'd do if you were in their shoes. I'm sure of a guy like Avery, Barnaby, Marchand, Gallagher got the benefit of the doubt calls against the Leafs you'd be screaming from the tallest rooftop.

 

[Bluelines]

I'm still not convinced Kadri Dives or embellishes more than any other player. Do you not watch him play? The guy looses his balance and wipes out all the times on his own without any players around him. That's just the way he skates. Yes this has been a benifit to us because it doesn't take much contact for him to loose his balance but it doesn't mean he's diving. If a ref sees him diving then yes call a penalty but it doesn't mean you are aloud to stop following the rule book when you feel like it. If they want to make it personal then we need to replace them with robots.

Yes I've seen him play and he has some of the best edges in the league, I find it hard to believe he goes down like he's shot sometimes and then looks like a ballerina on his edges at other times.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

What better way to send a message to Naz than to stop giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Refs are people, just like any one else, they take people trying to manipulate them in a personal way, they take pride in getting their calls right. After every game the NHL will send a"pack" of bad and good calls to the refs for them to review before their next game.

If your constantly seeing the same guy over and over again in the embellishment category, when that guy falls to the ice you will be less likely to give him the benefit of the doubt. the old saying about you made your bed now sleep in it is apt for Naz in this circumstance.

Naz needs to rebuild the trust of the refs if he wishes to get those calls again. Lets see in our next game if Babs calling out the refs has any impact.

A better way would probably be to consistently call penalties where they exist and don't where they do not. Instead of trying to fix the player, maybe there's something else they could fix?

 

[Gallagbi]

So then am I to assume that you don't agree with the calls that were in the Leafs favour in which embellishment occurred?

Correct. There have been times he should have received an embellishment call.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

No you are missing the point, if the refs call a penailty that is not a penality ,is that not blowing the call also? If a guy who is known to make a play look like a penality when it is not, as a ref do you ask yourself is he faking again or is it legit?
The refs are saying hey Kadri we know you are a sneaky cheat and for that reason you no longer get the benefit of the doubt. Fool me once ...

What you are asking for is for the refs to give a guy who is a known embilsher the benefit of the doubt, something I doubt you'd do if you were in their shoes. I'm sure of a guy like Avery, Barnaby, Marchand, Gallagher got the benefit of the doubt calls against the Leafs you'd be screaming from the tallest rooftop.

How often have called penalties against Kadri NOT been actual penalties? I can't think of very many. If that's the case, what we're talking about is people calling the game on ego and pride rather than actual results.

 

[Gallagbi]

No you are missing the point, if the refs call a penailty that is not a penality ,is that not blowing the call also? If a guy who is known to make a play look like a penality when it is not, as a ref do you ask yourself is he faking again or is it legit?
The refs are saying hey Kadri we know you are a sneaky cheat and for that reason you no longer get the benefit of the doubt. Fool me once ...

What you are asking for is for the refs to give a guy who is a known embilsher the benefit of the doubt, something I doubt you'd do if you were in their shoes. I'm sure of a guy like Avery, Barnaby, Marchand, Gallagher got the benefit of the doubt calls against the Leafs you'd be screaming from the tallest rooftop.

I'm asking for the correct calls to be made.

You know, asking them to do their job. It's pretty crazy and out there, but that's how I roll.

Funny you mention Marchand, he drew a penalty last game.

 

[deletethis]

Fine or not, this is an attempt to reverse an obvious recent refereeing bias against Kadri starting a few weeks ago. It isn't like Kadri is diving over sticks. He's getting fouled to some extent when he goes down. What we really have are rule violators who rely on getting away with obstruction because their man stays on his feet whining that Kadri goes down too easily when fouled. Cry me river.

I was more pissed that that dirtbag McQuaid only got a tripping penalty against Brown. He shoved the prone sliding Brown face first into the boards. That was a dangerous play and the type of garbage the league shouldn't tolerate.

 

[diceman934]

Lost in all of this is the fact that since Babcock called the refs out a short while ago the refs are not calling penalties on Kadri.

Kadri got hit from behind....he did not make the player do it...it was an obvious call, same as the late hit at the end of the second period.

 

[Gallagbi]

Giroux was hit from behind in a similar manner. Worse result (concussion), but also a 5 minute major in a close game late.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

Lost in all of this is the fact that since Babcock called the refs out a short while ago the refs are not calling penalties on Kadri.

Kadri got hit from behind....he did not make the player do it...it was an obvious call, same as the late hit at the end of the second period.

Sounds like a league that needs to talk to its employees.

 

[Anthrax442]

Kadri is turning into Sean Avery

 

[mcleex]

He still hasn't gotten fined for this? Has the NHL office been closed for Easter holiday lol

 

[burpsalot]

Since "we see it all the time" can you give us some examples? Or are you just blindly hating on Kadri again like 90% of your other posts?

Seems kind of irrational for a player to intentionally try and cause serious injury to themselves don't you think?

Your suggesting Kadri is putting his own health in jeopardy to get a call...think about that for a second. It doesn't seem to me that you're too concerned with Kadri since it's obvious you don't like him, get a grip man.

Ulf is right, it does happen all the time, to varying degrees, multiple times in every game. In fact you also have some idiot coaches teaching it to kids in minor hockey. "Turn your back on the player, that way they can't hit you & if they do, they get a penalty."

 

[Bluelines]

How often have called penalties against Kadri NOT been actual penalties? I can't think of very many. If that's the case, what we're talking about is people calling the game on ego and pride rather than actual results.

If you have to embellish to get a call, why embellish?

 

[Bluelines]

I'm asking for the correct calls to be made.

You know, asking them to do their job. It's pretty crazy and out there, but that's how I roll.

Funny you mention Marchand, he drew a penalty last game.

Have you ever been a referee in a competitive a game?

 

[Darkside Blue]

Ulf is right, it does happen all the time, to varying degrees, multiple times in every game. In fact you also have some idiot coaches teaching it to kids in minor hockey. "Turn your back on the player, that way they can't hit you & if they do, they get a penalty."

I think it does happen fairly often. In the Buffalo game, where Hyman hit McCabe from behind, Mike Johnston mentioned that he thought that McCabe deliberately put himself in a bad position, and in general players had to do more to protect themselves, when close to the boards. I hate watching guys get the puck right at the boards, then take a look over their shoulder and take one step away from the boards, in effect daring players to take a potential boarding penalty if they go after the puck.

I'm glad Babber's calling out the refs. The Toronto affect for referees has been around for a long time. Someone here published an article about Joe Niewendyk, where he mentioned that it took him a while after joining the Leafs to realise that there was a different standard for Leaf teams. He got called for stuff he didn't get called for when he was on other teams, and other teams got away with stuff that Leaf teams couldn't.

It'd be nice to see the team flex a little bit more of their financial muscle, and start delaying the transfer cheques to the league, at least until the league promises to look into the situation. I'm sure even now Lou's debating driving Bettman around in the trunk of his car, until he starts to see things more clearly.

 

[Bluelines]

Fine or not, this is an attempt to reverse an obvious recent refereeing bias against Kadri starting a few weeks ago. .

It puts Kadri in a dangerous position, players see that the refs are not calling offences vs Kadri, considering the type of "rat" game Kadri plays. Some players might think to get back at Naz they can get away with more vs Naz,so a little extra this and that on Naz , refs might turn their cheek, it could put Naz in a situation where he could get hurt.

Naz you've made your bed now you have to sleep in it.