Babcock interview

Henkka

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Jan 31, 2004
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Cleary beat Tatar for a roster spot last season. So did Samuelsson and Bertuzzi. I'm unconvinced by Babcock's words.

For a season start? Yes.

But after the season progressed, Tatar and other kids did beat those vets out from the lineup one-by-one. They stole the jobs. And even when those vets became healthy again, kids stayed on the roster and vets were healthy scratches.

1st game of the season doesn't really tell anything who beat whom about a spot. The whole season progress tells the REAL story.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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Aug 11, 2009
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For a season start? Yes.

But after the season progressed, Tatar and other kids did beat those vets out from the lineup one-by-one. They stole the jobs. And even when those vets became healthy again, kids stayed on the roster and vets were healthy scratches.

1st game of the season doesn't really tell anything who beat whom about a spot. The whole season progress tells the REAL story.

to be fair, they stole thsoe jobs in large part because of injuries

had those injuries either not taken place or bene for less period of time, it could ahve been a whole other story

if cleary can remain healthy i fully expect him to play more games then sheahan or jurco this season
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
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to be fair, they stole thsoe jobs in large part because of injuries

had those injuries either not taken place or bene for less period of time, it could ahve been a whole other story

if cleary can remain healthy i fully expect him to play more games then sheahan or jurco this season

No way in hell he plays more games than Sheahan.
 

ArGarBarGar

What do we want!? Unfair!
Sep 8, 2008
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to be fair, they stole thsoe jobs in large part because of injuries

had those injuries either not taken place or bene for less period of time, it could ahve been a whole other story

if cleary can remain healthy i fully expect him to play more games then sheahan or jurco this season
That sounds like an avatar bet waiting to happen!
 

Actual Thought*

Guest
to be fair, they stole thsoe jobs in large part because of injuries

had those injuries either not taken place or bene for less period of time, it could ahve been a whole other story

if cleary can remain healthy i fully expect him to play more games then sheahan or jurco this season

The season is fluid. Of course things change when you have injuries. That doesn't mean MB/KH hate kids. Maybe off ice Cleary works ten times harder than Tatar and Babcock gave Cleary ice time to demonstrate to the kids that it isn't only what you do on the ice. Cleary is showing more commitment and character so he plays even if he's hurt. Cleary knows how to be an every dayer. He has been in the league a long time. He won a stanley cup. He is a role player not a superstar. I think having that type of guy around is valuable as a teacher and an influence. Apparently MB/KH think so too.
 

ap3x

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Jan 31, 2014
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We don't need to discuss, if it's helpful to add a role model. But we've some experienced vets already, Cleary is superfluous, honestly...
 

Frk It

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Jul 27, 2010
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The season is fluid. Of course things change when you have injuries. That doesn't mean MB/KH hate kids. Maybe off ice Cleary works ten times harder than Tatar and Babcock gave Cleary ice time to demonstrate to the kids that it isn't only what you do on the ice. Cleary is showing more commitment and character so he plays even if he's hurt. Cleary knows how to be an every dayer. He has been in the league a long time. He won a stanley cup. He is a role player not a superstar. I think having that type of guy around is valuable as a teacher and an influence. Apparently MB/KH think so too.

Other guys do this, while not being bad.

Zetterberg does this every year. Datsyuk does this. Kronwall does this.

As ap3x noted, there is no need for Cleary.
 

Actual Thought*

Guest
Other guys do this, while not being bad.

Zetterberg does this every year. Datsyuk does this. Kronwall does this.

As ap3x noted, there is no need for Cleary.
Z, D, and K are on a different level than everyone else. Cleary is our only veteran "mucker" who won the cup in 08. Drapes used to fill that character roll. I think now they are looking to fill it with Cleary. I suspect KH/MB think there is value in that roll being filled as part of building a character team which is essential. Being able to skate isn't the only requirement for being a Red Wing.
 

silkyjohnson50

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Jan 10, 2007
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Being able to skate isn't a requirement at all apparently.

I'm so freaking sick of this attempted reasoning for Cleary. Just call it what it is: it's a terrible signing. Holland himself basically admitted it. Not everything is perfect and this isn't a land of rainbows and butterflies. Stop living in a Red Wings fantasy land where everything has a good reason and makes sense and there are no mistakes. Wake up and face reality. It was a stupid decision and it should have never came down to it. It was absurd that they brought back Cleary last year. And yet here we are again. Stop rolling out the excuses. It was stupid.

Btw. That latest excuse is a slap in the face to the veterans. "Oh, you guys aren't the type of role models we need. Dan Cleary does it."
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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No way in hell he plays more games than Sheahan.

I dont even think IF the team is healthy, again IF, that sheahan even makes the opening night roster

with zetts, dats, weiss, helm, glendenig and andersson all capable NHL centres signed to NHL contracts I see sheahan as the odd man out
 

Frk It

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I dont even think IF the team is healthy, again IF, that sheahan even makes the opening night roster

with zetts, dats, weiss, helm, glendenig and andersson all capable NHL centres signed to NHL contracts I see sheahan as the odd man out

I think there is no way he isn't a top 9 forward on opening night. I would bet whatever you want on that.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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Aug 11, 2009
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I think there is no way he isn't a top 9 forward on opening night. I would bet whatever you want on that.

zetts
dats
abby
weiss
nyquist
franzen
tatar
helm
alffie*
cleary

those 10 guys may say otherwise

4th line
cleary*
miller
glendening
andersson

four guys for the final four spots
 

Big Poppa Puck

HF's Villain
Dec 8, 2009
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Sheahan is 100% on the opening day roster and will be in the top 9. He will not clear waivers.

Dats
Z
Gus
Mule
Weiss
Alfie
Tatar
Sheahan
Helm
Abdelkader

are guaranteed

Then you have:
Jurco
Cleary
Glendening
Miller
Andersson
Ferraro
Callahan

battling for 4/5 spots. Jurco is the only one who doesn't have to go through waivers and I think the only way he isn't in GR is if Alfie doesn't return. Cleary is probably a safe bet to be on the team, unfortunately, but I don't think he's guaranteed to be in the lineup.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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Aug 11, 2009
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Detroit
Sheahan is 100% on the opening day roster and will be in the top 9. He will not clear waivers.

Dats
Z
Gus
Mule
Weiss
Alfie
Tatar
Sheahan
Helm
Abdelkader

are guaranteed

Then you have:
Jurco
Cleary
Glendening
Miller
Andersson
Ferraro
Callahan

battling for 4/5 spots. Jurco is the only one who doesn't have to go through waivers and I think the only way he isn't in GR is if Alfie doesn't return. Cleary is probably a safe bet to be on the team, unfortunately, but I don't think he's guaranteed to be in the lineup.

sheahan dosent have to clear waivers to be in the press box does he?
 

silkyjohnson50

Registered User
Jan 10, 2007
11,301
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Lol at Sheahan being in the press box. I mean seriously? And before Cleary? Get real.

I'd love to make a bet. If Sheahan spends more games in the press box than Cleary, I'll never post on this forum again. If, however, Cleary spends more time in the press box than Sheanhan, you can't post again until game 1 of 2015-2016. That includes not creating another membership. No posting of any kind.
 

Tomas W

Registered User
Oct 23, 2007
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Sweden
Don't know why I come think of Bagdad Bob when listening to this...?

Of course though if DRW can somehow avoid getting the same amount of injuries as last season, we can still have a pretty competitive team.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

Registered User
Aug 11, 2009
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Detroit
Lol at Sheahan being in the press box. I mean seriously? And before Cleary? Get real.

I'd love to make a bet. If Sheahan spends more games in the press box than Cleary, I'll never post on this forum again. If, however, Cleary spends more time in the press box than Sheanhan, you can't post again until game 1 of 2015-2016. That includes not creating another membership. No posting of any kind.

I am not betting five different people so you're out for now

MOD

they didnt bring back cleary for nothing

if he is healthy then he plays

if he isnt then and only then he wont play
 
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silkyjohnson50

Registered User
Jan 10, 2007
11,301
1,178
I am not betting five different people so you're out for now

if you think that babcock and holland will sit a 100% healthy cleary over a rookie like sheahan you're nuts

MOD

A rookie like Sheahan isn't a rookie anymore. Additionally he's a center. Does Cleary suddenly play center?

People act like Cleary being healthy means he's suddenly going to be 2009 Cleary again. He can be 100% healthy, but that doesn't mean the years of aging are going to disappear. He's never going to be good at hockey again at the NHL level.

I'll sweeten the deal for you. If Cleary gets benched first, you can't post for a month. Only a month. If Sheahan gets benched first, I'll never post on here again (Red Wings forum only.)
 
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Hendricks433

Registered User
Feb 18, 2013
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0
I am not betting five different people so you're out for now

MOD

they didnt bring back cleary for nothing

if he is healthy then he plays

if he isnt then and only then he wont play

You do realize that Cleary playing has no impact on Sheahan right? Sheahan is a center and Cleary is a winger. The only way Sheahan sits is if Babcock plays Helm and Glendening as 3rd and 4th line centers and Weiss is healthy. Theres about .1% chance that happens probably less.
 
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Run the Jewels

Make Detroit Great Again
Jun 22, 2006
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I had a chance to listen to the interview. Overall it does nothing to diminish my respect for Babcock. Listening to him and Holland is night and day, Holland says nothing even remotely worth listening to, just bland platitudes that mean nothing. Babcock is largely willing to be frank and say what is true and he will also use these opportunities to motivate. He is a coach and motivation is a huge part of coaching.

Babs said all the right things:

  • The Wings went after 2 free agent d-men and struck out.
  • There are some big puck movers in Grand Rapids who they like alot.
  • Youth movement is huge, we need puck moving d-men who can get the puck out of our zone and get it into the offensive zone.
  • The prospects will be given every chance.
  • Cleary is working with Mike Barwis, who healed Pavel Datsyuk last year and took Elliot Mealer - a guy who was told he'd never walk again after a horrific car accident - and now has him walking.

I think it is in Babcock's best interest to push for the youth movement on defense. If he has any interest at all in continuing to coach in Detroit it's blatantly obvious Kindl, Quincey and Lashoff have no long term value to the team. It is debatable how much value Smith has going forward. So I can see him pushing to get Backman, Marchenko, Ouellet and Sproul ice time.

We all know what Holland will do: he'll bury guys who can get buried. He's not going to waive guys who will be forced onto the waiver wire, even if they are worth nothing. No takers for Kindl last year boys. Now does Babcock holding off on signing an extension make Holland more willing to do what Mike Babcock wants? Does he say "aw the hell with it, let me waive Kindl and Lashoff because Babcock tells me Ouellet and Marchenko or Backman and Sproul are better and beat them out"? Or does he says some idiocy like "We'd prefer to have the prospects play 25 minutes a night in Grand Rapids rather than 20 minutes a night Detroit"?

That right there is one of the main reasons why I want Holland "promoted" out of the general manager spot. If the best coach in hockey needs to pull these kind of antics to get the best roster possible it's clear Holland is no longer on top of his game.

Overall I am very interested to see how this season plays out. If Babcock can burn enough waiver wire exemptions for d-men - just like what happened last year with many of our top forward prospects - then he can decide whether he thinks the future is bright enough to stick around. If Holland sits around with his pud in his hands and sticks with the status quo I can see Babcock moving on to work with a GM who isn't past his sell-by date.

So make Kenneh dance, Babs! :yo: Regardless, Holland has fanned so badly on trades and signing free agents and incorporating youth into the roster that the writing is clearly on the wall for anyone who can bother to pay attention.
 

ricky0034

Registered User
Jun 8, 2010
15,060
7,285
to be fair, they stole thsoe jobs in large part because of injuries

had those injuries either not taken place or bene for less period of time, it could ahve been a whole other story

if cleary can remain healthy i fully expect him to play more games then sheahan or jurco this season

I agree on Jurco but I think Sheahan plays more than Cleary if Sheahan doesn't get injured or something mostly because he's a Center and so many of our centers had severe injury problems last year
 

Mister Ed

Registered User
Dec 21, 2008
5,256
969
Sheahan is 100% on the opening day roster and will be in the top 9. He will not clear waivers.

Dats
Z
Gus
Mule
Weiss
Alfie
Tatar
Sheahan
Helm
Abdelkader

are guaranteed

Then you have:
Jurco
Cleary
Glendening
Miller
Andersson
Ferraro
Callahan

I think that Glendening, Miller are on the 4th line, and Cleary sits in the press box. Andersson, Ferraro and Callahan are waived / in GR and called up in case of a bottom 6 injury. Jurco is the 1st call-up if someone in the top 6 is injured.
 

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