Rumor: Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 2017-18 Part V
- Thread starter tigervixxxen
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I seem to remember being told by someone on here that there is no way GMs were trying to low ball Sakic, and that it's all his fault for asking too much. GMs would never try and base Duchene's trade value on last season and pay the lowest possible price. You know, since they're all that desperate and competing for Duchene's services.
Of course in the next line after that paragraph Dreger talks about how there MUST be a #4 of #5 (lol wut?) defender available, so he should just simply take a defensemen.
Dreger has turned himself into the circus ring master.
agentblack
Registered User
I will agree that the rumored asks for a top 4 D in the current landscape is too much
When I first heard that I had a feeling it wouldn't get done
And to add a 1st plus a prospect on top of that. It seems pretty crazy he would think to get that
When I first heard that I had a feeling it wouldn't get done
And to add a 1st plus a prospect on top of that. It seems pretty crazy he would think to get that
- Apr 25, 2006
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I hate that the board has been ****ed since the last update and we can't paste stuff without having some characters replaced by all kinds of weird symbols. Admins/owners clearly chose money over functionality.
/Rant
/Rant
Avsblitzkrieg
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AvsMakar08
Registered User
I am one of those people that believe that other GM's are not giving Sakic good enough value back in a Duchene trade. Both, Hamonic who is getting older, had a poor season last season and Murray who is a 5th D man are not and should not be considered as a main piece coming back at least if PLD is not added. Teams are giving us bs offers for Duchene.
agentblack
Registered User
Maybe but I just can't see a team trading an important part of their blue line for 2 years if Duchene. One GM has said exactly that
With the exception of some truly elite forwards , a top 4 D that's >25 is worth than a top 6 fwd not just in value but in the way games are played now ...imo
- Apr 25, 2006
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It's not about the offers he gets, it's about the lack of proactiveness. Hamonic was reportedly offered as part of a "Hamonic + 1st + prospect" package and he (Hamonic) later got traded for a first and 2 second round picks. Sakic could have flipped Hamonic to the Flames himself.
So we know almost for sure that Duchene could have been traded for 2 first round picks, 2 second round picks and a prospect.
Edit (cont'): Now I don't think that prospect could have been Barzal but say Sakic were a fine negotiator and got Pulock...
Would you say that Ryan Pulock + Isles 1st 2018 + Flames 1st 2018 + Flames 2nd 2018 + Flames 2nd 2019 for Duchene + AVS 4th 2019 would have been a bad deal? That's a whole lot of rebuilding blocks right there!
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That's the problem here... Anyone who wants to argue against Sakic in this case can simply throw in some name that is acceptable as the final piece. When every single damn report that has come out of anyone's mouth has always been missing that final piece. How convenient
I guess I can't help but think if that final piece has actually been to an acceptable level. I don't know, maybe the damn trade would have been accepted, but alas it has not been.
Leaving that crap to the imagination is working in the medias favor in creating a never ending story. The evidence is right here on a daily basis.
- Apr 25, 2006
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The prospect is the less valuable piece of the deal so I highly doubt the name of the prospect was the dealbreaker here. But feel free to look at the same offer with Bellows instead of Pulock if that makes you feel better. Isles didn't offer a C prospect for sure.
JoemAvs
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- Jul 2, 2011
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I thought it was common knowledge that the prospect was MDC?
Which kinda makes this offer not all that great. Especially given the fact that Sakic wouldn't have been able to flip Hamonic because he desperately wants that Dman and can't sell a deal where the Avs have nothing to show for Duchene next season....
I mean Dater said it a couple of days ago in that hockeybuzz podcast. Sakic wants to win the press conference and is scared of another futures deal because of the backlash he got for ROR and is therefore unwilling to do another one.
So while at this stage 2 1sts+ 2nd and a meh prospect like MDC might sound good to you, it probably does not sound all that enticing to Sakic.
Honestly I would want Beauvillier in that deal personally as well.
Flames pick will be very late and who the hell knows about the Islanders.
And I am not exactly a fan of what the Avs have done in the draft with their later 1st round picks recently...
There is honestly no way to salvage this right now. IMO Duchene will be back for better or worse.
Lets just hope that he starts off really hot for the first 20-30 games and that one of the interested teams has a bad start and gets desperate.
IMO our only chance of not getting completely screwed right now.
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Vaslof
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- Feb 1, 2017
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I had to install a script blocker just to use this site. So bloated with who knows what.
Not realistic to expect the same deal to have gone down.
It's not just Sakic, almost every GM is afraid to make trades that aren't non-brainers. It's not that they're trying to bully him by lowballing, but those prices they could pay without any fear of making the team worse.
Link to article from Greg Wyshynski about Matt Duchene:
https://sports.yahoo.com/matt-duchene-deserves-better-131631408.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=tw
Basically describes how much of an ordeal Duchene has had to endure and how mean the Colorado Avalanche have been in its treatment of him.
Maybe someday soon someone will make a movie about all of the hardships Duchene has had to overcome in the past year. It has been an unbelievable survival story and test of intestinal fortitude (yes, this is sarcasm, as I believe some people need to really gain some perspective in life).
https://sports.yahoo.com/matt-duchene-deserves-better-131631408.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=tw
Basically describes how much of an ordeal Duchene has had to endure and how mean the Colorado Avalanche have been in its treatment of him.
Maybe someday soon someone will make a movie about all of the hardships Duchene has had to overcome in the past year. It has been an unbelievable survival story and test of intestinal fortitude (yes, this is sarcasm, as I believe some people need to really gain some perspective in life).
Quote from a poster named XIsle over on the Islanders board:
"And another thing I learned from Bossy on the radio here in Montreal is that he's not a fan of Matt Duchene. He said he heard that Duchene is not liked by his teammates and that if he was GM, he would not want to acquire him."
I can't verify the accuracy of what this poster is indicating that Bossy said on radio, but I am not sure I like the statements that Duchene is somehow a bad influence in the locker room. It seems like kicking someone while they are down and I have seen this song and dance routine before, where someone heading out from an organization is suddenly a "locker room cancer."
"And another thing I learned from Bossy on the radio here in Montreal is that he's not a fan of Matt Duchene. He said he heard that Duchene is not liked by his teammates and that if he was GM, he would not want to acquire him."
I can't verify the accuracy of what this poster is indicating that Bossy said on radio, but I am not sure I like the statements that Duchene is somehow a bad influence in the locker room. It seems like kicking someone while they are down and I have seen this song and dance routine before, where someone heading out from an organization is suddenly a "locker room cancer."
agentblack
Registered User
So I guess the Isles are out of it too
Rejection sucks
Columbus is looking more and more likely
Maybe after the holiday weekend now that the Wennberg situation is sorted
Rejection sucks
Columbus is looking more and more likely
Maybe after the holiday weekend now that the Wennberg situation is sorted
bohlmeister
...................
- May 18, 2007
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IMO, it is uncommon for a GM to let the players name get dragged through the mud like Sakic has. That is a big mistep. Even if he is trying to trade him, he needs to address it. Sutter said multiple times that Dion Phaneuf was not going to be traded, then one Saturday flipped him to Toronto. That is a better way to handle it.
The media is to blame, but I think that is because Sakic is such a terrible GM. He doesn't know the direction. How do you interview Dubas and then do nothing. How are Landeskog and Duchene's names thrown around for 3/4's of an NHL season and now full offseason, and you do nothing. How do you finish last by a country mile, and not make any major organizational changes. These are all things that go on unaddressed. And when there is no news, and no answers coming from the top, people wonder. The only time Sakic does address media he sounds even more unsure, and you leave with even more question marks.
When Roy spoke, you left with a good feeling. He knew exactly what needed to be addressed, and he addressed them. Sakic..... is a media disaster. Not articulate and certainly doesn't instil any confidence when you listen to him speak. Him at the draft lottery was a joke. Like WTF are you even talking about Joe. Send someone else. Why isn't MacFarland talking to the media?
- Jul 25, 2006
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If Sakic was a good GM he could sell Duchene not based on last year's numbers. Johansen only played 38 games and had 6 goals in his last season as a Jacket, they got Jones for him. Ok, i was mistaking, that was half the season with Jackets and he was traded, and had a 70 point season before that, but still, a good GM might be able to convince other GM's that Duchene just had a down year on a team that had 48 points.
The only problem here is that Sakic is just a bad GM, plain and simple. He's slowly but surely screwing up the Duchene situation to the point where they'll only get peanuts in return or just lose him to free agency. Everyone who goes to Avs games this year at Pepsi Center should yell "Fire Sakic"
The only problem here is that Sakic is just a bad GM, plain and simple. He's slowly but surely screwing up the Duchene situation to the point where they'll only get peanuts in return or just lose him to free agency. Everyone who goes to Avs games this year at Pepsi Center should yell "Fire Sakic"
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I think you are greatly simplifying the Johansen situation, as he was several years younger and had several more years of RFA status before becoming a UFA. I think this is a big distinction from Duchene currently.
Seems like a reasonable summary, although I would not agree with every point.
I do find it interesting about how the media has been harping on the Duchene situation for so long, but not Landeskog. I do not recall Sakic coming out at any point and saying that he would not trade Landeskog, or that Landeskog was not on the trading block, yet the media has not obsessively focused on him as they have with Duchene. Some of that may be attributable to Landeskog being more emphatic about wanting to remain in Colorado, compared to Duchene's non-committal statements. I still, however, find it strange how the two situations have been portrayed in the media.
UncleRisto
Not Great, Bob!
Yeah, 6 goals and 20 assists and then he scored another 8+26 that season and finished with 60 points (one more than Duchene that year) and another 8 in the playoffs.
agentblack
Registered User
Some one sell me on a Murray/Milano 2nd pkg , is it that bad? Esp if there's conditions on the pick?
- Jul 25, 2006
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I edited my post about Johansen, I was mistaking and he was traded half way into the season and had a 70 point season before that. I know it's hard to trade a player that had a bad season like Duchene did, but as I said, a good GM would be able to convince other GM's that it was just a down season for Duchene on a bad team that finished with 48 points.
agentblack
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