Avatar: The Last Airbender

[Randy Butternubs]

Giving this thread a bump as I just finished the third and final season on Saturday night. What a great series.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Yeah, great series, and a shame what has happened with all the live-action. The movie being the bust that it was, and the creators having creative differences with Netflix and that live-action show.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Yeah, great series, and a shame what has happened with all the live-action. The movie being the bust that it was, and the creators having creative differences with Netflix and that live-action show.

I wasn't even aware that there was going to be a live-action Netflix series of this until this morning.

 

[HanSolo]

Watched Korra too. I mean. TLA was always gonna be a tough act to follow and Korra is still a lot better and more mature than most shows in its genre but man does it miss the mark in a lot of ways. I think my biggest gripe was that outside the first season, the whole big baddie of the season format made for a less focused narrative arc and made the whole thing feel like they didn't really have a full plan for the whole story. And it's even worse that the Earth kingdom facist wanna be dictator in the final season was the least compelling of the bunch, and made for the least satisfying finale of the four.

I can say that the character work, for the most part is pretty solid, and it has its share of touching moments (though the Korra Asami relationship was woefully underwritten and rushed). And developments in animation allowed Korra to have action sequences that often outshined TLA.

Unfortunately it just doesn't have the same quality as TLA. I can see myself rewatching that series several times but I don't see much point in rewatching Korra.

 

[HanSolo]

I wasn't even aware that there was going to be a live-action Netflix series of this until this morning.

Apparently the creators of the original series dropped out so I'm not really hopeful it's gonna be any good.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Watched Korra too. I mean. TLA was always gonna be a tough act to follow and Korra is still a lot better and more mature than most shows in its genre but man does it miss the mark in a lot of ways. I think my biggest gripe was that outside the first season, the whole big baddie of the season format made for a less focused narrative arc and made the whole thing feel like they didn't really have a full plan for the whole story. And it's even worse that the Earth kingdom facist wanna be dictator in the final season was the least compelling of the bunch, and made for the least satisfying finale of the four.

I can say that the character work, for the most part is pretty solid, and it has its share of touching moments (though the Korra Asami relationship was woefully underwritten and rushed). And developments in animation allowed Korra to have action sequences that often outshined TLA.

Unfortunately it just doesn't have the same quality as TLA. I can see myself rewatching that series several times but I don't see much point in rewatching Korra.

I just finished Korra today and also really enjoyed this series. It's very likely that I like TLA over TLOK, but I've only seen both series once.

Korra's seasons, for me, ranked worst to best as: 2, 4, 1, 3.

I thought Season 1 started off strong and really liked the main villain, Amon (spelling?). Would've been neat if he continued to be the baddie throughout the series.

And then Season 2 happened and I felt like it was a bit of a re-hash of a villain in the first season. It's someone who gets Korra's trust and then betrays her. Didn't help that it was another water tribe person. And I didn't care much for the spirit world stuff.

Season 3 had villains who were intelligent and deadly. I genuinely thought the group was in danger. Especially since I heard that Korra had PTSD in season 4.

Like you said, the Earth kingdom fascist in Season 4 just wasn't that compelling. Though I really enjoyed Korra's path to recovery.

There were plenty of characters to like. Such as, probably my favorite, Varrick. What a jerk.

 

[HanSolo]

I just finished Korra today and also really enjoyed this series. It's very likely that I like TLA over TLOK, but I've only seen both series once.

Korra's seasons, for me, ranked worst to best as: 2, 4, 1, 3.

I thought Season 1 started off strong and really liked the main villain, Amon (spelling?). Would've been neat if he continued to be the baddie throughout the series.

And then Season 2 happened and I felt like it was a bit of a re-hash of a villain in the first season. It's someone who gets Korra's trust and then betrays her. Didn't help that it was another water tribe person. And I didn't care much for the spirit world stuff.

Season 3 had villains who were intelligent and deadly. I genuinely thought the group was in danger. Especially since I heard that Korra had PTSD in season 4.

Like you said, the Earth kingdom fascist in Season 4 just wasn't that compelling. Though I really enjoyed Korra's path to recovery.

There were plenty of characters to like. Such as, probably my favorite, Varrick. What a jerk.

I gave it a second rewatch recently. Liked it more the second time but I still feel in some respects there was a fair bit of wasted potential.

Varrick is one of the best characters in both shows. He could've so easily been cringe as hell but he was genuinely a scene stealer almost every time he appeared.

Though I'd add a few things:

-man Mako is such a bland character. It's like if you had Zuko be a good guy all along but strip away literally everything that made him compelling.

-I was way more engaged in the Beifong family dramas the second time around, thought it was one of the stronger parts of the show. Unironically liked Lin more than most of the "main" characters.

-Agree with the criticism on Unalaqq, the voice actor does his best but ultimately the whole plot he's behind feels a bit whatever. Though the episode about the first avatar was probably the strongest in the whole series and exceeds many ATLA episodes and it doesn't exist without the plot as written.

-Again, the Asami/Korra relationship is just so frustratingly half baked. There's enough there that it doesn't feel completely shoehorned in but there's not enough that it really felt like a natural end to the story. I understand that Nick probably didn't want to ruffle too many feathers with an LGBT coupling but it's the last shot of the series. It feels like there should've at least been a little more development than what it got. But on that note, the final 5 minutes of the show still felt rushed in saying goodbye to everyone. Hardly any characters got a deserved send off and it felt frustrating. Would've worked if there was plans for a fifth season but there wasn't. Felt like they were worn out animating the final battle and did the final scenes just cause they were necessary.

-I wasn't as jazzed about Jinora's progression the second time around. Really felt like they just shoehorned in a female Aang without mastery of the four elements. Just didn't feel fleshed out enough to be earned.

-As a whole though, the emotional beats felt more earned the second time I watched through. Doesn't reach the peaks of ATLA (I don't think the scene of Iroh hugging and forgiving Zuko, just as one example, will ever fail to make me tear up) in that regard but I did feel the heart of this show a lot more the second time.

 

[hoyster]

I don't know if you're aware but there are two 3-part comics that follow TLOK show and are worth a read. Turf Wars and Ruins of an Empire, the former which continues right where the show ended.

There's also a bunch of Avatar comics, which I haven't read yet (There's more still to come).

I think you can read all of these online...

 

[HanSolo]

I don't know if you're aware but there are two 3-part comics that follow TLOK show and are worth a read. Turf Wars and Ruins of an Empire, the former which continues right where the show ended.

There's also a bunch of Avatar comics, which I haven't read yet (There's more still to come).

I think you can read all of these online...

I read a couple of the ATLA comics. Haven't checked out the Korra ones yet but I still don't think an undercooked relationship gets excused by adding expanded materials after the fact.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

@Sugar Domi you mentioned in the anime thread that you liked Avatar and Korra. Just wanted to get your thoughts on the two series.

I gave it a second rewatch recently. Liked it more the second time but I still feel in some respects there was a fair bit of wasted potential.

Varrick is one of the best characters in both shows. He could've so easily been cringe as hell but he was genuinely a scene stealer almost every time he appeared.

Though I'd add a few things:

-man Mako is such a bland character. It's like if you had Zuko be a good guy all along but strip away literally everything that made him compelling.

-I was way more engaged in the Beifong family dramas the second time around, thought it was one of the stronger parts of the show. Unironically liked Lin more than most of the "main" characters.

-Agree with the criticism on Unalaqq, the voice actor does his best but ultimately the whole plot he's behind feels a bit whatever. Though the episode about the first avatar was probably the strongest in the whole series and exceeds many ATLA episodes and it doesn't exist without the plot as written.

-Again, the Asami/Korra relationship is just so frustratingly half baked. There's enough there that it doesn't feel completely shoehorned in but there's not enough that it really felt like a natural end to the story. I understand that Nick probably didn't want to ruffle too many feathers with an LGBT coupling but it's the last shot of the series. It feels like there should've at least been a little more development than what it got. But on that note, the final 5 minutes of the show still felt rushed in saying goodbye to everyone. Hardly any characters got a deserved send off and it felt frustrating. Would've worked if there was plans for a fifth season but there wasn't. Felt like they were worn out animating the final battle and did the final scenes just cause they were necessary.

-I wasn't as jazzed about Jinora's progression the second time around. Really felt like they just shoehorned in a female Aang without mastery of the four elements. Just didn't feel fleshed out enough to be earned.

-As a whole though, the emotional beats felt more earned the second time I watched through. Doesn't reach the peaks of ATLA (I don't think the scene of Iroh hugging and forgiving Zuko, just as one example, will ever fail to make me tear up) in that regard but I did feel the heart of this show a lot more the second time.

I've read a few articles and watched a number of videos about Korra's production since last night. Apparently Nickelodeon meddled quite a bit and likely made things worse off. For example, they didn't want the protagonist to be female. And also: apparently Season/Chapter 1 was supposed to just be a mini-series. But then Nick changed their mind and ordered more seasons and had things rushed. But then Nick cut funding at some point after Season 2. And I think they kept cutting funding, because they forced Season 4 to have a clip show...

I imagine the creative team would've come up with better arcs for characters and perhaps kept one main villain. Maybe they would have even had Amon and the Red Lotus team up (that, as of now, is my LOK dream). And the Asami relationship would've likely been better developed. It just seems like the team behind Korra did the best with what they were given.

Me knowing that Korra ended up with Asami at the end of the series even before I started watching made me pick up on smaller interactions between them throughout the entirety of the show. Nickelodeon being more supportive of "new" ideas and directions certainly would have helped.

I don't know if you're aware but there are two 3-part comics that follow TLOK show and are worth a read. Turf Wars and Ruins of an Empire, the former which continues right where the show ended.

There's also a bunch of Avatar comics, which I haven't read yet (There's more still to come).

I think you can read all of these online...

I do plan on giving them a read, but I feel like I should get the Adventure Time comics first.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

 

[Randy Butternubs]

CC'ing @Peat since I saw they had some tweets about TLoK.

 

[Peat]

Discovered AtLA earlier this year for the first time after one of my friends wouldn't shut up about it, and have already watched it twice all the way through. As pretty much everyone else has said - it's just really good. Pretty much everything it tries to do, it nails.

I've started watching TLoK and have a bunch of blog posts on it if people are curious, but my take on just the first series is that it's a bit of a poorly written mess, with too much shoved into too little, and I'd never fully like it as it walks away from some of my favourite bits of AtLA. It's got some charm to it but so much frustration due to the wasted potential and it being a sequel to a better work. It's like Commando was the sequel to Apocalypse Now (okay, that's a really bad example, but you get the idea).

Also, so far I see Korra as the most Zuko-like character. Mako has Zuko's exterior, but Korra has early Zuko's actions and thoughts.

 

[HanSolo]

Discovered AtLA earlier this year for the first time after one of my friends wouldn't shut up about it, and have already watched it twice all the way through. As pretty much everyone else has said - it's just really good. Pretty much everything it tries to do, it nails.

I've started watching TLoK and have a bunch of blog posts on it if people are curious, but my take on just the first series is that it's a bit of a poorly written mess, with too much shoved into too little, and I'd never fully like it as it walks away from some of my favourite bits of AtLA. It's got some charm to it but so much frustration due to the wasted potential and it being a sequel to a better work. It's like Commando was the sequel to Apocalypse Now (okay, that's a really bad example, but you get the idea).

Also, so far I see Korra as the most Zuko-like character. Mako has Zuko's exterior, but Korra has early Zuko's actions and thoughts.

Couldn't think of a better comparison for Mako tbh. He still has some of Zuko's hotheadedness and a touch of his social awkwardness. But really the more I think about him the more I realize he's a character I think they meant to do more with but once you get past his former life of crime there's really not much to him and not much he contributes other than being a well above average firebender helping the Avatar. I mean you haven't seen all of it so I don't want to say too much but going forward Bolin has more of the compelling story lines. Mako rarely rises above "dude who helps sometimes"

 

[Peat]

Couldn't think of a better comparison for Mako tbh. He still has some of Zuko's hotheadedness and a touch of his social awkwardness. But really the more I think about him the more I realize he's a character I think they meant to do more with but once you get past his former life of crime there's really not much to him and not much he contributes other than being a well above average firebender helping the Avatar. I mean you haven't seen all of it so I don't want to say too much but going forward Bolin has more of the compelling story lines. Mako rarely rises above "dude who helps sometimes"

"Not much going on" would be my summation of his existence in the first series as well.

 

[HanSolo]

Just a random thought but I really think the overmodernization of the Avatar continent really took away the folkloreian charm that ATLA had. In many ways watching ATLA felt like you were watching a real life folk story or mythological tale unfold. In ATLA the fire nation employed superior machines of war that hinted at the dawning of pre-industrial growth and development but it didn't overpower the aesthetic of the setting. Having a setting a decade or two away from smart phones really sucked a lot of the charm out of the whole thing. And I get that maybe this was deliberate commentary about modernization and how it severs ties to traditions and spirituality but I don't feel like that came off all that well.

"Not much going on" would be my summation of his existence in the first series as well.

I mean. I guess love triangle and the quest to get Bolin back revealing his backstory is something. I really don't mean to spoil because in spite of LOK being objectively weaker, it's still a worthy entry in the narrative universe overall and should be watched by anyone who enjoyed ATLA. However, it gets worse for Mako. It would be disingenuous to say he's completely irrelevant to the plot but you could replace him with a new character and more or less have the same effect.

 

[Peat]

Just a random thought but I really think the overmodernization of the Avatar continent really took away the folkloreian charm that ATLA had. In many ways watching ATLA felt like you were watching a real life folk story or mythological tale unfold. In ATLA the fire nation employed superior machines of war that hinted at the dawning of pre-industrial growth and development but it didn't overpower the aesthetic of the setting. Having a setting a decade or two away from smart phones really sucked a lot of the charm out of the whole thing. And I get that maybe this was deliberate commentary about modernization and how it severs ties to traditions and spirituality but I don't feel like that came off all that well.

Amen to that.

I mean. I guess love triangle and the quest to get Bolin back revealing his backstory is something. I really don't mean to spoil because in spite of LOK being objectively weaker, it's still a worthy entry in the narrative universe overall and should be watched by anyone who enjoyed ATLA. However, it gets worse for Mako. It would be disingenuous to say he's completely irrelevant to the plot but you could replace him with a new character and more or less have the same effect.

He did stuff, but he wasn't really anyone. Like you say, they could have replaced him with someone else entirely.

But we'll see. Planning to start Book 2 later this week.

 

[HanSolo]

A whole mess of Avatar content is about to head our way

‘Avatar: The Last Airbender’ Franchise To Expand With Launch Of Nickelodeon’s Avatar Studios, Animated Theatrical Film In The Works

Ordinarily would be opposed to the Avatar universe being Marvelized but I welcome the idea of more stories in this universe and

The original creators and executive producers Michael DiMartino and Bryan Konietzko will run the studio as co-chief creative officers, reporting to Ramsey Naito, President, Nickelodeon Animation.

So that's promising. As long as it's in Micheal and Bryan's hands, the projects should at least be of solid quality.