Post-Game Talk: Avalanche @ Rangers - December 3

[offdacrossbar]

i don't think its jump ship time yet. not at all.

i think we are capable of getting it together soon. the stepan and klein thing will hurt more than we think.

if we can get through this stretch and get them back healthy, i expect we will fine.

the biggest problem of all continues to be this team not getting any production really from both of their top horse scorers. when you have guys who were both expected to get 30 plus goals on pace for 20. thats bad.

unless nash and kreider catch fire, we will continue to lose games where we look anemic on offense and every defensive blunder ends up in our net.

 

[McRanger]

The Rangers team speed is extremely overrated at this point. They're an average speed team and losing Hagelin is hurting a lot more than some would admit.

The whole team looks slow including some players who are very fast. So I really have no idea how fast the team is because they never seem to be moving their feet towards the oppositions goal.

 

[Captain Lindy]

It's funny. Rangers are much better at Faceoffs, but much worse at everything else.

People were hoping for a team that was better at faceoffs. (Now we suck at hockey, good on faceoffs.) This fact reminds me of the joke about the head who finds the genie in a bottle.

 

[Captain Lindy]

i don't think its jump ship time yet. not at all.

i think we are capable of getting it together soon. the stepan and klein thing will hurt more than we think.

if we can get through this stretch and get them back healthy, i expect we will fine.

the biggest problem of all continues to be this team not getting any production really from both of their top horse scorers. when you have guys who were both expected to get 30 plus goals on pace for 20. thats bad.

unless nash and kreider catch fire, we will continue to lose games where we look anemic on offense and every defensive blunder ends up in our net.

Trouble is that "if" will be a time period of maybe more than two months; Klein's injury length of two weeks could be an optimistic guess. STeps will be out for two months.

 

[Captain Lindy]

Could it be possible the team messed up the chemistry with the Hagelin deal?

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Something I don't like about AV's system and haven't since he got here is his huge emphasis on the first pass from the defense. It's too restricting through the neutral zone and it feels like all of the Rangers chances come off of the other team's mistakes. That, and the Rangers' D are ****ing garbage at outlet passing. But even the ones that are good, it's hurting. Watch when the forwards are still in the zone and d-men constantly try to force exit passes to them, how often they get picked off and the opposing forecheck continues. This was a fine strategy when the Rangers' best carrier was John Moore back in 2014, and the Rangers were significantly faster, but the Rangers no longer have the speed or skill to complete clean, out-manned entries. There was plenty of dumping the puck from the 2014 team but they were so damn fast 1 forward could beat 3 defenders to the puck and before you knew it, the whole Rangers team were in position to forecheck. Keith Yandle is the 2nd best zone exit player in the NHL, carrying the puck through the neutral zone was Dan Boyle's calling card his whole career. The Rangers need better entries with support from their defense because they are just not suited to dump the puck. It is just not an option with this personnel.

I agree with your assessment in regard to the change in personnel, but a lot of this could be alleviated by a stronger back check instead of trying to find "Leetch-esque" zone exits and tape-2-tape outlet passes.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Can we take comfort in the fact that the team is winning faceoffs more than last year and the year before?

That has stopped as well.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Literally the reason half the Vancouver fan base wanted him gone at the time, iirc. Along with how he treated kids there.

They'd obviously take him back now though after the **** they've seen the past 2.5 years

So they were wrong?

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Could it be possible the team messed up the chemistry with the Hagelin deal?

Did the Ducks screw up in the Hagelin deal since they are sitting at 12th in the West and 25th in the league?

I'm not dissing Hagelin, but he's surely not the level of make or break player to cause such drastic changes to a team.

 

[Captain Lindy]

Did the Ducks screw up in the Hagelin deal since they are sitting at 12th in the West and 25th in the league?

I'm not dissing Hagelin, but he's surely not the level of make or break player to cause such drastic changes to a team.

It is not so much as him as a player, I mean chemistry wise with the team we have here. He clicked here.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

It is not so much as him as a player, I mean chemistry wise with the team we have here. He clicked here.

It definitely didn't help, but I'm trying to stear the ship away from the "if only the one guy" BS hypotheticals that creep in for middle 6 players during rough patches.

 

[Raspewtin]

Did the Ducks screw up in the Hagelin deal since they are sitting at 12th in the West and 25th in the league?

I'm not dissing Hagelin, but he's surely not the level of make or break player to cause such drastic changes to a team.

He's not but we took something we already suck at in winning footraces and retrieving and made it worse.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

He's not but we took something we already suck at in winning footraces and retrieving and made it worse.

I'm not saying that I don't miss Hagelin. At the right price, I wish he were still here. But I think he would be drowning with the team right now. There is a lot more going on here.

 

[Captain Lindy]

I'm not saying that I don't miss Hagelin. At the right price, I wish he were still here. But I think he would be drowning with the team right now. There is a lot more going on here.

I'm starting to think AV has lost this team???

 

[Megustaelhockey]

I'm starting to think AV has lost this team???

I really don't think so. AV seems less like a coach that loses the team and more like a coach that loses the front office.

 

[Raspewtin]

I'm not saying that I don't miss Hagelin. At the right price, I wish he were still here. But I think he would be drowning with the team right now. There is a lot more going on here.

I'm not disagreeing with you.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

I really don't think so. AV seems less like a coach that loses the team and more like a coach that loses the front office.

Honest question because I have no idea.

Is AV known to be abrasive to management? He doesn't seem to be a Keenan type power struggle coach.

 

[Megustaelhockey]

Honest question because I have no idea.

Is AV known to be abrasive to management? He doesn't seem to be a Keenan type power struggle coach.

Not openly abrasive that I know of. It's just his stubbornness comes across as arrogant and/or passive-aggressive.

 

[Machinehead]

So many forwards are disappointing. Hayes, Kreider, Brassard, Stalberg, Miller, Nash at times. But I've seen better from them. I know there's room to improve.

On defense, Staal and Girardi are what they are. McDonagh is the same garbage he was last year. There's no reason for me to believe it's getting any better for a long time.

 

[I Eat Crow]

So many forwards are disappointing. Hayes, Kreider, Brassard, Stalberg, Miller, Nash at times. But I've seen better from them. I know there's room to improve.

On defense, Staal and Girardi are what they are. McDonagh is the same garbage he was last year. There's no reason for me to believe it's getting any better for a long time.

I absolutely disagree. I actually think that Girardi's decline in the past couple of seasons has been so sharp that McDonagh is left dragging him around when paired with him.

I thought McDonagh looked absolutely fine when he was paired with Klein that handful of games earlier this season. Though I do agree that McDonagh will be basically what he is now; a top pairing defenseman that has a 40 point ceiling that skates very well and has good positioning in his own end.

 

[NYRFAN218]

So many forwards are disappointing. Hayes, Kreider, Brassard, Stalberg, Miller, Nash at times. But I've seen better from them. I know there's room to improve.

On defense, Staal and Girardi are what they are. McDonagh is the same garbage he was last year. There's no reason for me to believe it's getting any better for a long time.

Thing with Staal and Girardi is they're playing beyond horrible hockey. In the past they may have been okay or bad but they've taken it to a whole new level this season. I think we could at least expect them to bounce back to what they played like in the past season or two. Even that's an improvement over this **** show.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

The Dmen get a ton of blame around here, and rightfully so.

But the forwards share a fair bit of blame for not being able to keep the puck in the offensive zone worth a damn. The Rangers give up a ton of shots, a lot is bad breakouts/forcing turnovers in transition, but a lot is bad "keep ins" - and the point man making a play should be the last resort on keep ins. So many bad turnovers and lack of ability to cycle in the offensive zone.

How many times do we see a forward loop behind the offensive net, throw the puck to the blue line, and a dman slaps an iffy shot into traffic? Part of that is on a poor shot/lack of puck control from the D, but part of that is on the forward for having NO other option than coughing the puck backwards.

 

[OverTheCap]

I'm starting to think AV has lost this team???

I don't think he's lost the team in the same sense that Torts did. But the fact that AV keeps stressing that the puck management needs to be better and we have yet to see any sort of improvement in this area may indicate that something is amiss. There could be a disconnect between the players and the coaching staff. Watching video and doing whatever they do in practice hasn't succeeded in getting through to the players' thick skulls that they have to be more responsible in handling the puck.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Could it be possible the team messed up the chemistry with the Hagelin deal?

No. The problem is we didn't have the cap space to acquire a guy to replace MSL on the 2nd line. That 5.7m deal for Ginger Pirate is killing us.

 

[chosen]

Torts knew how to handle Kreider. If he doesn't want to play, send him down to the minors.