At what point would you fire DJ Smith?

[aragorn]

It's not the coaches fault that half the team or more is either injured or on Covid protocal, it's gotten so bad that the NHL has called off their next 3 games. You can't win in the NHL when half the team is from the AHL & you certainly can't win without quality goaltending which we are only really getting from one goalie, Gustavsson the AHL goalie. None of these things are the coach's fault. It's not the coaches fault that they lost Pinto, White & Bishop, three centres that they were counting on this yr.

We also can't blame the coach for the personnel the GM brought in & that includes on the defence. IMO the GM is waiting on their own defensive prospects to be NHL ready rather than spend big money on a better defenceman & that's on the GM not the coach. And we have seen that Thomson, JBD & Heatherington have all played well in their short stint here & it's just a matter of time before they move some of their UFA defencemen out. This yr is a write-off & most analysts agree that Ottawa would not make the playoffs this yr.

Exactly what could the coach have done differently? He had two NHL goalies on one way contracts which he had to play. He had on defence Holden & MDZ that the GM brought in & J. Brown the yr before. Zaitsev had a pretty good yr last yr, but has sucked this yr, not the coaches fault. Mete was good last yr, but also has sucked this yr. Brannstrom got off to a crappy start in Belleville & Thomson & JBD were closing ground on him & IMO Thomson has surpassed him. Given these circumstances they are not going to fire the coach & will certainly give him another yr. Unfortunately the GM also got extended so we are stuck with him.

 

[Bileur]

I don’t think this team will win with DJ and I’m starting to question his ability to develop players but I don’t think we’re at the point where he needs to be fired.

My biggest problem with this thread is that we don’t know what hand DJ will be dealt. If Melnyk loosens the purse strings this summer and Dorion goes out and (for example) signs Giroux and Connor Murphy, and then the Sens win the lottery and add Wright, then yes the expectation should be that DJ can win with that team. If they have another disastrous offseason like this last one where they add… say Sam Gagner expecting him to play in the top 6, then no.

Who expected them to be any better than they have been?

Bad roster is bad and injuries/covid just compounds their thin depth issue.

Lots of posters on here who complain about HFsens being negative expected them to be better.

Nope.

Even I, the eternal optimist around here said we'd have a 50/50 chance, only if Murray returned to his original form. Otherwise, I gave us a 1% chance:

The Ottawa Senators will make the playoffs this year.

OP’s name in that thread is pretty hilarious/ironic.

 

[aragorn]

Even though he's a bit of a troglodyte in his views on defensemen, it's not primarily DJ's fault the team blows.

The roster on paper that he was given is bottom 5 quality and that's where we're on track to finish.

He arguably had the team out-performing based on the quality of the players last season finishing 10th worst (albeit in a bad Canadian division), so he gets somewhat of a break from me after a disappointing start.

Management and the pro scouting team that thought Ennis, Holden, MDZ, Sanford, Gambrell would take this team to the next level are obviously at fault for the team taking a step back. Absolute morons.

This is nonsense, I doubt very much that any of their pro scouts or the Zambonni driver thought these guys would take them to the next level.

You don't think losing 3 centres to injury had something to do with it?
You don't think haven't 15 players out with injury & Covid protocal had something to do with it?
You don't think the fact that the AHL goalie is outperforming the two NHL goalies on one way contracts has something to do with it?
You don't think that the owner & GM who wouldn't spend the money in bringing in a better defenceman or two has something to do wtih it?

None of these things are the coaches fault, none of them. People also called Darryl Sutter & old school coach on here & worse things, now are praising him for turning the Flames around & DJ wants his team to play a similar style.

 

[Alf Silfversson]

The team was bad without losing half of it to infection / protocol. I think DJ Smith is a very one-dimensional coach who is not suited to winning in the modern NHL.

That being said he hasn't been given a good roster to work with yet. I think he makes bad personnel decisions and is not very good at implementing a system but none of this matters when you are given flat out bad players. I know he loves playing some of these stiffs but still the roster is just not good.

I think that:

1. He should not have been extended
2. He should be fired when we hire a competent replacement for Pierre Dorion

In this case bad coach is not (fully) responsible for a bad team.

Oh and Dorion needs to man up and stop acquiring players because they suit his coach. Hire a coach who can utilize players of all types then go out, build a team and tell your coach to get the most out of it.

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

Dorion has made many, many, terrible decisions as G.M but where are we drawing this conclusion from (that he has fired too many coaches)?

Murray stepped down in April 2016, which means Dorion officially started his G.M duties in summer 2016 and on. Dave Cameron was already the coach at that time, and he was let go so that Guy Boucher can be brought in.

When Boucher was fired in early 2019 (near the end of the 2018-19 season), assistant coach Marc Crawford took over for the rest of the season, but was never hired to stay on. DJ Smith was announced the new head coach to start the 2019 season.

Smith is Dorion's 2nd coach, which is really not that bad if he lets him go and gets one last chance to hire another coach (although I think Dorion should go too if Smith is let go).

My point being is that he is a terrible evaluator at the professional level.

Him lucking out and getting a good coach that would coach for this team would be putting lipstick on an ugly pig.

You said so yourself that he has made numerous terrible decisions as GM of this team. It's time to have a fresh set of eyes overlooking the management of this team

 

[SENATOR]

What would it take to get rid of this beloved headcase? Apparently the team loves him? I don't buy it.
I think there's some guys who are benefiting from him being the coach; but his game management, lines, and the actual on ice-product is lacking. I understand that the team is going through COVID issues currently and Dorion failed to manage the depth of the team. BUT, there comes a time that a change is necessary.

So when should that change occur, according to you?

The guy as a player's coach is completely responsible for a covid outbreak, letting his players to decide to stay in a bubble or to go out and enjoy a nice weather and a few drinks.

 

[Cosmix]

View attachment 480537

After a new GM is hired, that new GM should be allowed to hire his own coaching, scouting and development staff.

 

[Cosmix]

I seem to recall some expecting the team to be better but in fairness that was not accounting for the injuries and Covid.

Quite a few if not a majority of posters thought the team would be getting better.

 

[Byron Bitz]

If they add a top 6 center and a top 4 RD in the off-season and the team is still shit I would fire DJ. Apart from that I see no reason to continue the coaching carousel, I want some stability behind the bench.

 

[bert]

Going nowhere, not much point in talking about it.

Just resigned, the team almost literally can't get any worse than they have been the past 2 seasons which earned him that extension, and the team isn't going to be on the hook for his salary for the remainder of his contract

Yeah he isnt going anywhere. He isn't a headcase either, he has forgot more about hockey than anyone on here posting has going for them. The issue isn't the coaching. Its the player personnel, then you take into account covid, its a ridiculous thread that appears to be emotionally fueled. Why anyone thought this team was going to be a play off team is beyond me. Re builds take time.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

I can 100% guarantee that if DJ got fired, he would be hired in two seconds elsewhere. Ottawa fans who think he is not up to the task are not aware of his reputation nor the respect he garnered out of Toronto. We got a steal.

Patience.

 

[aragorn]

If they add a top 6 center and a top 4 RD in the off-season and the team is still shit I would fire DJ. Apart from that I see no reason to continue the coaching carousel, I want some stability behind the bench.

What if the GM who is responsible for bringing in players add those guys in the draft? It may not help immediately, but it will certainly help down the road?

 

[SensFactor]

Can we have a fire Dorion poll too?

 

[Emerica]

I’d much rather we get rid the Dorion first, and the next GM gets rid of DJ. Ideally at the end of this season if they finish bottom 5 again, but we all know this isn’t happening.

Earliest I could DJ getting fired is next season if the team starts really poorly for the third (fourth? fifth?) year in a row. Would not be shocked in the slightest to see Dorion fire him and try to save face for his shitty job.

 

[Byron Bitz]

What if the GM who is responsible for bringing in players add those guys in the draft? It may not help immediately, but it will ceratainly help down the road?

Then I say hold off on firing DJ

 

[Cosmix]

Lets be real, neither you nor I nor probably Dorion expected an actual playoff contender unless absolutely everything went right.

I'm willing to be patient. It was almost impossible for me to envision us doing enough this offseason to truly compete. I think we'd be much better if we had reasonable luck with health - to the point where we wouldnt be all-but-eliminated by January, like we're tracking for at this point - and I think that would be fine given where we're at. By next year, we should feasibly have 3 new defenders who are better than 75% of our current core; we need to add at least another top 9 forward or two; we should have a clearer picture of our goaltending; and I think the goal was always to provide room for that picture to emerge. We've faced bad performance and bad circumstance, but I still think we are on track to reach most of those objectives by the start of next season.

That is a lot to expect by the start of the 2022-23 season. If the team is a bubble team in 2022-23, that would be progress. I do not expect a playoff finish until at least 2023-24 because there are a lot of holes on this roster and it will take time for our draft picks to develop and mature into good players. The team is not signing high quality vets so the timeframe for getting better will be longer.

 

[Cosmix]

I’d much rather we get rid the Dorion first, and the next GM gets rid of DJ. Ideally at the end of this season if they finish bottom 5 again, but we all know this isn’t happening.

Earliest I could DJ getting fired is next season if the team starts really poorly for the third (fourth? fifth?) year in a row. Would not be shocked in the slightest to see Dorion fire him and try to save face for his shitty job.

EXACTLY. Dorion will follow in the footsteps of Murray and blame the coaching staff for failure. Then we will get another in a long line of inexperienced, unsuccessful or low quality coaches.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

That is a lot to expect by the start of the 2022-23 season. If the team is a bubble team in 2022-23, that would be progress. I do not expect a playoff finish until at least 2023-24 because there are a lot of holes on this roster and it will take time for our draft picks to develop and mature into good players. The team is not signing high quality vets so the timeframe for getting better will be longer.

I'm not saying playoff team, but I expect 2-3 of Sanderson, Thomson, JBD to be full-time with us by next year; we will add another prospect or replace White/top 9 F via trade; goaltending will continue to crystalize. I think we will be better next year and we damn well better make the playoffs the following year.

 

[aragorn]

Where is the choice to keep DJ?

 

[Cosmix]

If they add a top 6 center and a top 4 RD in the off-season and the team is still shit I would fire DJ. Apart from that I see no reason to continue the coaching carousel, I want some stability behind the bench.

I want an effective coaching staff. I am concerned about this coaching staff because it seems that the players are not playing strong defensive hockey; rather they are skating back into the slot in front of the goal but watching the puck carrier instead of taking their assigned man.

 

[Cosmix]

I'm not saying playoff team, but I expect 2-3 of Sanderson, Thomson, JBD to be full-time with us by next year; we will add another prospect or replace White/top 9 F via trade; goaltending will continue to crystalize. I think we will be better next year and we damn well better make the playoffs the following year.

I do not expect to make the playoffs next season (2022-23) nor in 2023-24.

 

[Micklebot]

I can 100% guarantee that if DJ got fired, he would be hired in two seconds elsewhere. Ottawa fans who think he is not up to the task are not aware of his reputation nor the respect he garnered out of Toronto. We got a steal.

Patience.

As an assistant perhaps but as a head coach? Not so sure. MacLean was hugely respected from his time in Detroit before we hired him and he hasn't really gotten a sniff since being fired by us despite being a finalist for the jack Adams in year one and winning it in year two.

Your reputation as an assistant is worth just about nothing once you've been given a chance as a head coach and don't take advantage. If DJ gets canned, he's going to be judged on his work with Ottawa, not Toronto. Lots of head coaches can not win with a bad roster... Not sure he's done enough to stand out from the crowd

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Not anytime soon.

He's made plenty of mistakes but we still haven't seen him with a truly competent, top-to-bottom, line up.

The line up should be much improved next year. I'll give him next season but he needs to keep the team close to the playoffs or I'd look for another coach.

At some point you have to try to stick with a coach. You can't just keep icing weak rosters and expect the coach to win.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

As an assistant perhaps but as a head coach? Not so sure. MacLean was hugely respected from his time in Detroit before we hired him and he hasn't really gotten a sniff since being fired by us despite being a finalist for the jack Adams in year one and winning it in year two.

Your reputation as an assistant is worth just about nothing once you've been given a chance as a head coach and don't take advantage. If DJ gets canned, he's going to be judged on his work with Ottawa, not Toronto. Lots of head coaches can not win with a bad roster... Not sure he's done enough to stand out from the crowd

No. I hear it from a lot of folks that are in and around the NHL.

I know. Trust me.

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

Wasn't DJ responsible for the defense in Toronto?