Around the League XXXVII: Sens fire Boucher

[IU Hawks fan]

But that's the argument I don't understand. If the shootout is a gimmick that's not even remotely hockey, why let it decide anything? Why let it decide between one point vs two points but balk at letting it decide between a win or a loss up and down?

To me, that comes off far more as an argument against the shootout even existing versus an argument against wins and losses.

I don't think it should. But I know that the league is never going to drop it, so this solution at least limits its power some and puts a greater focus on the 60 minutes that are played the way every minute of the playoffs is.

 

[JaegerDice]

Honestly, I think this whole issue will become moot as the media landscape changes.

Fewer and fewer people are using traditional cable to consume their media.

Give it another 5-10 years. You'll have an NHL app on your smart TV that you pay a subscription fee for to watch hockey. And it won't be some novelty. It will be right there beside the NFL app, the HBO app, the NBC app, etc.

At that point, the whole concept of needing to end games quickly for the sake of scheduling will go out the window. Which will kill the need for the shootout at all.

Even in the transition years, it's not that hard to envision the broadcasts saying something 'we're moving on to scheduled programming, but you can catch the rest of this 3v3 overtime on the NHL app'.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Honestly, I think this whole issue will become moot as the media landscape changes.

Fewer and fewer people are using traditional cable to consume their media.

Give it another 5-10 years. You'll have an NHL app on your smart TV that you pay a subscription fee for to watch hockey. And it won't be some novelty. It will be right there beside the NFL app, the HBO app, the NBC app, etc.

At that point, the whole concept of needing to end games quickly for the sake of scheduling will go out the window. Which will kill the need for the shootout at all.

Even in the transition years, it's not that hard to envision the broadcasts saying something 'we're moving on to scheduled programming, but you can catch the rest of this 3v3 overtime on the NHL app'.

Maybe I'm way off here, but I don't think the issue has anything to do with TV schedules. The NHL doesn't want games that could go forever (like the playoffs) during the regular season. I think that's for the sake of the players more so than anything having to do with TV broadcasts.

 

[JaegerDice]

Maybe I'm way off here, but I don't think the issue has anything to do with TV schedules. The NHL doesn't want games that could go forever (like the playoffs) during the regular season. I think that's for the sake of the players more so than anything having to do with TV broadcasts.

I think it's the NHLPA that has a problem with incredibly long regular season games, rather than the NHL.

Your point stands, I just don't think 3v3 OT is liable to go much longer than 5 minutes but for the odd freak occurrence.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

I think it's the NHLPA that has a problem with incredibly long regular season games, rather than the NHL.

Your point stands, I just don't think 3v3 OT is liable to go much longer than 5 minutes but for the odd freak occurrence.

3 on 3 doesn't figure to go too long, you are right. But my concern would be that if you remove the time constraint, do teams change the way they play? If you know the game only ends on a goal, would the goal of some lines to just buy time for the best trios to get back on the ice? I think the 5 minute clock does add to the end to end action that fans like. Using the Hawks as an example, Toews and Kane, Strome and Cat are going out there to try to score. But if the game only ends on a goal and not the 5 minute clock, would the Hawks be better served by Saad/AA or whoever the 3rd grouping is, to just play keep away until the big boys are ready?

 

[AmericanDream]

these have always been issues I have had with the game because it allows it to be done in certain parts of the ice or game an not in others.

what I mean is this -

• you cannot shoot the puck down the ice 5x5 but can when short handed...not a fan of being able to ice the puck when short handed as that is what kills power plays and makes them so damn boring - you took the penalty, you should not get bailed out with blindly dumping the puck down the ice - this point was being discussed as well..if you are not allowed to ice a puck normal then you should not be allowed to do it during a pk. if a team ices a puck when shorthanded more than twice during a game, they get a penalty shot called for each time they ice it (an illegal defense technical foul) and remain on the pk regardless of if they score on the penalty shot - that will prevent teams from dumping pucks down short handed and taking icing.
• you can kick a puck up and down the ice, but you can't kick a puck in the net. this is like saying you can headbutt a ball in soccer up and down the field but cannot hit it with your head to score a goal..it is so stupid. if you are allowed to kick a puck up and down the ice, you should be allowed to kick it into the net as well - only difference is your skate blade has to stay on the ice when a kicking motion occurs - this would be more of redirecting/tapping in instead of players wildly kicking in the crease. this should already be allowed this way as is.
• you can hand pass in your own zone but not in the offensive zone - again, another play allowed in one area but not the other - either allow it in both zones or not allow it in any, makes no sense why hockey has so many of these types of plays that are allowed only in certain situations. I am a fan of removing hand passes period, it allows teams to escape pressure to easy when a player can chuck the puck out the zone to another teammate etc..

those are just a few off the top of my head but there are more. I just don't like how things like this are allowed in certain aspects of the game and not others...is there another sport that does this as well?? where you can do one thing on one part of the field/court and not the other? or one type of play is allowed only in this area and not the other?? Maybe there is and I am just not thinking hard enough...

 

[AmericanDream]

Not a fan. I think the untended consequences of this would be that the refs would be even more hesitant to call penalties than they already are and it could actually lower scoring or at least not work as intended.

It seems like a solution in need of a problem. I don't have a problem with the way it is now.

I guess I can see that logic, but most teams power plays suck ass anyway, its not going to make much of a difference as half the damn teams can barely score on the advantage. I don't see refs not calling penalties because of it, but just my opinion.

I also like this though - if a delayed penalty is called and the team pulls their goalie scores, they still get to go on the power play...I am a fan of that as well as the penalty shouldn't be negated because a goal gets scored, so many times the extra player doesn't even get on the ice and a goal gets scored just because...if a delay call is made, a power play should occur regardless of scoring or not, what say you?

Lastly, the damn puck over the glass penalty needs to go - delay of game. It is the stupidest penalty in the game, 95% are pure accident, those need to go away, can't stand that stupid call...or at least modify it with intent, like a player hammers it out into the crowd vs barely missing the glass or something like that...hate that f***ing call.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

these have always been issues I have had with the game because it allows it to be done in certain parts of the ice or game an not in others.

what I mean is this -

• you cannot shoot the puck down the ice 5x5 but can when short handed...not a fan of being able to ice the puck when short handed as that is what kills power plays and makes them so damn boring - you took the penalty, you should not get bailed out with blindly dumping the puck down the ice - this point was being discussed as well..if you are not allowed to ice a puck normal then you should not be allowed to do it during a pk. if a team ices a puck when shorthanded more than twice during a game, they get a penalty shot called for each time they ice it (an illegal defense technical foul) and remain on the pk regardless of if they score on the penalty shot - that will prevent teams from dumping pucks down short handed and taking icing.
• you can kick a puck up and down the ice, but you can't kick a puck in the net. this is like saying you can headbutt a ball in soccer up and down the field but cannot hit it with your head to score a goal..it is so stupid. if you are allowed to kick a puck up and down the ice, you should be allowed to kick it into the net as well - only difference is your skate blade has to stay on the ice when a kicking motion occurs - this would be more of redirecting/tapping in instead of players wildly kicking in the crease. this should already be allowed this way as is.
• you can hand pass in your own zone but not in the offensive zone - again, another play allowed in one area but not the other - either allow it in both zones or not allow it in any, makes no sense why hockey has so many of these types of plays that are allowed only in certain situations. I am a fan of removing hand passes period, it allows teams to escape pressure to easy when a player can chuck the puck out the zone to another teammate etc..

those are just a few off the top of my head but there are more. I just don't like how things like this are allowed in certain aspects of the game and not others...is there another sport that does this as well?? where you can do one thing on one part of the field/court and not the other? or one type of play is allowed only in this area and not the other?? Maybe there is and I am just not thinking hard enough...

In the NFL, DBs can jam (push) WRs within the 1st five yards legally, but beyond that it's illegal contact. There are rules about how and when offensive lineman can block. They can cut a guy at the line, but you can't outside the numbers. OL can't block downfield on a pass until it's thrown.

There are probably others I'm missing.

 

[AmericanDream]

In the NFL, DBs can jam (push) WRs within the 1st five yards legally, but beyond that it's illegal contact. There are rules about how and when offensive lineman can block. They can cut a guy at the line, but you can't outside the numbers. OL can't block downfield on a pass until it's thrown.

There are probably others I'm missing.

well yeah you can block/contact at the line of scrimmage, they just maxed it to 5 yards - that isn't what I am saying that just becomes pass interference and rightfully so.

you would have to show me something more in line with game play...like for baseball -hitting the foul poll before the 5th inning is a foul ball but after the 5th is a fair ball - that kid of stuff...an extreme example lol, but if there is something like that I would love to know!

 

[JaegerDice]

3 on 3 doesn't figure to go too long, you are right. But my concern would be that if you remove the time constraint, do teams change the way they play? If you know the game only ends on a goal, would the goal of some lines to just buy time for the best trios to get back on the ice? I think the 5 minute clock does add to the end to end action that fans like. Using the Hawks as an example, Toews and Kane, Strome and Cat are going out there to try to score. But if the game only ends on a goal and not the 5 minute clock, would the Hawks be better served by Saad/AA or whoever the 3rd grouping is, to just play keep away until the big boys are ready?

It's possible, though I'm not sure how effective it would be at 3v3 in a league this fast.

Good food for thought though.

 

[IU Hawks fan]

Honestly, I think this whole issue will become moot as the media landscape changes.

Fewer and fewer people are using traditional cable to consume their media.

Give it another 5-10 years. You'll have an NHL app on your smart TV that you pay a subscription fee for to watch hockey. And it won't be some novelty. It will be right there beside the NFL app, the HBO app, the NBC app, etc.

At that point, the whole concept of needing to end games quickly for the sake of scheduling will go out the window. Which will kill the need for the shootout at all.

Even in the transition years, it's not that hard to envision the broadcasts saying something 'we're moving on to scheduled programming, but you can catch the rest of this 3v3 overtime on the NHL app'.

I see very little chance that local rights aren't still a thing in 10 years. Teams will never want to go to a full B2C subscription model, because subscriptions will take a huge hit in bad years. They're better off selling the rights to a network and having that guaranteed revenue year to year.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

I see very little chance that local rights aren't still a thing in 10 years. Teams will never want to go to a full B2C subscription model, because subscriptions will take a huge hit in bad years. They're better off selling the rights to a network and having that guaranteed revenue year to year.

Yea, I think cable companies will offer up far more a la carte options moving forward to compete and things will be far more flexible than they are now but you’ll still be watching tv through Comcast/AT&T.

 

[AmericanDream]

Mike Johnson on NHL Network - "NO MORE NO ICING ON PK" gaining steam...YEAHHHHH!!!!!!!! So sick of being able to dump the damn puck down the ice when YOU ARE PENALIZED!! They have icing on the pk at the younger levels now because it is forcing kids to have to make plays/skate the puck out which is great for them in a pressure situation..this is something that is gaining steam and I think we will see at the NHL level in the next few years...

 

[ColdSteel2]

Mike Johnson on NHL Network - "NO MORE NO ICING ON PK" gaining steam...YEAHHHHH!!!!!!!! So sick of being able to dump the damn puck down the ice when YOU ARE PENALIZED!! They have icing on the pk at the younger levels now because it is forcing kids to have to make plays/skate the puck out which is great for them in a pressure situation..this is something that is gaining steam and I think we will see at the NHL level in the next few years...

Sometimes I wonder if it is advantageous to take a penalty late in the game if you are up by 2 just so you can dump it in and run off the clock.

 

[clydesdale line]

Vancouver won today so Hawks are now 6th in the lottery.

Anaheim is a hell of a tank team though. They were up a goal with a 1:15 left and just pissed away not only the lead but are now losing.

EDIT: They just lost in regulation (Hawks would've tied with them for 5th in the lottery if they'd won).

 

[Hawkaholic]

Vancouver won today so Hawks are now 6th in the lottery.

Anaheim is a hell of a tank team though. They were up a goal with a 1:15 left and just pissed away not only the lead but are now losing.

EDIT: They just lost in regulation (Hawks would've tied with them for 5th in the lottery if they'd won).

No worries, our tank commander JC has put the optimal lineup together to tank the rest of the way.

 

[Rick C137]

No worries, our tank commander JC has put the optimal lineup together to tank the rest of the way.

*tries not to bite on obvious troll post*

 

[ClydeLee]

Vancouver won today so Hawks are now 6th in the lottery.

Anaheim is a hell of a tank team though. They were up a goal with a 1:15 left and just pissed away not only the lead but are now losing.

EDIT: They just lost in regulation (Hawks would've tied with them for 5th in the lottery if they'd won).

Sounds similar to how the Hawks beat them

 

[RayP]

No worries, our tank commander JC has put the optimal lineup together to tank the rest of the way.

lol

 

[jaysoneil]

these have always been issues I have had with the game because it allows it to be done in certain parts of the ice or game an not in others.

what I mean is this -

• you cannot shoot the puck down the ice 5x5 but can when short handed...not a fan of being able to ice the puck when short handed as that is what kills power plays and makes them so damn boring - you took the penalty, you should not get bailed out with blindly dumping the puck down the ice - this point was being discussed as well..if you are not allowed to ice a puck normal then you should not be allowed to do it during a pk. if a team ices a puck when shorthanded more than twice during a game, they get a penalty shot called for each time they ice it (an illegal defense technical foul) and remain on the pk regardless of if they score on the penalty shot - that will prevent teams from dumping pucks down short handed and taking icing.
• you can kick a puck up and down the ice, but you can't kick a puck in the net. this is like saying you can headbutt a ball in soccer up and down the field but cannot hit it with your head to score a goal..it is so stupid. if you are allowed to kick a puck up and down the ice, you should be allowed to kick it into the net as well - only difference is your skate blade has to stay on the ice when a kicking motion occurs - this would be more of redirecting/tapping in instead of players wildly kicking in the crease. this should already be allowed this way as is.
• you can hand pass in your own zone but not in the offensive zone - again, another play allowed in one area but not the other - either allow it in both zones or not allow it in any, makes no sense why hockey has so many of these types of plays that are allowed only in certain situations. I am a fan of removing hand passes period, it allows teams to escape pressure to easy when a player can chuck the puck out the zone to another teammate etc..

those are just a few off the top of my head but there are more. I just don't like how things like this are allowed in certain aspects of the game and not others...is there another sport that does this as well?? where you can do one thing on one part of the field/court and not the other? or one type of play is allowed only in this area and not the other?? Maybe there is and I am just not thinking hard enough...

I can get behind the no icing on the PK, I guess.

I cannot support the no kicking idea though. Board play, passes in the skates, tied up sticks and broken sticks all rely on the player being able to use his skates. Kicking the puck into the goal usually requires the kicking player to be in close proximity to the goal. Skate lacerations are no joke and I believe allowing players to swing their skate blades near the crease would result in a spike of goalie injuries and possible death in the extreme case.

The hand pass, I'm 50/50 on. I don't see it playing THAT big of a role in the outcome of a game.

 

[AmericanDream]

I can get behind the no icing on the PK, I guess.

I cannot support the no kicking idea though. Board play, passes in the skates, tied up sticks and broken sticks all rely on the player being able to use his skates. Kicking the puck into the goal usually requires the kicking player to be in close proximity to the goal. Skate lacerations are no joke and I believe allowing players to swing their skate blades near the crease would result in a spike of goalie injuries and possible death in the extreme case.

The hand pass, I'm 50/50 on. I don't see it playing THAT big of a role in the outcome of a game.

players are still kicking now which is why you have many goals called off, nobody is getting injured any more than a freak incident...as long as the blade stays on the ice meaning you can kick at the puck but the blade has to remain on the ice then the goal should count, once the blade comes off the ice it is a no goal. pretty simple. this would mainly allow for skates to be turned to direct the puck in as well as crashing the net hard and using your skate to knock the puck in.

 

[jaysoneil]

players are still kicking now which is why you have many goals called off, nobody is getting injured any more than a freak incident...as long as the blade stays on the ice meaning you can kick at the puck but the blade has to remain on the ice then the goal should count, once the blade comes off the ice it is a no goal. pretty simple. this would mainly allow for skates to be turned to direct the puck in as well as crashing the net hard and using your skate to knock the puck in.

Players still also trip, slash, hook and cross-check yet rules are in place to prohibit such.

If you allowed tripping, the amount of incidents would drastically increase. With goalies more prevalent in the butterfly, allowing goals by kicking would increase the chance of injuries. Significant injuries.

I'm not sure when the rule was implemented, but I can't see that rule being changed.

 

[AmericanDream]

Players still also trip, slash, hook and cross-check yet rules are in place to prohibit such.

If you allowed tripping, the amount of incidents would drastically increase. With goalies more prevalent in the butterfly, allowing goals by kicking would increase the chance of injuries. Significant injuries.

I'm not sure when the rule was implemented, but I can't see that rule being changed.

I agree with some of this, but they have changed the rules allowing for a puck to go in off your skate as long as no kicking motion - it was once 100% off the skate no goal. I doubt players will start kicking wildly at pucks if they know the only way it counts is if the blade stays on the ice, same as players now using their skate to redirect the puck as subtle as can be..

I am fine if it never changes, it is just one of the things I was saying that is allowed here but not there and just odd. and players can kick pucks from scrums while other guys are on the ice, see it a lot, injuries could happen there but it is allowed.

 

[JaegerDice]

No worries, our tank commander JC has put the optimal lineup together to tank the rest of the way.

Hopefully he can get us a higher draft pick than tank commander Quenneville did last season.

 

[Drumman44]

Been saying for a year now that I want nothing to do with EK. Would be tremendously stupid on the part of Bowman, and I'd call for him to be fired immediately. And I'm a Bowman supporter.

You seem to be right on the money here. EK out until the playoffs it seems

Sharks' Erik Karlsson: Not close to return