Armchair GM III: No more stinky deadline rentals

[The Zermanator]

Look how much better Ericsson has looked on the 2nd pair this season than on the 1st. I think getting a #1 completely revamps this defense. We add a top-end talent, and everyone else gets pushed down 1 spot on the depth chart. With everyone playing opponents more suited to their skill level the whole defense should improve from top to bottom.

I've been willing to go big on Byfuglien (relative to his upcoming UFA status) for a while. And if a serious opportunity to acquire Shattenkirk pops up, I'm willing to go real big. Nyquist, DeKeyser and 1 or 2 quality pluses would do it, I'd imagine.

 

[Kronwalled55]

Detroit is a destination city, now?

The team is still good and getting a brand new stadium. I can't see many negatives. At the end of the day it all lies on how competitive Holland's offers are.

 

[Kronwalled55]

I don't think a deadline player will push this team over the edge, just set them back further

That's kind of where I'm at too. But when you look at the defense free agents this summer, it's going to be very difficult to improve the team unless you trade or build from within. It doesn't have to be a rental player and think that's what Holland should aim for.

 

[Red Stanley]

I like Byfuglien for the size and physicality he brings, along with that offense.

I hope he is our #1 target as a trade and free agent.

I'd have to agree. His physical play will elevate everyone else's and that's probably one of the biggest things missing from our game right now. I'd love for them to find their new team identity in being a hard-nosed, hard-working team and move away from this pseudo-finesse crap that makes no sense with the current roster.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

Look how much better Ericsson has looked on the 2nd pair this season than on the 1st. I think getting a #1 completely revamps this defense. We add a top-end talent, and everyone else gets pushed down 1 spot on the depth chart. With everyone playing opponents more suited to their skill level the whole defense should improve from top to bottom.

I've been willing to go big on Byfuglien (relative to his upcoming UFA status) for a while. And if a serious opportunity to acquire Shattenkirk pops up, I'm willing to go real big. Nyquist, DeKeyser and 1 or 2 quality pluses would do it, I'd imagine.

I have never understood your insistence on shipping out Dekeyser. The point is to improve the defense, not simply rearrange the parts on the back end with no net gain to the team. The difference between Buf and Dekeyser is meaningful, but it most certainly is not Nyquist. Yes you need to add to the blue line, but you also need to trim fat, not meat.

Add me to the camp that thinks that we are more than one good player away from being a cup contender. If a trade doesn't improve us for four + years, it isn't worth making in my opinion. The window is closed.

 

[The Zermanator]

I have never understood your insistence on shipping out Dekeyser. The point is to improve the defense, not simply rearrange the parts on the back end with no net gain to the team. The difference between Buf and Dekeyser is meaningful, but it most certainly is not Nyquist. Yes you need to add to the blue line, but you also need to trim fat, not meat.

Add me to the camp that thinks that we are more than one good player away from being a cup contender. If a trade doesn't improve us for four + years, it isn't worth making in my opinion. The window is closed.

That Nyquist + DeKeyser was for Shattenkirk, not Byfuglien. As I said, Byfuglien is an upcoming UFA so would not require as much.

And I'm more than willing to give up DeKeyser in addition to Nyquist if Shattenkirk is coming the other way. It's not re-arranging parts when you're acquiring something you don't have to begin with. And we don't have, and desperately need, a #1. And it would improve the D by a wide margin, even with the loss of DeKeyser.

Kronwal-Shattenkirk
Ericsson-Green
Quincey-Marchenko
Smith

I can't think of any possible combination of our current d corps that is superior to that. If you can come up with one, I'd be happy to hear it.

Nyquist is on pace for 43 points over 82 games this season. DeKeyser's on pace for 21 points. Shattenkirk is on pace for 58 points, and that's with 2nd pairing minutes. Good chance he'd have more points than them combined if he was on the top pair. I give them both up for Shattenkirk easily. Even adding a plus if necessary.

 

[ShelbyZ]

I'd have to agree. His physical play will elevate everyone else's and that's probably one of the biggest things missing from our game right now. I'd love for them to find their new team identity in being a hard-nosed, hard-working team and move away from this pseudo-finesse crap that makes no sense with the current roster.

This.

I kinda feel like the team is similar to how it was in 2007. Lots of young guys and players settling into their roles, playing well but just getting pushed around a bit. IMO, it was the injection of grit and toughness that came along with the additions of Drake, Downey and eventually McCarty and Stuart that pushed that 2008 team to the next level. That team was an excellent blend of hand nosed, hard working and pseudo finesse.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

This.

I kinda feel like the team is similar to how it was in 2007. Lots of young guys and players settling into their roles, playing well but just getting pushed around a bit. IMO, it was the injection of grit and toughness that came along with the additions of Drake, Downey and eventually McCarty and Stuart that pushed that 2008 team to the next level. That team was an excellent blend of hand nosed, hard working and pseudo finesse.

that is how ALL clubs who have success are built

you cant have too much skill and not enough grit and toughness(actual, toughness not this turn the other cheek nonsense)

you cant have too many rookies or too many vets

right now the team is not well balanced

 

[SimplySolace]

Hope we get Buff, just so this board melts down in a couple years over Holland signing a 30 year old a 7x7 type contract. Length of the deal and his age when it's over is what makes me want to look elsewhere, despite his physicality.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

That Nyquist + DeKeyser was for Shattenkirk, not Byfuglien. As I said, Byfuglien is an upcoming UFA so would not require as much.

And I'm more than willing to give up DeKeyser in addition to Nyquist if Shattenkirk is coming the other way. It's not re-arranging parts when you're acquiring something you don't have to begin with. And we don't have, and desperately need, a #1. And it would improve the D by a wide margin, even with the loss of DeKeyser.

Kronwal-Shattenkirk
Ericsson-Green
Quincey-Marchenko
Smith

I can't think of any possible combination of our current d corps that is superior to that. If you can come up with one, I'd be happy to hear it.

Nyquist is on pace for 43 points over 82 games this season. DeKeyser's on pace for 21 points. Shattenkirk is on pace for 58 points, and that's with 2nd pairing minutes. Good chance he'd have more points than them combined if he was on the top pair. I give them both up for Shattenkirk easily. Even adding a plus if necessary.

Ok, that offer makes much more sense in the context of Shattenkirk. If you managed to re-sign him it would likely be a very good move. If he bails in free agency, however, we will be forced into a re-build. Even with increased ice time his production will most certainly drop in Detroit for the simple reason that STL is a much more talented team than Detroit is (and will be for the foreseeable future).

I think we probably differ in how close we think the Wings are to being cup contenders. As good as Shattenkirk is, he will not push us into the league's upper echelon in my opinion. This team has too many other deficiencies and is not properly constructed for playoff hockey.

I would prefer a smaller, more modest move for a younger player with the upside to develop into a good top-pair.

 

[Actual Thought*]

That Nyquist + DeKeyser was for Shattenkirk, not Byfuglien. As I said, Byfuglien is an upcoming UFA so would not require as much.

And I'm more than willing to give up DeKeyser in addition to Nyquist if Shattenkirk is coming the other way. It's not re-arranging parts when you're acquiring something you don't have to begin with. And we don't have, and desperately need, a #1. And it would improve the D by a wide margin, even with the loss of DeKeyser.

Kronwal-Shattenkirk
Ericsson-Green
Quincey-Marchenko
Smith

I can't think of any possible combination of our current d corps that is superior to that. If you can come up with one, I'd be happy to hear it.

Nyquist is on pace for 43 points over 82 games this season. DeKeyser's on pace for 21 points. Shattenkirk is on pace for 58 points, and that's with 2nd pairing minutes. Good chance he'd have more points than them combined if he was on the top pair. I give them both up for Shattenkirk easily. Even adding a plus if necessary.

Shattenkirk on this team would suffer the same fate as everyone else. Offence dry as a bone.

 

[Eggberto]

Shattenkirk on this team would suffer the same fate as everyone else. Offence dry as a bone.

Or he'd be another catalyst that can make things happen from the backend. Just like Green. He hasn't always picked up points for his efforrs, but Green makes things happen.

 

[Frk It]

Hope we get Buff, just so this board melts down in a couple years over Holland signing a 30 year old a 7x7 type contract. Length of the deal and his age when it's over is what makes me want to look elsewhere, despite his physicality.

It's the best short team deal but worst long term deal of the bunch.

First few years or so would be awesome though. Guess it kind of depends on how you project us, on if you support the move or not. I can see us being legit with Buff for the next few years. Lot of question marks beyond that though.

Without the E and Abby deals I don't even think it would be that big of an issue.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

Shattenkirk on this team would suffer the same fate as everyone else. Offence dry as a bone.

See, the reason why the offense is dry as a bone is because we don't have a guy other than Green to outlet the puck through the neutral zone. Our transition game is terrible and our zone exits and entries are heavily depended upon by our forwards, which is bad for a good team. Shattenkirk would help everyone exponentially. It is our biggest hole.

Dekeyser-Shattenkirk
Kronwall-Green
Smith-Marchenko/Quincey

That would be incredible

 

[SimplySolace]

It's the best short team deal but worst long term deal of the bunch.

First few years or so would be awesome though. Guess it kind of depends on how you project us, on if you support the move or not. I can see us being legit with Buff for the next few years. Lot of question marks beyond that though.

Without the E and Abby deals I don't even think it would be that big of an issue.

I don't really see it better short term over someone like Shattenkirk, but over a younger longer-term option sure.

But yes, both of those deals are awful and certainly need to be taken into account. Not excited about how long we're locked into half(ish) of our mediocre D.

See, the reason why the offense is dry as a bone is because we don't have a guy other than Green to outlet the puck through the neutral zone. Our transition game is terrible and our zone exits and entries are heavily depended upon by our forwards, which is bad for a good team. Shattenkirk would help everyone exponentially. It is our biggest hole.

Dekeyser-Shattenkirk
Kronwall-Green
Smith-Marchenko/Quincey

That would be incredible

Yeah, that's incredible, but I don't see how we get rid of Big E.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

Look how much better Ericsson has looked on the 2nd pair this season than on the 1st. I think getting a #1 completely revamps this defense. We add a top-end talent, and everyone else gets pushed down 1 spot on the depth chart. With everyone playing opponents more suited to their skill level the whole defense should improve from top to bottom.

I've been willing to go big on Byfuglien (relative to his upcoming UFA status) for a while. And if a serious opportunity to acquire Shattenkirk pops up, I'm willing to go real big. Nyquist, DeKeyser and 1 or 2 quality pluses would do it, I'd imagine.

Shattenkirk would only cost that max. Nyquist, dmen maybe or a top end prospect. B level prospect and a draft pick maximum

It doesn't take that much to get a dman especially with a short contract

 

[Frk It]

I don't really see it better short term over someone like Shattenkirk, but over a younger longer-term option sure.

But yes, both of those deals are awful and certainly need to be taken into account. Not excited about how long we're locked into half(ish) of our mediocre D.



Yeah, that's incredible, but I don't see how we get rid of Big E.

Buff is tailor made for playoff hockey. He gives us some bite and leaves less space for the other team while providing virtually the same offense.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

I don't really see it better short term over someone like Shattenkirk, but over a younger longer-term option sure.

But yes, both of those deals are awful and certainly need to be taken into account. Not excited about how long we're locked into half(ish) of our mediocre D.



Yeah, that's incredible, but I don't see how we get rid of Big E.

Stop. No. ****. I forgot he existed in my fantasy land.

 

[Eggberto]

I would LOVE Shattenkirk. The only thing that worries me and the price we'd have to pay to get him (especially this year) is that he'd decide not to resign. Of course the sooner you get him the longer you have to convince him to stay.

However he is still young, established, and he'd be our #1 by a wide margin. He is VERY good and I'd love to have him. The price we'd pay would be steep but it'd take a huge step in establishing our blueline (esp. if he resigned)

 

[SimplySolace]

Stop. No. ****. I forgot he existed in my fantasy land.

I know.. it hurts

 

[TheRatPoisoner]

I would LOVE Shattenkirk. The only thing that worries me and the price we'd have to pay to get him (especially this year) is that he'd decide not to resign. Of course the sooner you get him the longer you have to convince him to stay.

However he is still young, established, and he'd be our #1 by a wide margin. He is VERY good and I'd love to have him. The price we'd pay would be steep but it'd take a huge step in establishing our blueline (esp. if he resigned)

I think if they made a trade of that magnitude, they'd have to have fairly confident that they are resigning him. There'd have to be like a side agreement that both parties would enter into ernest contract negotiations after the deals done or something to that affect. Can't see moving the significant pieces required to snag him otherwise.

 

[Inspiration]

that is how ALL clubs who have success are built

you cant have too much skill and not enough grit and toughness(actual, toughness not this turn the other cheek nonsense)

you cant have too many rookies or too many vets

right now the team is not well balanced

It sounds like we're trying to build the most average team in the league.

I don't care what the Wings' strengths or weaknesses are or how glaring they are. I just want the sum of all the parts (good and bad) to be better than that of the other 29 teams in the league.

 

[Probie]

We forget dd's fav team was Detroit, he agreed to sign here, I think with Hollands loyalty he wouldn't move dekyser. I know he doesn't have a Ntc, but I'm sure when he signed there had to be an understanding. People are forgetting that. I know anyone can be traded and that's the hockey business, but this is a little different.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

We forget dd's fav team was Detroit, he agreed to sign here, I think with Hollands loyalty he wouldn't move dekyser. I know he doesn't have a Ntc, but I'm sure when he signed there had to be an understanding. People are forgetting that. I know anyone can be traded and that's the hockey business, but this is a little different.

Trading DD for anyone but Shattenkirk or a younger great dmen is a mistake.

I would rather trade Kronwall. He doesnt deserve the right to retire here unlike Dats and Z. But idk what his trade value is now

 

[aFish]

Trading DD for anyone but Shattenkirk or a younger great dmen is a mistake.

I would rather trade Kronwall. He doesnt deserve the right to retire here unlike Dats and Z. But idk what his trade value is now

Da **** is this nonsense?!?