Confirmed with Link: Arizona Coyotes to remain Glendale through 2018-2019

[The Feckless Puck]

I wouldn't be so sure about the Coyotes being better in the young guys dept?? The Flames have Gaudreau, Monahan, Bennett, Ferland, Tkachuk, Hamilton , and Jankowski all proven NHL players under the age of 25. And it's not like the Coyotes have a proven NHL goalie or one in the pipeline either.

...and they also have the baggage of being a Canadian team. That alone makes the Coyotes more appealing for a relocation target.

 

[Jamieh]

...and they also have the baggage of being a Canadian team. That alone makes the Coyotes more appealing for a relocation target.

The question was what team would you want, it mentioned nothing about how much trouble to acquire??

 

[The Feckless Puck]

The question was what team would you want, it mentioned nothing about how much trouble to acquire??

I wasn't referring to difficulty in acquisition. Being the host site for a relocated Canadian team brings a lot of baggage along with it, bad blood from Canadian fans, etc. Image plays a role for guys who have money to burn.

 

[Jamieh]

I wasn't referring to difficulty in acquisition. Being the host site for a relocated Canadian team brings a lot of baggage along with it, bad blood from Canadian fans, etc. Image plays a role for guys who have money to burn.

Again wasn't the question and certainly not what you answered which was what I replied to.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Location, location, location. If Houston gets a team, our team, the arena will be centrally located and not in BFF Glendale.

 

[Plub]

Is it sad that I honestly don't even care anymore?

 

[rt]

Is it sad that I honestly don't even care anymore?

I know what you mean.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Again wasn't the question and certainly not what you answered which was what I replied to.

The point is, roster is not the only consideration here. You made a good point about Calgary's roster being better overall right now with guys who are still young, but I think Arizona's pipeline is competitive in terms of potential, especially in the goalie department - we have a couple of guys who show a lot of promise who aren't fully-baked yet. So, taking all that into account, you have to look at other things about a potential purchase for relocation that factor into how appealing it would be. The Flames' franchise value is greater than the Coyotes', so that's an additional outlay of cash to purchase/relocate. Their cap situation is less flexible than Arizona's (Calgary currently has $2M and change of space while AZ has $16M). And - there's no getting around this - buying a Canadian team and moving it out of Canada is an image-buster. Why take that chance when there's a perfectly serviceable sad sack team in Arizona that, with the right tweaks, could become a long-term contender on a shorter timeline than an expansion team, but without being hamstrung by too many veteran salaries?

 

[RABBIT]

yeah i could give a f*** about any of this. If you're going to do it, do it. Quit toying with us. I'll follow a Seattle team if i have to

 

[Matias Maccete]

Is it sad that I honestly don't even care anymore?

yeah i could give a **** about any of this. If you're going to do it, do it. Quit toying with us. I'll follow a Seattle team if i have to

Yup, I'd much prefer they stay obviously, but f***ing pick one. We're approaching a decade of this year to year shit, just stay with some damn stability, or go.

 

[Jamieh]

The point is, roster is not the only consideration here. You made a good point about Calgary's roster being better overall right now with guys who are still young, but I think Arizona's pipeline is competitive in terms of potential, especially in the goalie department - we have a couple of guys who show a lot of promise who aren't fully-baked yet. So, taking all that into account, you have to look at other things about a potential purchase for relocation that factor into how appealing it would be. The Flames' franchise value is greater than the Coyotes', so that's an additional outlay of cash to purchase/relocate. Their cap situation is less flexible than Arizona's (Calgary currently has $2M and change of space while AZ has $16M). And - there's no getting around this - buying a Canadian team and moving it out of Canada is an image-buster. Why take that chance when there's a perfectly serviceable sad sack team in Arizona that, with the right tweaks, could become a long-term contender on a shorter timeline than an expansion team, but without being hamstrung by too many veteran salaries?

I don't mind beating a dead horse, Calgary has Jon Gillies, David Rittich and Tyler Parsons in the waiting in the goalie dept?? I'm not sure how you think AZ has better prospect depth either? The Flames have no Cap issue as they have no one from their Core needing a new contract next season, they are in great shape there. Pointing to media hassle from moving a Canadian Team is just trying to point away from a point you were even at best and probably wrong on, that the Coyotes had by far the best prospect pool.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Pointing to media hassle from moving a Canadian Team is just trying to point away from a point you were even at best and probably wrong on, that the Coyotes had by far the best prospect pool.

Go read what I actually wrote. I never said that the Coyotes "had by far the best prospect pool." I said that if I were choosing a team from the choice of expansion, Coyotes, and Calgary, I would pick the Coyotes. For me it wouldn't be close, because of the various reasons I have enumerated above. Now, you can take issue with what I said, but taking issue with what I did not say seems a bit pointless.

 

[zz]

Yeah I don't really care either at this point. I'll keep following the team from a distance, and if I have a serious itch for live NHL hockey, I'll go to Vegas for a weekend.

 

[Jamieh]

Go read what I actually wrote. I never said that the Coyotes "had by far the best prospect pool." I said that if I were choosing a team from the choice of expansion, Coyotes, and Calgary, I would pick the Coyotes. For me it wouldn't be close, because of the various reasons I have enumerated above. Now, you can take issue with what I said, but taking issue with what I did not say seems a bit pointless.

I can't see any other way to read this answer based on the question and not think you believe the Coyotes have the best upside for the teams considered???


The Coyotes, and it's not even close. The Flames are a better team but have a heftier salary weight and aging vets like Smith. The Coyotes pipeline is full of great prospects - all it needs is a coaching change (which Fertitta could easily afford) and signing some solid vet players (which he can also afford, especially given how much cap room the team has).

 

[The Feckless Puck]

I can't see any other way to read this answer based on the question and not think you believe the Coyotes have the best upside for the teams considered???

I believe, all things considered, that the Coyotes represent the best balance of potential, flexibility, and portability of the three choices - but that's not the same thing as saying that they have "by far the best prospect pool."

 

[XX]

The Coyotes are probably available, to start. I don't see why the Flames would be. The league hasn't run out of rope there. Not by a longshot.

 

[Jamieh]

The Coyotes are probably available, to start. I don't see why the Flames would be. The league hasn't run out of rope there. Not by a longshot.

The discussion started with a question of which of these three teams woukd you want if you were getting a team right now. Who's available and how much media bs you have to go through weren't part of the original question, they were added after. If I was getting a choice between Vegas, Calgary, and Az as was asked I still take the Flames.

 

[Lilhoody]

The talk of the Coyotes being cap friendly is silly. They suck, in part because they are easy on the wallet. At a glance, $11M isn't even on the ice.

 

[sec107]

Hi folks...Canadian-based Coyotes season ticket holder here. Will be at the Nashville game and looking forward to it. Wanted to offer my 2 cents:
1. This talk of a new arena is just so much BS. There is zero appetite for public funding of an arena to any extent and this owner doesn't have deep enough pockets to make it happen by himself. If the Coyotes stay in Arizona it will be at Gila River Arena. Period. Plus talk of a new arena making any meaningful difference in the support of the franchise is also BS. The arena location is an excuse.
2. Anybody who believes that the Calgary Flames are moving anywhere in our lifetime is dreaming in technicolor! There's all kinds of posturing going on from all parties but the chances of a move are zero.
3. Perhaps as exasperating as the Coyotes season to date has been the performance of Vegas. Somebody tell me how an expansion team that's less than 3 months old has been flirting with the conference lead all season and has already beaten the Coyotes, a team that has been established in its current location for more than 20 years, 3 times!!! I'm not sure if that means there should be mass firings in the Coyotes organization or among the geniuses who formulated this expansion draft!? I don't mind an expansion team being somewhat competitive but this is ridiculous.
4. Where are all the geniuses who wanted Mike Smith sent packing?? While Smith makes a case for All-star selection the Coyotes goaltending situation has been a tire fire all season. Turns out Smith wasn't that bad after all!
5. Can we please stop the talk of all the "great young prospects" we have? Outside of Jacob Chychrun, Clayton Keller, Christian Fischer, and maybe Christian Dvorak none of them have proven themselves as legitimate NHL players. Let's face facts...Dylan Strome is a bust and Anthony Duclair isn't far from that status. Perlini takes every other shift off. Lawson Crouse got a great chance to establish himself as an NHL player and has now disappeared.
6. As much talk as there has been about this being a young team, there is a very significant veteran presence and they are the reason for the team's current record. We now know why Florida wanted to get rid of Jason Demers. OEL hasn't been much better. Norris Trophy candidate?? Puh-leeze!
Derek Stepan hasn't done much and has anybody seen Toby Reider or Jordan Martinook lately. To give credit where it is due, Goligoski and Schenn have been pretty decent all year. Schenn has no foot speed but that's not his game. He does what he's good at, being a physical presence night after night.
7. Any other hockey market in the world and Chayka and Tocchet would be called to account by now....both would be long gone if they were in a Canadian market. Heck, we've seen that you can start from zero before the season started and still have more than twice the number of wins the Coyotes have.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

The talk of the Coyotes being cap friendly is silly. They suck, in part because they are easy on the wallet. At a glance, $11M isn't even on the ice.

The thought experiment we are engaged in currently is one of a theoretical new owner purchasing a team for relocation. The Coyotes' cap/salary situation in that sense is an advantage because an owner with an actual budget and the wherewithal to sign UFAs to big contracts would not be hamstrung by existing contracts and salary weight.

 

[Mosby]

Hey new guy,

Mike Smith: .918, $6M
Antti Raanta: .916, $1M

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Hey new guy,

Mike Smith: .918, $6M
Antti Raanta: .916, $1M

Also:

Mike Smith: 35
Antti Raanta: 28

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Hey new guy -
You're right about Canada not permitting the Flames to relocate. You're also right that there is no pressure in Arizona to make a coaching and GM change.
You're probably wrong about Smith. He now has a good team surrounding him, so his numbers are good. That has a lot to do with his All Star candidacy.
You're dead wrong about the arena. Location is no joke and excuses have nothing to do with it. It took me an hour and twenty minutes to get from my home to the arena on Tuesday. It takes 35 minutes on a weekend. The week day drive time is too much for people who work for a living. A better team might get a good crowd on a primo week day game, but for most week day games on ice success won't translate to sell outs.

 

[sec107]

Hey new guy -
You're right about Canada not permitting the Flames to relocate. You're also right that there is no pressure in Arizona to make a coaching and GM change.
You're probably wrong about Smith. He now has a good team surrounding him, so his numbers are good. That has a lot to do with his All Star candidacy.
You're dead wrong about the arena. Location is no joke and excuses have nothing to do with it. It took me an hour and twenty minutes to get from my home to the arena on Tuesday. It takes 35 minutes on a weekend. The week day drive time is too much for people who work for a living. A better team might get a good crowd on a primo week day game, but for most week day games on ice success won't translate to sell outs.

The only stat that’s relevant where Raanta is concerned at this point is that he can’t stay in the lineup. Admittedly, staying healthy was not one of Mike Smith’s strong suits. Let’s face it, the reason Mike Smith is in Calgary and Antii Raanta is in the Coyotes crease is 100% contract-related....$5.5 million versus $1 million. My main point was that Mike Smith is a good goaltender, was not the problem last year, and didn’t deserve the criticism he got from many fans. As far as the arena is concerned, naturally everyone wishes the rink was 15 minutes from their front door but the idea that another arena location will magically fix the team’s attendance problems is nonsense. Only a good quality, winning team will fix that. If and when that happens it won’t matter where the arena is, as the attendance during the 2012 playoff run proved.

 

[RemoAZ]

The only stat that’s relevant where Raanta is concerned at this point is that he can’t stay in the lineup. Admittedly, staying healthy was not one of Mike Smith’s strong suits. Let’s face it, the reason Mike Smith is in Calgary and Antii Raanta is in the Coyotes crease is 100% contract-related....$5.5 million versus $1 million. My main point was that Mike Smith is a good goaltender, was not the problem last year, and didn’t deserve the criticism he got from many fans. As far as the arena is concerned, naturally everyone wishes the rink was 15 minutes from their front door but the idea that another arena location will magically fix the team’s attendance problems is nonsense. Only a good quality, winning team will fix that. If and when that happens it won’t matter where the arena is, as the attendance during the 2012 playoff run proved.

Agree 100%. This team will only draw flies in whatever city they want to build the arena if they continue to lose. Just look at the Suns for proof and the Suns have the luxury of being here forever and building a fan base with a team that while winning no championship, was a championship contender for many years with multiple league MVPs (Steve Nash, Charles Barkley). The Coyotes have never been a championship contender and only sniffed the playoffs a few times since they've been here. I don't know the stats but they have to be near or at the bottom in playoff appearances since they've been in Arizona.