OT: Arizona Coyotes Lounge XIV - Life, The Universe and “Marvel Studios kicks DC Comics’ ass.”

[rt]

They're good cars, but IMO there's not a lot of additional value-add in a Volvo that you can't get in other brands. And you'd pay a premium for the badging in service costs, etc., as mentioned above.

It sounds like you’d recommend skipping the luxury brands altogether? Hyundai over Genesis, Honda over Acura, Nissan over Infiniti, and Toyota over Lexus?

 

[The Feckless Puck]

It sounds like you’d recommend skipping the luxury brands altogether? Hyundai over Genesis, Honda over Acura, Nissan over Infiniti, and Toyota over Lexus?

Personal opinion, but you can get a totally maxed-out car for the same, or less, than you'd pay for a baseline luxury brand. The older I get, the more interested I am in value for the dollar, and the less interested I am in "prestige branding." Maybe if I were 20 years younger and still trying to attract some feminine eyeballs I might feel differently...

For me, it's wasted money to chase badging. If you can get a top of the line, full bells-and-whistles, Big Warranty Honda over a baseline Acura, you do it. The quality is not going to be substantively different. If I had to enumerate my priority chain, it'd be as follows: Driver Satisfaction > Reliability > Price Point > Trim Level >>>>>>>>>>>> Status Badge.

 

[rt]

This would be easier if I had some brand allegiance or more personal preferences.

I want a sedan. I want it to have solid head, shoulder, hip and leg room for the driver. I’d like it to be AWD and have some decent horsepower. I’d like it to have a good reputation.

I’m having a hard time zeroing in one something. Haha.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

This would be easier if I had some brand allegiance or more personal preferences.

I want a sedan. I want it to have solid head, shoulder, hip and leg room for the driver. I’d like it to be AWD and have some decent horsepower. I’d like it to have a good reputation.

I’m having a hard time zeroing in one something. Haha.

Have you looked at Subarus yet? Been a while since I test-drove one but if you want AWD, there's no brand that does it better.

 

[rt]

Have you looked at Subarus yet? Been a while since I test-drove one but if you want AWD, there's no brand that does it better.

The AWD is more for handling and less for off roading. I don’t expect to drive much on dirt.

 

[rt]

Didn’t realize suburu had a normal looking sedan. Great price too. Horsepower extremely disappontking. Have to look at trim levels.

 

[rt]

Once you get up to the 256hp model, a two-three year old Suburu Legacy with 20-28k miles seems to be pretty much right in the same price range as the AWD version of the Volvo S60 T5 model of the same age and mileage.

 

[ck26]

It sounds like you’d recommend skipping the luxury brands altogether? Hyundai over Genesis, Honda over Acura, Nissan over Infiniti, and Toyota over Lexus?

"These days, if you do basic maintenance, everything is reliable, everything is safe ... except the Smart Car. Smart Car is a piece of ****."
-Adam Carolla

 

[The Feckless Puck]

The AWD is more for handling and less for off roading. I don’t expect to drive much on dirt.

Subaru does have a great rep for rallying and offroading, but their AWD on their consumer cars is best-of-breed and has been for years. In fact, it's basically that brand's best selling point.

 

[Edenjung]

Subaru does have a great rep for rallying and offroading, but their AWD on their consumer cars is best-of-breed and has been for years. In fact, it's basically that brand's best selling point.

Subaru Impreza WRX ST. The BEST Rally car of all time (in my opinion)

Subaru is awesome.
Every car has 4 wheel drive and they are made to be tuned and durable.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

The AWD is more for handling and less for off roading. I don’t expect to drive much on dirt.

AWD is not for handling. Quite the opposite as most AWD sedans push 90% of the power to the front wheels and transfer power towards the rear when the front loses traction (like on a wet road).

You want rear wheel drive for handling. If you want power size and “handling” in a large car look at the Chrysler products.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

Subaru Impreza WRX ST. The BEST Rally car of all time (in my opinion)
Subaru is awesome.
Every car has 4 wheel drive and they are made to be tuned and durable.

My 2004 STi was black. Lotta fun for the 5-6 years I had it.

 

[Lilhoody]

This would be easier if I had some brand allegiance or more personal preferences.

I want a sedan. I want it to have solid head, shoulder, hip and leg room for the driver. I’d like it to be AWD and have some decent horsepower. I’d like it to have a good reputation.

I’m having a hard time zeroing in one something. Haha.

2017

Here's the 2017 IIHS list. The year to year changes are interesting.

 

[MIGs Dog]

AWD is not for handling. Quite the opposite as most AWD sedans push 90% of the power to the front wheels and transfer power towards the rear when the front loses traction (like on a wet road).

You want rear wheel drive for handling. If you want power size and “handling” in a large car look at the Chrysler products.

Agree. I have AWD for snow driving. If most of your driving is on valley of the sun asphalt it is completely unnecessary.

 

[cromag27]

volvo pre 1985 were tanks. after that, garbage. in 2010 (ish?) geely bought volvo from ford. geely is a chinese company. yup, hasn’t been a swedish company for a long time. the quality is nowhere near the same and as someone else mentioned, they’re trying to go all electric soon. this is a whole different disaster. really new technology and soon to be obsolete parts do not make a good combination. since you want one a few years old, i would say if you can get a really good deal on one that has been properly maintained, buy it only under the assumption it won’t last really long without costly repairs. and enjoy that depreciation!!!

subaru wrote the book on awd cars. having said that, subaru are expensive to fix and maintain, especially if you want it to last 100k+ miles. horrible transmissions unless it’s the 4cyl standard. i would never buy one.

automatic emergency braking (aeb) is a nice feature and can earn you a discount on your auto insurance. it’s also super expensive to fix.

What are your thoughts on Volvo? They seem to have a good reputation for reliability and especially for safety. They also seem to have AWD and decent turbo power available across platforms, which is interesting and a little unique.

Loved my Volvo. I didn't find it any less (or more) reliable than anything else I've owned, but the dealership was expensive when it did need work.

I had a S60 R design. Freakishly fast. Every bit as quick as my Z4 35i. A bit quirky. No automatic headlights as Volvo expects one to keep the low beams on all the time. Adaptive cruise was good on the highway, but unsatisfying on city streets as the acceleration from a stop was so very slow that it annoyed trailing cars. Automatic braking and pedestrian detection were terrific.

I think that Volvo is going full electric in a few years.

Like anything European, maintenance and repairs are a lot higher on Volvos. Doing the scheduled maintenance definitely helps, something most neglect.

It seems all manufacturers are putting so much technology into vehicles these days, any little problem becomes a huge expense. I've been thinking about getting a new truck for a while but even if I stick with Toyota which have simpler, more reliable platforms, you have to get all that lane departure and distance pacing safety ****. It takes special equipment just to do an alignment, something my company hasn't invested it yet, although it's coming eventually. But with the added equipment, something as simple as an alignment you should do a couple times a year is going way up in price. The price of vehicles will continue to climb with all the technology but where I think they will really get you is with maintenance plans you will almost have to get in the near future.

Volvos = great cars at an extremely inflated price.

I’m looking to buy a car that is two-ish years old, with 20ish thousand miles. It seems to level the playing field quite a bit.

They're good cars, but IMO there's not a lot of additional value-add in a Volvo that you can't get in other brands. And you'd pay a premium for the badging in service costs, etc., as mentioned above.

Subaru does have a great rep for rallying and offroading, but their AWD on their consumer cars is best-of-breed and has been for years. In fact, it's basically that brand's best selling point.

 

[cromag27]

awd vehicles are good in snow and rain. but there are so many drawbacks, i’d rather just get a fwd. awd cars have two transfer cases, so more to fix right their. there’s also less room in the engine compartment so it make make simple repairs a big hassle.

 

[cromag27]

some of my favorite cases to work are comp claims when someone hits an animal. yesterday i told someone since they hit a deer and totaled their car, this is now going to cost them money, and the comp claim is going to make their rate go up. he got pissed and insisted it was the deer’s fault and he shouldn’t have to pay or have anything on his record. so i made a deal with him. i agreed that if he could locate the deer, and we could find it financial responsible, i would agree to find it at fault. he got real silent.

 

[MIGs Dog]

some of my favorite cases to work are comp claims when someone hits an animal. yesterday i told someone since they hit a deer and totaled their car, this is now going to cost them money, and the comp claim is going to make their rate go up. he got pissed and insisted it was the deer’s fault and he shouldn’t have to pay or have anything on his record. so i made a deal with him. i agreed that if he could locate the deer, and we could find it financial responsible, i would agree to find it at fault. he got real silent.

Deer SHOULD be covered along with other acts of nature.

 

[cromag27]

Deer SHOULD be covered along with other acts of nature.

yeah, if you have comp which he did. he just didn’t want to pay his deductible. and he didn’t think the claim should go on his driving report. had to explain that’s the way insurance works with all companies. fault or no fault.

 

[Edenjung]

My 2004 STi was black. Lotta fun for the 5-6 years I had it.

If i could choose some secondary cars for me ( i won't give up my Golf IV, even though i had to do emergency repairs today with the exhaust [i will upload some picks ;D]) i would buy myself:

A Subaru Impreza WRX Sti (2004 model is very nice)
A Honda (Acura) NSX (old version)
A 1969 Ford Mustang

And a Nissan 240Sx (tuned like i had it back in NFS Underground 2 ;D)

That's about it
Really nice cars and they are afforable


But since the family of my now girlfriend owns a Lamboghini Diablo and Countach i am not that hyped for big fancy sports cars (too expansive).
But those are really nice, but i am not allowed to even touch them, so i will stick with affordable and usefull cras.

 

[rt]

volvo pre 1985 were tanks. after that, garbage. in 2010 (ish?) geely bought volvo from ford. geely is a chinese company. yup, hasn’t been a swedish company for a long time. the quality is nowhere near the same and as someone else mentioned, they’re trying to go all electric soon. this is a whole different disaster. really new technology and soon to be obsolete parts do not make a good combination. since you want one a few years old, i would say if you can get a really good deal on one that has been properly maintained, buy it only under the assumption it won’t last really long without costly repairs. and enjoy that depreciation!!!

subaru wrote the book on awd cars. having said that, subaru are expensive to fix and maintain, especially if you want it to last 100k+ miles. horrible transmissions unless it’s the 4cyl standard. i would never buy one.

automatic emergency braking (aeb) is a nice feature and can earn you a discount on your auto insurance. it’s also super expensive to fix.

You’ve got 20-25kay to spend on a sedan. What do you buy?

 

[Bonsai Tree]

automatic emergency braking (aeb) is a nice feature and can earn you a discount on your auto insurance. it’s also super expensive to fix.

AEB should be considered mandatory. It saves lives. It saved a kid on a bike when he jumped out in front of my Mazda. The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety ranks all cars for safety going back years.
iihs.org. Interestingly, Subarus and Mazdas had better ratings for their AEB than Volvos.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

You’ve got 20-25kay to spend on a sedan. What do you buy?

According to autobytel.com
10 Best Used Luxury Cars under $25,000

• 2011 Audi A8 L. The best used luxury cars under $25,000 include fullsize flagship sedans like the 2011 Audi A8. ...
• 2011 BMW 7 Series. Another of Germany's best used luxury cars under$25,000 is the 2011 BMW 7 Series. ...
• 2016 Cadillac XTS. ...
• 2013 Hyundai Equus. ...
• 2013 Infiniti M37. ...
• 2013 Jaguar XF. ...
• 2012 Lexus LS. ...
• 2014 Lincoln MKS.

I know that Jaguar has come a long way, but since I was a kid in the late 60's the word on Jaguar was to really enjoy a Jaguar you needed to have 2 of them because 1 was always going to be in the repair shop. Lexus, on the other hand, has Toyota quality and longevity.

 

[cromag27]

You’ve got 20-25kay to spend on a sedan. What do you buy?

camry, 4cyl standard trans.

 

[cromag27]

According to autobytel.com
10 Best Used Luxury Cars under $25,000

• 2011 Audi A8 L. The best used luxury cars under $25,000 include fullsize flagship sedans like the 2011 Audi A8. ...
• 2011 BMW 7 Series. Another of Germany's best used luxury cars under$25,000 is the 2011 BMW 7 Series. ...
• 2016 Cadillac XTS. ...
• 2013 Hyundai Equus. ...
• 2013 Infiniti M37. ...
• 2013 Jaguar XF. ...
• 2012 Lexus LS. ...
• 2014 Lincoln MKS.

I know that Jaguar has come a long way, but since I was a kid in the late 60's the word on Jaguar was to really enjoy a Jaguar you needed to have 2 of them because 1 was always going to be in the repair shop. Lexus, on the other hand, has Toyota quality and longevity.

well first of all, “best” is subjective. i don’t trust information from data collectors. autobytel gets their information from a company called chrome data. a lot of these companies are paid by dealerships, parts manufacturers and auto companies. this is also how jd power works!!!! they’re just big marketing firms.

i trust honest mechanics and others who work in the auto industry like myself (insurance). the problem is finding an honest mechanic. lol.