Are There Still Anti-Dundon Holdouts?

[My Special Purpose]

First, Dundon needed to sign Ferland or he'd lose a great deal of the fanbase.

Then, Dundon needed to make a move at the deadline or he wasn't serious about winning.

Then, Dundon didn't know what he was doing messing with Forslund and Tripp.

Then, Dundon couldn't be serious letting both of our goalies go to UFA.

Then, Dundon made a serious mistake letting Bales and Vellucci leave.

Then, Dundon was over his head with the Aho situation.

There's probably more. My question, is are there still people who don't trust this guy to do what's best for the organization?

Why?

Click to read more...

 

[tarheelhockey]

Were there really people who thought Dundon was the source of the problem with the goalie situation, Bales/Velucci leaving, or Aho getting offer sheeted?

I dunno, I didn't follow every thread that closely but I haven't seen anyone blame Dundon for these things.

 

[DougieSmash]

I'm tired of Vellucci honestly. I love the guy but we have Rod. It's not end of the world.

 

[MinJaBen]

I'm not anti-Dundon, but I'm not pro-Dundon either. I'm not going to come down either way definitively for a while.

 

[A Star is Burns]

I've been in his corner pretty much from day one. Doesn't mean I haven't questioned a thing or two here or there, but I'm a big fan of how most things have gone since he took over the team. If nothing else, it's usually damn entertaining.

 

[Svechhammer]

Dundon earned himself a shitload of leeway from me for just simply buying the team and putting an end to the constant QC bullshit.

Everything he's done since has lengthened the leash. As far as I'm concerned, we have one of the better ownership/management situations in the league right now, especially given the market.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Dundon earned himself a ****load of leeway from me for just simply buying the team and putting an end to the constant QC bull****.

Everything he's done since has lengthened the leash. As far as I'm concerned, we have one of the better ownership/management situations in the league right now, especially given the market.

Good point about the market and management being a really strong fit for each other. This market has certain strengths and weaknesses that don't align with traditional market dynamics. We needed someone who would come in and do some unconventional things to bring the best out of this market. It's occasionally been painful, but Dundon has generally had a pretty good sense of what needed to be done around here.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Good point about the market and management being a really strong fit for each other. This market has certain strengths and weaknesses that don't align with traditional market dynamics. We needed someone who would come in and do some unconventional things to bring the best out of this market. It's occasionally been painful, but Dundon has generally had a pretty good sense of what needed to be done around here.

The big thing, though, is that I think our market is very much like Nashville after they finally got stable ownership. Just win baby, and the fans will make sure that they will come. The excellent marketing since Dundon came over to our franchise hasn't hurt one bit, either.

 

[DaveG]

I was firmly anti Karmanos. Dundon I've been warming to significantly though still on the "let's see" wagon. Signing this gives him a shitload of leeway though.

 

[Svechhammer]

Good point about the market and management being a really strong fit for each other. This market has certain strengths and weaknesses that don't align with traditional market dynamics. We needed someone who would come in and do some unconventional things to bring the best out of this market. It's occasionally been painful, but Dundon has generally had a pretty good sense of what needed to be done around here.

As soon as he got his finger on the pulse of the Raleigh market, he's been knocking it out of the park when it comes to the decisions that have been made. And I seriously wouldn't be surprised if they sign the renovation proposal in the near future. I know he wanted a downtown arena, but he had to recognize the gold mine he has with the tailgate culture here, and how much that would die off downtown. If anything, there's an opportunity there to really capitalize on it, and I can't imagine he hasn't recognized it.

 

[tarheelhockey]

As soon as he got his finger on the pulse of the Raleigh market, he's been knocking it out of the park when it comes to the decisions that have been made. And I seriously wouldn't be surprised if they sign the renovation proposal in the near future. I know he wanted a downtown arena, but he had to recognize the gold mine he has with the tailgate culture here, and how much that would die off downtown. If anything, there's an opportunity there to really capitalize on it, and I can't imagine he hasn't recognized it.

If anything I could see him investing in properties around the current arena and then boosting for development which would make him gazillions while also creating a downtown-like district in that area (similar to what they're trying to do with the new soccer stadium).

 

[Svechhammer]

If anything I could see him investing in properties around the current arena and then boosting for development which would make him gazillions while also creating a downtown-like district in that area (similar to what they're trying to do with the new soccer stadium).

My only question is... where? Not that the area couldn't use a bit of development, but its tough with the fairgrounds and gov't owned land. We already saw how impossible it is to get that handed over during the MLS bid on Peace St.

 

[My Special Purpose]

Were there really people who thought Dundon was the source of the problem with the goalie situation, Bales/Velucci leaving, or Aho getting offer sheeted?

I dunno, I didn't follow every thread that closely but I haven't seen anyone blame Dundon for these things.

I think those fall under the "Dundon is so cheap" umbrella.

I'm not anti-Dundon, but I'm not pro-Dundon either. I'm not going to come down either way definitively for a while.

What's it gonna take, brother?

 

[SlavinAway]

This team has been nothing but fun since Dundon and the GM borg took over.

 

[CandyCanes]

If anything I could see him investing in properties around the current arena and then boosting for development which would make him gazillions while also creating a downtown-like district in that area (similar to what they're trying to do with the new soccer stadium).

I've always thought that they could redevelop one or two of the parking lots around the arena and build a row of development that leads up to the arena that includes restaurants/bars. They could always build a parking deck or two to replace those spots.

 

[tarheelhockey]

My only question is... where? Not that the area couldn't use a bit of development, but its tough with the fairgrounds and gov't owned land. We already saw how impossible it is to get that handed over during the MLS bid on Peace St.

Centennial Authority is based around the idea of public/private development. Look at how NC State's Centennial Campus is filling out with apartments and offices going in -- that stuff is all managed by third parties.

If someone can convince them to go in on a development plan with the land they own around the stadium and arena, that's how it fills in. It would likely be a matter of converting some of the parking lots to deck spaces and then using the space savings to insert revenue generators like restaurants and apartments.

(looks like @CandyCanes had the same thought above)

 

[Svechhammer]

I've always thought that they could redevelop one or two of the parking lots around the arena and build a row of development that leads up to the arena that includes restaurants/bars. They could always build a parking deck or two to replace those spots.

Centennial Authority is based around the idea of public/private development. Look at how NC State's Centennial Campus is filling out with apartments and offices going in -- that stuff is all managed by third parties.

If someone can convince them to go in on a development plan with the land they own around the stadium and arena, that's how it fills in. It would likely be a matter of converting some of the parking lots to deck spaces and then using the space savings to insert revenue generators like restaurants and apartments.

(looks like @CandyCanes had the same thought above)

Agreed but.... One of the big draws of the current location is the way the community has embraced and merged the tailgating scene into what we do. You start taking away parking or putting up a deck, you risk significantly hampering that ability down the line, fundamentally changing the natural culture that has been created.

 

[BrindAmours Army]

I'm also really confused as to why people think Dundon is worth $1.1 billion. That number is old.

Dundon's net worth was estimated by Forbes to be $1.1 billion in September 2015.

Dundon invested in TopGolf in 2011 and is the majority shareholder, and it has seen massive growth since 2015 (28-55 locations). As of late 2017, it was valued at a little over $2 billion. So as a majority shareholder, Tom has at least $1 billion of net worth in TopGolf.

In November 2017, Dundon got a bit over $700 million from Santander (hello Hurricanes + AAF fund?).

So, right there we have $1.7 billion as of late 2017, and that's assuming he had no investments outside of TopGolf and that he had no other wealth outside of what he got with the Santander deal.

Considering the S&P has gone up 51%(41% after inflation) since September 2015, I'm guessing Dundon's net worth is well above even that.

 

[SlavinAway]

I'm also really confused as to why people think Dundon is worth $1.1 billion. That number is old.

Dundon's net worth was estimated by Forbes to be $1.1 billion in September 2015.

Dundon invested in TopGolf in 2011 and is the majority shareholder, and it has seen massive growth since 2015 (28-55 locations). As of late 2017, it was valued at a little over $2 billion. So as a majority shareholder, Tom has at least $1 billion of net worth in TopGolf.

In November 2017, Dundon got a bit over $700 million from Santander (hello Hurricanes + AAF fund?).

So, right there we have $1.7 billion, and that's assuming he has no investments outside of TopGolf (ignoring the Canes for this), that TopGolf's valuation is the same as it was in December 2017, and that he has no other wealth outside of what he got with the Santander deal.

Considering the S&P has gone up 51%(41% after inflation) since September 2015, I'm guessing Dundon's net worth is well above even that.

Cha-Ching $$$$$$$

 

[Svechhammer]

I'm also really confused as to why people think Dundon is worth $1.1 billion. That number is old.

Dundon's net worth was estimated by Forbes to be $1.1 billion in September 2015.

Dundon invested in TopGolf in 2011 and is the majority shareholder, and it has seen massive growth since 2015 (28-55 locations). As of late 2017, it was valued at a little over $2 billion. So as a majority shareholder, Tom has at least $1 billion of net worth in TopGolf.

In November 2017, Dundon got a bit over $700 million from Santander (hello Hurricanes + AAF fund?).

So, right there we have $1.7 billion, and that's assuming he has no investments outside of TopGolf (ignoring the Canes for this), that TopGolf's valuation is the same as it was in December 2017, and that he has no other wealth outside of what he got with the Santander deal.

Considering the S&P has gone up 51%(41% after inflation) since September 2015, I'm guessing Dundon's net worth is well above even that.

$1.1b is what he says he is worth. As you said, the reality is likely far higher.

I mean, I highly doubt he was allocating 25% of his entire net worth to a failing football league last year right after using another 25%-50% to purchase the Canes. He's got more money than we think.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Agreed but.... One of the big draws of the current location is the way the community has embraced and merged the tailgating scene into what we do. You start taking away parking or putting up a deck, you risk significantly hampering that ability down the line, fundamentally changing the natural culture that has been created.

I don't think developing every single lot is in question. But it would be possible to reduce the number of lots without really losing the tailgate areas, especially if you target some of the more far-flung areas which are only filled a few times a year. The vibe would be much more exciting, and the Authority would make way more money, if those were apartments over restaurants or bars. And people would just plan on parking in a surface lot if they wanted to tailgate.

 

[BrindAmours Army]

$1.1b is what he says he is worth. As you said, the reality is likely far higher.

I mean, I highly doubt he was allocating 25% of his entire net worth to a failing football league last year right after using another 25%-50% to purchase the Canes. He's got more money than we think.

Oh has he said if? If so, I definitely missed it.

 

[Svechhammer]

I don't think developing every single lot is in question. But it would be possible to reduce the number of lots without really losing the tailgate areas, especially if you target some of the more far-flung areas which are only filled a few times a year. The vibe would be much more exciting, and the Authority would make way more money, if those were apartments over restaurants or bars. And people would just plan on parking in a surface lot if they wanted to tailgate.

Yeah I'm all for creating a funnel effect between Carter Finley and the PNC Arena. Some of the other areas that have built up infrastructure creating basically a city block of entertainment right outside an arena are exceptional venues and I'm all for the Canes to try that out. Do it well enough and it could be like XFinity Live in Philly where people gather in the middle of nowhere for games, but this time its actually a part of the venues. For Canes and State games that would be an exceptional location, especially once NC passes the legalization of alcohol sales in collegiate venues.

 

[SlavinAway]

$1.1b is what he says he is worth.

Maybe that's just his dicking around money he's talking about.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Kept John and Tripp
Kept Aho
Flexed over the Canadian media.

What’s not to like?