Speculation: Are Sabres a worse team as of now, then last season?

[struckbyaparkedcar]

What place did we finish with RoR? Do you think we will finish farther down the standings without RoR?

Didn't think so either.

So going from O'Reilly to Berglund and Sobotka will make us better?

Didn't think so.

 

[EichHart]

We're no longer and 2 line team and dumped the locker room issues which is huge in sports. (ROR, Lehner)

I think we're a better team overall. Last year we had 2 lines producing, the bottom 2 lines were completely useless. Now we can roll out 3-4 decent lines with actual NHL players.

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

We could give Eichel away for free, can't get worse right?

 

[Montag DP]

I still can't fathom that we gave up two of our top five best players in Kane and O'Reilly for presumed late 1st round picks, a couple third line veterans, and just a decent prospect.

Kane was a deadline rental with character issues who was bad defensively and played to pad his stats 90% of the time. I don't understand why people still think we didn't get good value for him.

 

[Dahlin 2 Eichel]

Team? No.

Collection of names people like? Sure.

This

 

[WpgBuffan]

Better. They will finish with 85 points.

 

[Zman5778]

So going from O'Reilly to Berglund and Sobotka will make us better?

Didn't think so.

It's not impossible that we're a better team next year than last. Look at the Bills -- no way were the Bills more inherently talented in 2017 than in 2016. Yet, they were actually a better TEAM.

This trade COULD (emphasis: COULD) have a similar effect. Time will tell.

 

[Der Jaeger]

The answer to this question has nothing to do with the names on the roster or lines/pairs on the ice.

It's got everything to do with what's going to happen in the locker room. We won't know that for a while.

 

[La Cosa Nostra]

Yep. 80-85 points while actually being competitive. 19-20 is when we are a playoff team. By then Botts will have filled in another top 6 winger/top 4 D.

I cant wait to see RoRs mins distributed to casey jack etc. We may actually not finish dfl in goals now. Ror is a 60 point forward if you give him top 10 ice time among all forwards. Give ror 17 mins a game and hes a 50 point player.

 

[stokes84]

 

[valet]

we're going to be significantly better

 

[goach]

I get it, and I know we need to make changes to our 31st placed team and one that has been in the gutter for like 6 years. I just don't like the return. You can't give up the only guys who score and are borderline 1st line players for 3rd liners and very late 1st round draft picks

Spreading out the responsibility. Future assets. I'd love to have acquired a dman . But a lot of good dmen require forward help. Which I think we acquired!

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

It's not impossible that we're a better team next year than last. Look at the Bills -- no way were the Bills more inherently talented in 2017 than in 2016. Yet, they were actually a better TEAM.

This trade COULD (emphasis: COULD) have a similar effect. Time will tell.

The Bills secondary last season was a position of strength unlike anything under the Ryan years, and were uncommonly healthy.

Jason Botterill has done nothing to identify or assemble any talent group on that level. Berglund and Sobotka are f***ing terrible at whatever role you want them to fill. You could have replaced them with Ryan O'Reilly and still got all the good young players and more likable goaltending that might make us marginally less garbage this season.

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

A lot of people are getting really excited to be better in the same way Montreal was after trading Subban.

 

[Zman5778]

The Bills secondary last season was a position of strength unlike anything under the Ryan years, and were uncommonly healthy.

Jason Botterill has done nothing to identify or assemble any talent group on that level. Berglund and Sobotka are ****ing terrible at whatever role you want them to fill. You could have replaced them with Ryan O'Reilly and still got all the good young players and more likable goaltending that might make us marginally less garbage this season.

I feel like you're dismissing the culture/dynamic/whateveryouwanttocallit thing out of hand because it can't be quantified or proven.

Say what you will about their talent/role -- what's basically unquestioned from all Blues/Penguins fans is that Sheary, Berglund, Sobotka and Hutton are all no-quit, all-work guys who are fantastic people and fantastic in the locker room. You certainly can't say that about Kane and Lehner......and its looking like ROR as well.

If the team becomes a TEAM and not a collection of individuals.

Of course, this could all be horse-**** and we're terrible.

 

[darcyRegier]

The Bills secondary last season was a position of strength unlike anything under the Ryan years, and were uncommonly healthy.

Jason Botterill has done nothing to identify or assemble any talent group on that level. Berglund and Sobotka are ****ing terrible at whatever role you want them to fill. You could have replaced them with Ryan O'Reilly and still got all the good young players and more likable goaltending that might make us marginally less garbage this season.

Getting the amount of turnovers from the secondary that they got was huge. Tre White's a stud as well

But you're very very wrong on Berglund and Sobotka...both are very good 3rd liners that will compete 100% shift in and shift out.

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

I feel like you're dismissing the culture/dynamic/whateveryouwanttocallit thing out of hand because it can't be quantified or proven.

Say what you will about their talent/role -- what's basically unquestioned from all Blues/Penguins fans is that Sheary, Berglund, Sobotka and Hutton are all no-quit, all-work guys who are fantastic people and fantastic in the locker room. You certainly can't say that about Kane and Lehner......and its looking like ROR as well.

If the team becomes a TEAM and not a collection of individuals.

Of course, this could all be horse-**** and we're terrible.

We could have all the things that might make us better next season and Ryan O'Reilly, but instead we have two dogshit hockey players.

 

[haseoke39]

Probably worse.

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

Getting the amount of turnovers from the secondary that they got was huge. Tre White's a stud as well

But you're very very wrong on Berglund and Sobotka...both are very good 3rd liners that will compete 100% shift in and shift out.

I did a giant deep dive on Sobotka earlier this season: he's f***ing terrible, so is Berglund.

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

For reference, Sobotka is worse than Komarov, who was consensus totally washed.

 

[Montag DP]

This is what building through the draft looks like. It's unlikely we're going to be world-beaters next year, but if you can fix the environment to allow Eichel, Reinhart, Mittelstadt, Dahlin, etc., to learn to win the right way, we will be a really good team 3 years from now.

At least, that seems to be the vision, though of course it's far from a sure thing to succeed, and it sucks that we're still at this point 5 years into the rebuild. From Botts' perspective, O'Reilly was part of the culture problem and would be getting up in age by the time we plan to contend anyway.

 

[SabresFan26]

Martin Biron eluded to this as well. ROR had a ton of points on the PP and his skating isn’t good enough to cover elite players.

With all of the skill we have now, our specials will be better and people will fill this PP points.

 

[goach]

So going from O'Reilly to Berglund and Sobotka will make us better?

Didn't think so.

Going from O'Reilly and Larsson to Berglund / Sobotka / futures definitely did!

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

Michael Ferlund was a better ES scorer than Jack Eichel, quick, call up the Canes.

 

[pigpen65]

Easily better and way way more watchable. At least now the team resembles something of a work in progress instead of just a rusted old shit box spinning its wheels in mud.