Andrei Svechnikov vs Brady Tkachuk

[jbeck5]

Why was Svechnikov (102 hits in 50 games) compared with Laine (32 hits in 41 games) then?

Tkachuk is an old school power forward. Svechnikov is a new school power forward. He's not a big hitter or fighter, but he has the willingness to drive the net consistently, works his butt off along the boards, and plays with an edge. For those that watch him play regularly, using intangibles as an argument against him is odd.

Funny enough, svech is closer to Laine in hits on the year than he is to tkachuk.

Perhaps Laine was brought up in hyperbole to show how drastically different tkachuk and svech are physically.

 

[sdf]

I wonder if svechnikovs is 100% brothers. One is pretty and another... well, he is better not smile much

 

[GoldiFox]

Exactly. Just looking at hits and fights and you know they don't play close to the same way.

I've never seen a player get twice as many hits as another and think they play close to the same way. It's very evident to the people that pay attention when one is hitting everything that moves and going to war and the other one isn't.

It's like comparing Chris Kelly to Mike Fisher because they both were 200ft 3C with leadership and were similar height.

But any sens fan would tell you Fisher played a much more physical game hence having way more hits and fights.

I've now seen Svechnikov compared to Patrik Laine and Chris Kelly and I'm honestly wondering if you guys have ever seen Svechnikov actually play.

I agree with your assessment individually of Tkachuk and it is confusing why you and others are not willing to assign any of those traits to Svechnikov despite him visually showing all of them game-after-game and winning team awards for them.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Why was Svechnikov (102 hits in 50 games) compared with Laine (32 hits in 41 games) then?

Tkachuk is an old school power forward. Svechnikov is a new school power forward. He's not a big hitter or fighter, but he has the willingness to drive the net consistently, works his butt off along the boards, and plays with an edge. For those that watch him play regularly, using intangibles as an argument against him is odd.

It's only an argument against him in the context of comparing him to Tkachuk. Similarly, Tkachuk is a g playmaker, but its not unfair to say that Svech is good bit impactful on that front currently.

 

[TkachukMyAho]

Yeah I know. Always found it funny though.

Yeah he certainly has work to do with his edges. It's not even about how much he falls down, it's how he does it. It's like a full on garage sale fall when he hits the deck.

 

[jbeck5]

I've now seen Svechnikov compared to Patrik Laine and Chris Kelly and I'm honestly wondering if you guys have ever seen Svechnikov actually play.

I agree with your assessment individually of Tkachuk and it is confusing why you and others are not willing to assign any of those traits to Svechnikov despite him visually showing all of them game-after-game and winning team awards for them.

Wait...you thought I was comparing svechnikov to Chris Kelly?

Did you not see me bring up Fisher. I was saying svechnikov to tkachuk physically is like Kelly to Fisher physically.

I'm surprised you didn't understand that reference...

 

[CatchyTune]

Honestly, i think Svechnikov has showed more offensive potential early on in his career, but i think Brady has more untapped potential left in him that he hasnt been able to show on a crappy Ottawa team.

Brady is a true, mean, menace to play against, while also producing at a respectable rate offensively. Svechnikov outscored him last year by a lot, but this year its very close and Svechnikov has more to work with on a very good Carolina team. And i also think Tkachuk brings more than Svechnikov when it comes to things other than scoring.

Right now i would take Tkachuk, last year it would have been Svech. and it can change again given how early on we are in these 2 careers'.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

It's only an argument against him in the context of comparing him to Tkachuk. Similarly, Tkachuk is a g playmaker, but its not unfair to say that Svech is good bit impactful on that front currently.

That was in reference to that goofy Laine comparison. If you want to pick Tkachuk because you value hitting and fighting, that's fine. Just don't try to make Svechnikov into something he isn't for the purpose of making the differentiation between the two larger. Svechnikov is not a finesse player.

 

[GoldiFox]

Wait...you thought I was comparing svechnikov to Chris Kelly?

Did you not see me bring up Fisher. I was saying svechnikov to tkachuk physically is like Kelly to Fisher physically.

I'm surprised you didn't understand that reference...

You weren't comparing Svechnikov and Kelly? You were just using Kelly as a direct comparison to Svechnikov and comparing him to Fischer who you describe as a direct comparison to Brady Tkachuk in physicality? wut?

I'll put it another way. Svechnikov and Matthew Tkachuk play very similarly as well and produce the same amount of hits. I like Matthew even better as a direct comparable. I think Brady Tkachuk plays pretty similarly as well and all three are among the top young power forwards in today's game. Take that how you like.

It would be impossible to have an "intangibles" measuring contest when fans rarely watch the other player for more than a few games a year. We can be sure however that both Brady and Svechnikov have high-end "intangibles" as both have been praised both internally and externally.

 

[jbeck5]

You weren't comparing Svechnikov and Kelly? You were just using Kelly as a direct comparison to Svechnikov and comparing him to Fischer who you describe as a direct comparison to Brady Tkachuk in physicality? wut?

I'll put it another way. Svechnikov and Matthew Tkachuk play very similarly as well and produce the same amount of hits. I like Matthew even better as a direct comparable. I think Brady Tkachuk plays pretty similarly as well and all three are among the top young power forwards in today's game. Take that how you like.

It would be impossible to have an "intangibles" measuring contest when fans rarely watch the other player for more than a few games a year. We can be sure however that both Brady and Svechnikov have high-end "intangibles" as both have been praised both internally and externally.

Why are you so confused by:

Kelly is to Fisher like svechnikov is to tkachuk in physicality.

If you think that is comparing Kelly directly to svechnikov you're very wrong.

I'm comparing the difference in physicality between Kelly and Fisher to the difference in physicality between svechnikov and tkachuk.

It's like saying 100 is to 50 like 20 is to 10. That does not mean I'm comparing 50 to 10. I'm comparing the fact that one doubles the other.

Do you understand now how I was not directly comparing Kelly to svechnikov?

Maybe this is an English barrier, I can try explaining in french, but it's simple math regardless of the language.

 

[GoldiFox]

Why are you so confused by:

Kelly is to Fisher like svechnikov is to tkachuk in physicality.

If you think that is comparing Kelly directly to svechnikov you're very wrong.

I'm comparing the difference in physicality between Kelly and Fisher to the difference in physicality between svechnikov and tkachuk.

It's like saying 100 is to 50 like 20 is to 10. That does not mean I'm comparing 50 to 10. I'm comparing the fact that one doubles the other.

Do you understand now how I was not directly comparing Kelly to svechnikov?

Maybe this is an English barrier, I can try explaining in french, but it's simple math regardless of the language.

You are still just not understanding that comparing Svechnikov physically to Kelly sounds as dumb as comparing Svechnikov stylistically to Laine. It sounds like someone who has never watched him actually play a full game.

 

[jbeck5]

You are still just not understanding that comparing Svechnikov physically to Kelly sounds as dumb as comparing Svechnikov stylistically to Laine. It sounds like someone who has never watched him actually play a full game.

I didn't compare them physically.

I compared the difference physically between him and tkachuk to the difference physically between two other players that are drastically different physically.

Can't believe you're still not understanding the that the comparison isn't between any specific players , but is in between the gaps.

Comparing the gaps, not the players. Geez. Now don't go saying I compared him to Kelly when I've clearly explained how I didn't compare them.

 

[jbeck5]

Saying Chris Kelly is to Mike Fisher like svechnikov is to tkachuk is not even close to comparing svechnikov with Kelly. Just like I'm not comparing tkachuk with Fisher. Pay attention when you're reading.

 

[Korpse]

You are still just not understanding that comparing Svechnikov physically to Kelly sounds as dumb as comparing Svechnikov stylistically to Laine. It sounds like someone who has never watched him actually play a full game.

You think Mike Fisher compare physically to Brady Tkachuk?

 

[GoldiFox]

I didn't compare them physically.

I compared the difference physically between him and tkachuk to the difference physically between two other players that are drastically different physically.

Can't believe you're still not understanding the that the comparison isn't between any specific players , but is in between the gaps.

Comparing the gaps, not the players. Geez. Now don't go saying I compared him to Kelly when I've clearly explained how I didn't compare them.

You are asking me to compare the gaps in your subjective analysis of two players from half a decade ago that you've watched 20x more of than I have because I follow a different team?

In both cases of Tkachuk and Fischer you describe then in the exact same way. A player who "goes to war" for his team, hits, and fights. Is that not what you think the difference is between Svechnikov and Tkachuk? Is that not the correlation you were going for with your simile? A player who will "go to war" or not sounds pretty black and white so I don't see the gaps. And my point would be that how you describe Tkachuk also applies to Svechnikov. I've already said at the start that Brady is a bit meaner and a bit more physical. Very similar otherwise.

 

[jbeck5]

You are asking me to compare the gaps in your subjective analysis of two players from half a decade ago that you've watched 20x more of than I have because I follow a different team?

In both cases of Tkachuk and Fischer you describe then in the exact same way. A player who "goes to war" for his team, hits, and fights. Is that not what you think the difference is between Svechnikov and Tkachuk? Is that not the correlation you were going for with your simile? A player who will "go to war" or not sounds pretty black and white so I don't see the gaps. And my point would be that how you describe Tkachuk also applies to Svechnikov. I've already said at the start that Brady is a bit meaner and a bit more physical. Very similar otherwise.

No, I was comparing how much they hit and fight.

Tkachuk will hit and fight much more than svechnikov just like Fisher will hit and fight much more than Chris Kelly.

Saying all of that, I understand that svechnikov hits more than Kelly just like tkachuk hits more than Fisher. I was just comparing the gaps/differences.

 

[GoldiFox]

No, I was comparing how much they hit and fight.

Tkachuk will hit and fight much more than svechnikov just like Fisher will hit and fight much more than Chris Kelly.

Saying all of that, I understand that svechnikov hits more than Kelly just like tkachuk hits more than Fisher. I was just comparing the gaps/differences.

I agree that Brady Tkachuk produces 1-2 more hits per game and also fights sometimes.

As far as being ready to "go to war" or for individual intensity, I think it is mutually complimentary to compare the two. Svechnikov's last two Playoffs ended with 1) pissing off Ovechkin so much that he caved in Andrei's face and 2) a knee injury while battling Chara for the net-front.

 

[jbeck5]

I agree that Brady Tkachuk produces 1-2 more hits per game and also fights sometimes.

As far as being ready to "go to war" or for individual intensity, I think it is mutually complimentary to compare the two. Svechnikov's last two Playoffs ended with 1) pissing off Ovechkin so much that he caved in Andrei's face and 2) a knee injury while battling Chara for the net-front.

Basically, someone said svech and tkachuk play the same way. I was trying to say that though there are similarities, tkachuk is drastically more physical.

I'm saying Kelly and Fisher would both go to war. Both are leaders. Both defensively responsible. They have a lot of similarities but don't play the same game simply because Fisher is drastically more physical.

 

[Agent Zub]

100 pts a season is pure homer fantasy sure it could happen but unlikely

100 points is hard but 80 points with a perhaps a sprinkle of 90 is basically set in stone for Svechnikov. And who knows perhaps 100 in a career year.

You really need to watch more Svechnikov, he's really that good.

 

[GoldiFox]

...tkachuk is drastically more physical.

This is the hyperbole at issue.

If Tkachuk and Svechnikov go into the corner for a 100% physical based board battle 100 times, Svechnikov is taking 50 of those pucks. So saying that Tkachuk is "drastically" more physical either has a different definition to you or I.

 

[tarheelhockey]

This whole thing about physicality is completely beside the point. Svechnikov is not some non-physical player. He's third on his team in hits, and top-30 among all forwards, which makes the Laine comparison completely insane prima facie.

I would completely agree that when Svechnikov is having a down-year and doing things like fanning on an ENG shot (like he did last night) then you can look at what Tkachuk's physicality as a difference-maker between them. But when Svechnikov is out there in 40-goal mode, he has enough physicality that it offsets a good chunk of what Tkachuk brings while being on a completely different level offensively.

 

[CanadienShark]

Brady is such a rare type of player, but I'm taking Meesta Svechnikov on this one.

 

[jbeck5]

This whole thing about physicality is completely beside the point. Svechnikov is not some non-physical player. He's third on his team in hits, and top-30 among all forwards, which makes the Laine comparison completely insane prima facie.

I would completely agree that when Svechnikov is having a down-year and doing things like fanning on an ENG shot (like he did last night) then you can look at what Tkachuk's physicality as a difference-maker between them. But when Svechnikov is out there in 40-goal mode, he has enough physicality that it offsets a good chunk of what Tkachuk brings while being on a completely different level offensively.

I think the talk of physicality ramped up more because someone said they play the same way, not because people see physicality as more valuable than extra offense.

Most people would rather have svechnikov but most people can also admit that tkachuk is on another level in terms of physicality that means they don't play the same style of game.

I don't think it's people overstating the value of physicality as much as it is people rebuttaling the comment that they play the same style.

 

[jbeck5]

This is the hyperbole at issue.

If Tkachuk and Svechnikov go into the corner for a 100% physical based board battle 100 times, Svechnikov is taking 50 of those pucks. So saying that Tkachuk is "drastically" more physical either has a different definition to you or I.

Even if that was true, doesn't mean they play the same style of game, which is what I've been getting at this whole time.

Erik Karlsson could go into the corner for a loose puck against Chris Neil and leave with the puck 90/100 with his superior puck skills..doesn't make his game anywhere near Neil's in terms of physical presence...

 

[SotasicA]