All-Time No-Trophy Team

[Derick*]

We talk a lot about players who were really great but never got X-trophy because of the competition, so let's make a team of them.

Who are the best players of all time without any of the following trophies: Hart, Art Ross, Norris, Vezina, Conn Smythe, Selke?

If you want to eliminate some of the trophies to make your team (say, only count Hart, or only count Hart/Norris/Vezina), that's cool, but I ask that if you deviate from the list in the second paragraph that you make it clear you've done so.

20-player, 6-player, it's all fun. Who's the best player of all time without those?

I don't know enough about hockey history to do this. The first player to come to mind for me is Brad Park. For a list only counting Hart/Norris/Vezina/ArtRoss, Yzerman would be a good candidate for first line center I think (he has a Selke and Smythe). Even if you can't make a team, I'd be interested in hearing what players pop into mind for you.

Another interesting question might be a list for current players.

Edit/Note:
- A lot of players played before that trophy existed (e.g. Shore) or had their career/prime outside the NHL (e.g. Tretiak) so it should go without saying that they're not included. Please don't include them without specifying that you did so.
- You can set the criteria (i.e. what trophies they have to have not gotten) however you want. I just made the thread because the subject is interesting to me. It's not a contest or competition that needs exact rules. The only problem is people not knowing what your criteria is. So for clarity, I think it'd be better that people not using the list I gave (Hart, Art Ross, Norris, Vezina, Conn Smythe, Selke) to specify what list of trophies they're using, whether they removed or added some.

Click to read more...

 

[Fredrik_71]

There are a lot of guys out there who should have won thropies (or Cups). I start of with a d-man, Salming. The competition killed him with Orr, Potvin, Robinsson, Langway etc. having peak years.

/Cheers

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Park - Stevens in my pick on D if you are only counting regular season awards.

If you count the Conn Smythe, then Park - Salming is my pick for D.

I assume we mean players actually eligible for awards, otherwise Shore is the best guy to not win the Norris by a good margin

 

[Derick*]

Park - Stevens in my pick on D if you are only counting regular season awards.

If you count the Conn Smythe, then Park - Salming is my pick for D.

I assume we mean players actually eligible for awards, otherwise Shore is the best guy to not win the Norris by a good margin

Haha, that reminds me of the guy who asked who the best player ever not to be drafted was and the first reply was "Gretzky, maybe Orr."

 

[ColdSteel2]

Mike Gartner RW

708 Goals, 627 Assists

No award or trophy of any kind ever. No postseason allstar teams. No SCF appearances.

I think he'd be the captain.

 

[Teemu]

First Blackhawk that immediately comes to mind is Denis Savard

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Here's some names I thought of quickly. I'm not including players that had their primes outside the NHL or before their trophies were around.

Forwards: Henri Richard, Peter Stastny, Alex Delvecchio, Teemu Selanne, Ron Francis, Doug Gilmour, Johnny Bucyk, Gilbert Perreault, Denis Savard, Jari Kurri

Defenseman: Brad Park, Tim Horton, Mark Howe, Borje Salming, Bill Gadsby, Guy Lapointe

Goaltenders: Mike Richter (only going by the modern version of the Vezina)

Edit: Horton and Gadsby did play a few years before the Norris, but neither had any All-Star selections in those years, so I figured it would be safe to say they wouldn't have won one.

 

[begbeee]

Does Calder count? Or Lady Byng?

If no, then Stastny has good chance to be a first line center, maybe Oates.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Can't believe I forgot Jari Kurri. He's a lock for the team. I will add him to my original list

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Add Guy Lapointe as a Dman too.

 

[begbeee]

Cam Neely is a lock, too. Of course if Masterton doesnt count.

 

[begbeee]

D: Larry Murphy
F: Pat LaFontaine

G:Vachon

 

[reckoning]

From the post-expansion era I'd pick Adam Oates, Guy Lapointe and Darryl Sittler. I'm limiting this to players who never won any NHL individual awards whatsoever, so that leaves out Jean Ratelle (Pearson in '72) and Mark Howe (I think he got a trophy for leading in +/- in '86).

From the Original 6 era I'd go with Tim Horton and Norm Ullman, though it's possible that they may have won a Conn Smythe if the award existed a few years earlier. I was going to take Henri Richard, but forgot that he won the Masterton.

And of course there's lots of choices from the pre-Original 6 days when there weren't many individual Awards around: Clancy, LaLonde, Conacher, etc.

 

[MXD]

- Disregarding the D-Mens prior to the Norris


G : If eligible, Vachon (won the Vezina as the back-up in the "old definition"). If not, Alec Connell

D :Tim Horton, Brad Park
LW : Frank Mahovlich. If not eligible (he won the Calder), Bucyk. If not eligible (he won the Bing)... I don't know. Blake is not eligible. So... humm... Busher Jackson? He would have a Art Ross (but the award didn't exist back then). If not, Michel Goulet (I think).
C : Stastny. If not eligible (he won the Calder), Henri Richard. If not eligible (he won the Masterton), Adam Oates.
RW : Bill Cook. If not eligible (led the league in points)... mann... Neely?

Interesting question that has to be "reformulated".

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

I'll try to make an actual lineup out of this...

F. Mahovlich - Stastny - Selanne
Delvecchio - H. Richard - Kurri
Bucyk - D. Savard/Perreault - Neely
? - Modano - ?

Park - Horton
Gadsby - Salming
Howe - LaPointe

Richter
?


Tried to keep players at positions they actually played. I took a little liberty with Francis, but I believe he played the LW when he was on a line with Lemieux and Jagr. Couldn't decide between Perreault and D. Savard, but that's probably my Chicago bias. There are a lot of good centers that you could have on the 4th line, but I though Gilmour would fill that role best. I couldn't think of who the last two wingers could be. Anyone got any help? I'm sure I'm missing someone obvious...

Edit: Forgot about F. Mahovlich...thanks for the help MXD, just need one more and a backup goalie

Edit #2: Forgot about Glimour's and Francis' Selke, back down to 2 open winger spots.

 

[begbeee]

I think Selanne won a major award - Richard Trophy.

 

[begbeee]

Francis won multiple Byngs, Selke and Masterton.

We need clear rules!

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Richard, Byng, Calder, and Masterton were not on the original list of trophies, which I agree with. I do think Lindsay/Pearson should be included though.

Francis' Selke does disqualify him. I will adjust my lineup

 

[begbeee]

Adjust one more time, Gilmour won Selke, too.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Adjust one more time, Gilmour won Selke, too.

Haha, don't know where my head is today...

 

[begbeee]

You can put Hawerchuk somewhere, maybe Robitaille or Shanahan. Bossy?!

D´s: Zubov, Gary Suter, maybe James Patrick to add some veteranship.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

You can put Hawerchuk somewhere, maybe Robitaille or Shanahan. Bossy?!

D´s: Zubov, Gary Suter, maybe James Patrick to add some veteranship.

Bossy won a Smythe. How about Bure? I can't bring myself to put Robitaille on there. Maybe Shanny, Kariya, Gillies?

 

[JackSlater]

non Hart team:

Lindsay Yzerman Bossy
Moore Dionne Cook
Mahovlich Richard Conacher
Jackson Stastny Kurri

Harvey Bourque
Potvin Lidstrom
Kelly Park

Roy
Sawchuk

Not surprisingly the non-Hart team defence is much better than the Hart team defence. Left Wings are arguably better too.

 

[begbeee]

Robitaille is not good choice, agree, but I would like Shanny somewhere... I would pick Bure, too, but in history section of HFboards he is not too much loved.

I throw some goalies: Vachon, Khabibulin, Vokoun..

Maybe Burke, Osgood.. Hmm. Rather not

 

[Derick*]

Francis won multiple Byngs, Selke and Masterton.

We need clear rules!

These are the trophies: Hart, Art Ross, Norris, Vezina, Conn Smythe, Selke

It's just a thread topic, if you want to make a list or mention players based on a different list of trophies, it would be stupid for me to try to say you can't, but please either use that list or specify that you've changed so we're not all confusing eachother